How about more realistic max head armor?

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MaiShirunaiispretty
03/10/09 09:54 AM
207.160.205.13

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A 'Mech's head is on top of the 'Mech and should have lots of room for armor. I was thinking for maximum head armor on a 'Mech, you take the 'Mech's tonnage, divide it by 5, then add 7. So:

'Mech max head
tonnage armor
15_____10
20_____11
25_____12
30_____13
35_____14
40_____15
45_____16
50_____17
55_____18
60_____19
65_____20
70_____21
75_____22
80_____23
85_____24
90_____25
95_____26
100____27

This actually provides better game balance because lighter 'Mechs that gang up on heavier 'Mechs can't do head destruction as easily. (Basically one lighter 'Mech can't take out a 'Mech's head so quickly while other lighter 'Mechs stay away from combat).
Zandel_Corrin
03/10/09 07:41 PM
123.2.140.247

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FAIL!

With that much armour your pilot can no longer see to shoot thus you can not shoot... thus you fail.
Galaxy Commander
Zandel Corrin
Night Dragon Clan
His_Most_Royal_Highass_Donkey
03/10/09 10:55 PM
24.5.141.133

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Its just newtype cheating again. Big surprise, NOT!
Why argue if the glass is half full or half empty, when you know someone is going to knock it over and spill it anyways.

I was a Major *pain* before
But I got a promotion.
I am now a General *pain*
Yay for promotions!!!
Zandel_Corrin
03/11/09 03:41 PM
123.2.140.247

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A note to that tho.... I do agree with the principle of more head armour....

I have played around with some figures.... normally goes like this:

Lights: 9 max arm
Meds: 11 max arm >>> 4 internal structure
Heavy: 13 max arm >>> 4 internal structure
assault: 15 max arm >>> 5 internal structure

this negates the heavy and assault being one shot by anything short of an AC 20 but has little other effects.... the pilot still takes damage from head hits so being able to take more hits is only a little more effective.
Galaxy Commander
Zandel Corrin
Night Dragon Clan
His_Most_Royal_Highass_Donkey
03/11/09 03:58 PM
24.5.141.133

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The head is extremely hard to hit as it is. There is less that a 3 percent chance to hit the head.

Also, it gives a 20 ton mech a very small chance to kill a 100 ton mech. I think its fine as it is. If you want more armor on your mech use hardened armor.
Why argue if the glass is half full or half empty, when you know someone is going to knock it over and spill it anyways.

I was a Major *pain* before
But I got a promotion.
I am now a General *pain*
Yay for promotions!!!
Prince_of_Darkness
03/11/09 05:21 PM
205.202.120.139

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This entire thread has become a black hole of retarded.
His_Most_Royal_Highass_Donkey
03/11/09 05:30 PM
24.5.141.133

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Quote:

This entire thread has become a black hole of retarded.




I think this is the first time that I have seen someone added them self's in a list of what they called retarded.
Why argue if the glass is half full or half empty, when you know someone is going to knock it over and spill it anyways.

I was a Major *pain* before
But I got a promotion.
I am now a General *pain*
Yay for promotions!!!
Voidshape
08/18/09 10:18 AM
129.71.148.97

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I actually like the standard head armor and internal points. It's an equalizer. It may not be all that realistic, but it's good for game play.
New to the game... And little obsessed.
Tripod
08/19/09 12:59 AM
192.91.75.29

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I think it's fine as is with the Hardened option...

...


LOL @ Donkey



Quote:

Quote:

This entire thread has become a black hole of retarded.




I think this is the first time that I have seen someone added them self's in a list of what they called retarded.




I'll add myself to that list as well, good company here.
TBA
Voidshape
08/19/09 07:23 AM
129.71.204.146

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Quote:

I think it's fine as is with the Hardened option...




Huh huh, he said HARDENED.
New to the game... And little obsessed.
Bob_Richter
08/19/09 07:32 AM
66.191.9.99

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I'd actually disagree. It's unbalancing, and compromises the power of assault 'Mechs not only against lighter 'Mechs but also against every other type of battlefield unit. Only 'Mechs have this vulnerability.

