Karagin
01/27/05 12:04 PM
65.129.164.86
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Okay I had a discussion between two players over in Iraq about which was better, the Gauss or the LRM15.
The guy who was all for the Gauss was keen on the range, heat and solid 15 damage hit.
Where as the LRM guy was keen on the idea that the LRM can use other warheads (ammo), has the chance to use Art IV and can also use TAG if using the laser guided ammo. Range he felt was equal to the Gauss and given that you can fire indirect the LRM 15 had more to offer then Gauss.
So while I like both, I thought we could look at this ourselves and see what the board thinks about this and maybe see who likes what.
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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SSFSX17
01/27/05 02:43 PM
128.195.64.90
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So, um... what kind of stats did you guys write up for the LRM15?
Lousy good-for-nothing mortals. Can't live with 'em, can't live without 'em.
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Wraith
01/27/05 03:17 PM
129.101.55.124
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I really don't think indirect fire is that great in most situations. You get modifiers for firing indirect (+2 I think), your movement, your spotter's movement, enemy's movement, and terrain from spotter to enemy. There might even be a range modifier in there... When my group got out BMR to figure it out, our Catapult with a 2 gunner had 11s to hit an enemy Grendal.
I myself prefer Gauss. It's concentrated damage, almost enough to force a piloting check by itself. The worst it can do is explode for 16 points of damage, as opposed to a ton of LRM ammo that can do 120...
-Wraith
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Karagin
01/27/05 04:41 PM
65.132.126.7
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What are you talking about? The LRM15 is the same one from the game as written. THe ammo for the LRMs is the same speical warheads that are found in the BMR and MaxTech and The Tactical Handbook.
Why would we need another one?
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Nightward
01/27/05 04:55 PM
203.214.145.254
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Hm.
Depends. Clan LRM-15, weighing in at just 3.5 tons, is clearly superior to the Clan Guass, because you can carry a great deal of ammo and special options for it.
IS wise, though, it gets a bit murkier. Indirect fire, varying submunitions- but they're heavy and there's that hideous Minimum Range of 6.
Really depends. I'd take something with a Clan LRM-15 over a Guass any day, but when you're IS it really depends on what the unit taken as a whole can do.
Yea, verily. Let it be known far and wide that Nightward loathes MW: DA. Indeed, it is with the BURNING ANIMUS OF A THOUSAND SUNS that he doth rage against it with.
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SSFSX17
01/28/05 01:41 AM
128.195.64.90
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Sorry, I got the LRM and the AC mixed up in my head. I'd mistakenly thought there was no LRM-15.
Lousy good-for-nothing mortals. Can't live with 'em, can't live without 'em.
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Nightward
01/28/05 02:23 AM
203.214.147.45
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Don't worry. You get 3 strikes before we send Word of Blake ROM for you.
Yea, verily. Let it be known far and wide that Nightward loathes MW: DA. Indeed, it is with the BURNING ANIMUS OF A THOUSAND SUNS that he doth rage against it with.
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Toontje
01/29/05 04:08 PM
84.24.165.226
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gauss has headcap capabilities and concentrated damage for armour penetration, but against vehicles the multiple hits from a LRM launcher are better.
dmgwise, IS GR= 15/15 tons, LRM-15~avg9/(7+1). IDF = +1 + range + firer move mod + defender move mod + spotter move mod. Spotter inf = +0 for spotter movement.
Heat? On 'mechs, the HS used for the LRM are functional for all heat. So secondarty weapons can be installed to use the LRM's assigned HS for heat dissipation. On vehicles heat is not even an issue.
Playing with only 'mechs, GR is superior, combined arms the LRM's outweight it by long. The GR is in better on a 'mech, on a vehicle the IDF capabilities (no return fireagainst a fragile (standing still so +0 attacker move mod) vehicle), special ammo options and no-heat-for ammo weapons for vehicles make the LRM the better option.
Even on 'mechs the option to stand still while IDF-ing using an inf (BA for resilience) spotter with no return fire is excelent.
Concluding, IMO LRMs are the superior weapon.
Rather to blow up, then.
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Greyslayer
02/10/05 07:07 PM
216.14.192.234
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Going through posts in the 'Selection for a Tourney Force; thread I looked at the strengths of the PPC vs LRM15. I thought that perhaps the LRM15 had more to offer than the PPC in that kind of conflict (short stand-up fight).
Can the same be said of a Gauss Rifle vs the LRM15? I could very well say yes if you look at the tonnage and other resources used (heat and crits). For mechs they start with 'free heat' whether that be double or single heat sinks, most of which is stored in the engine.
If you are using doubles it would take 4 LRM15s before you generated extra heat through movement. Lets say each of those lanuchers had 2 tons ammo that would mean 36 tons and 20 crits. Meanwhile the twin gauss doesn't generate enough to bother looking at heat sinks but take up 34 tons and 18 crits. While the Gauss takes up less weight and crits the sheer incoming potential from those LRMs may crush units indirect or utilising other nasty ammo types (ie Swarm).
Also the fact that 14 of those 18 crits are dangerous compared to 8 of the 20 sort of creates problems as well.
Straight 1 Gauss vs 1 LRM15 I would find Gauss the better pick but looking at units fielding mostly that type of getup you find that the LRM15 is a far better main weapon overall IMHO.
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wartang
05/18/05 03:40 PM
192.235.2.30
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lrm15 / gausse
ammo explosion (225 damage)/ no ammo explosion
no weapon explosion/ weapon explosion(24 damage)
1 crit clan 2 is/ 12 clan 12 is
3.5 tons clan / 12 clan 14 is
15 shots per ton/ 8 shots per ton
indrirectfire/ head cap
average damage
6-10/15
it is a close one
i love this game
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Lone_Wolf_Radick
05/19/05 09:57 AM
129.33.119.12
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Yeah, and besides spotting and Art IV and Ind Fire, you can also run a small unit with NARC and further increase your damage potential with LRM's... twin LRM 15's against twin GR's? Well obviously the LRM's cause much more heat and can be shot from the sky with ams, but they also spread damage all over the target and can cause crits, whereas the concentrated, albeit heavy, damage from the GR hits once in one location and is done. Plus without extra tonnage allocated you only get 8 shots with the GR, and going against heavies or assaults that won't net you many kills... Neither will one ton of LRM 15 ammo, but your damage and crit finding ability increases over time IMHO, as you get a round or two of extra shots. Overall it's a close fight and is dependent on who you're up against. The big lead footballs dispensed by the GR can't be shot down, but yet the LRM can fire ind or can load some very interesting submunitions (deadfire, Thunder, Swarm, streak, Etc). Given the choice I'm in agreement with the Clan LRM15 over a CGR anyday... but in the sphere, it's a harder choice...
-Wolf
War Never Determines who is right, only who is left.
"I find your lack of faith disturbing-Darth Vader"
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Rorahusky
06/22/05 05:00 PM
69.159.13.137
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They both have it's uses. While I like the Guass' damage and range, I also like the LRM's indirect fire feature, and in fact won a game because of it. My Clan Timber Wolf, Mad Cat II, Mad Cat III, a Vulture, and a couple of squads of Elementals versus an Annihilator, one mech that I can't remember at the moment, and a /HUGE/ swarm of Savannah Masters (I'm talking 15 plus). I parked my Vulture and Timber Wolf with their backs at the edge of a forest so the Masters couldn't get any backshots along with my Elementals while my Mad Cat II and III stayed deep in the woods. While my Vulture and Wolf torn Masters up left and right with their Pulse Lasers (Gotta love the -2 To-Hit they have), my troopers were alternating between taking potshots at any vehicles they could and spotting for my LRM carriers, who were bomdarding the enemy mechs with Indirect fire. Once I had crushed the Savannah Master rush, my mechs strolled out of the woods at a leisurely pace and engaged the two badly mauled mechs one on one and crushed them. Needless to say, I would have been pretty screwed if I had tried to take some Guass carrying mechs into that battle, since I would have been badly torned up by the Masters and then had to face two fresh mechs on top of that, where as my LRMs let me hang back in cover and chew up said mechs while protecting me from the vehicles rather than having to risk all my mechs trying to get into a good firing position to get a Guass shot off.
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