Also, 3/9 heads look stupid on bugs.
-Bob (The Magnificent) Richter

Assertions made in this post are the humble opinion of Bob.
They are not necessarily statements of fact or decrees from God Himself, unless explicitly and seriously stated to be so.
:)
Voidshape
08/19/09 08:17 AM
129.71.204.146

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You know, honestly, there are a lot of things about the game that seem a little off. But I'm all about embracing the accepted rules, just because of wide acceptance.

Heck, I don't like the way the rounds / phases work. I'd love to roll initiative for each mech individually, then resolve each in sequence, with all damage and heat taking immediate effect. Having a long round end with "now what happened? Do I still have an arm?" is just not much fun.

And the mental "negative equals good" of a "minus two to-hit" being good is odd. Why not modify the ROLL, not the to-hit number? Establish the to-hit number, then let modifiers that make it more difficult to hit be minuses, and modifiers that make it easier to hit be pluses. It's just more intuitive.

But like I said, widespread acceptance and proliferation make learning the current rules worth it. -Also, the idea that it's a game that's been played like this for years and years is just fun. Being part of history is cool.

So, whatever. Mechs all have the same heads. It was that condition that lead me to build the build the Mongol (punchybot). Even though it wasn't really a success, the process was way fun, and I learned more about the game in the process.
New to the game... And little obsessed.
ix
07/01/10 04:54 PM
81.6.219.90

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I suppose this rule stems from a desire to reward double sixes, it's a terrible rule though. It may have worked before there were so many 15 damage weapons, now it just feels silly and common sense rebels against the idea of no one figuring out how to place more armour so as to prevent instant pilot death (I thought pilots were supposed to be a valuable resource). From a rules POV it'd be cleaner to have the head follow armour max is two times the internal structure and increase the internal structure, why the original designer/s didn't use 4 int and 8 armour I have no idea.

As players are entertained by limb-loss and spectacular death if the game wants this it'd be more interesting to have some heavier calibre weapons available and allow more freedom to armour the head. It'd then be something of a skill tester for those who actually work out the probability of getting hit in the head vs the desire to armour it.


Edited by ix (07/01/10 04:56 PM)
Zandel_Corrin
07/01/10 08:06 PM
123.2.140.247

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Love the thread Necro....

On Topic: Actually Mechs are Valuable, pilots are a dime a dozen. Just read some of the fics and lore... finding more mech parts was a big deal... finding more pilots? Easy as.
Galaxy Commander
Zandel Corrin
Night Dragon Clan
Tripod
07/03/10 09:34 PM
192.91.75.30

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With hardened armor(probly covered earlier in this thread) it takes 21 points to cap the head...
TBA
His_Most_Royal_Highass_Donkey
08/12/10 11:25 AM
67.121.210.10

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Quote:

Love the thread Necro....

On Topic: Actually Mechs are Valuable, pilots are a dime a dozen. Just read some of the fics and lore... finding more mech parts was a big deal... finding more pilots? Easy as.




Yes, life is cheap weapons cost money.
Why argue if the glass is half full or half empty, when you know someone is going to knock it over and spill it anyways.

I was a Major *pain* before
But I got a promotion.
I am now a General *pain*
Yay for promotions!!!
Schevv
09/15/10 03:11 PM
91.33.21.238

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A nice solution could also be to increase the internal structure in the head only, leaving the cap for armor at 9.
If Assaults come up with 7 internals then, they can eat a single 15 pt hit, but still a IS PPC will give a opportunity for a crit.
AlphaStrike
12/15/11 04:46 PM
204.116.109.99

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For our game we had the internals scale up

light-3
med-4
heavy-5
assault-6

and stuck with the 2x internals for max armor

light-6
med-8
heavy-10
assault-12

AC20's were still the head shot kings.
Raplet
12/24/11 11:01 AM
68.150.148.233

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I'm OK with the head armor staying as it is.

I view the limitations on the head armor as a byproduct of having a canopy, and the location of the sensors in the head.

You can only make a transparent canopy so tough, and the sensors might be affected by a large mass of metal in very close proximity.

To prevent the untimely deaths of experienced mechwarriors, the group I played with a house rule allowing the auto-eject to be set to fire on any head shot, thus prevent the pilot from having a Golden BB (Guass Rifle round) from landing in his lap. Only problem was any hit to the head would fire the auto-eject. And it had to be declared before the battle started, making the mech a target of LB-X rounds.

We also didn't play clan, reducing the head removal options.
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