Venom
07/25/09 06:17 AM
207.191.200.101
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BattleMech Technical Readout
Type/Model: Orion ON1-KR
Tech: Inner Sphere / 2750
Config: Biped BattleMech
Rules: Level 2, Modified design
Mass: 75 tons
Chassis: Kali Yama EndoChassis Endo Steel
Power Plant: 300 Vlar Fusion
Walking Speed: 43.2 km/h
Maximum Speed: 64.8 km/h
Jump Jets: None
Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor Type: Valiant Lamellor w. CASE Standard
Armament:
2 Raker-IV Medium Pulse Lasers
2 Hovertec Streak Streak SRM 2s
1 Kali Yama Weapons Industries Type V LB 10-X AC
1 KaliYama Death Bloom LRM 15 w/ Artemis IV
Manufacturer: Kali Yama Weapons Industries
Location: Kalidasa
Communications System: Irian Orator-5K
Targeting & Tracking System: Wasat Aggressor Type 5 Advanced
--------------------------------------------------------
Type/Model: Orion ON1-KR
Mass: 75 tons
Equipment: Crits Mass
Int. Struct.: 114 pts Endo Steel 14 4.00
(Endo Steel Loc: 1 HD, 2 LA, 2 RA, 2 LT, 2 RT, 1 CT, 2 LL, 2 RL)
Engine: 300 Fusion 6 19.00
Walking MP: 4
Running MP: 6
Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks: 10 Double [20] 0 .00
Gyro: 4 3.00
Cockpit, Life Supt., Sensors: 5 3.00
Actuators: L: Sh+UA+LA+H R: Sh+UA+LA+H 16 .00
Armor Factor: 224 pts Standard 0 14.00
Internal Armor
Structure Value
Head: 3 9
Center Torso: 23 36
Center Torso (Rear): 9
L/R Side Torso: 16 22/22
L/R Side Torso (Rear): 10/10
L/R Arm: 12 21/21
L/R Leg: 16 32/32
Weapons and Equipment Loc Heat Ammo Crits Mass
--------------------------------------------------------
1 Medium Pulse Laser RA 4 1 2.00
1 Medium Pulse Laser LA 4 1 2.00
2 Streak SRM 2s LA 4 50 3 4.00
(Ammo Locations: 1 LT)
1 LB 10-X AC RT 2 20 8 13.00
(Ammo Locations: 2 RT)
1 LRM 15 w/ Artemis IV LT 5 16 6 10.00
(Ammo Locations: 2 LT)
CASE Equipment: LT RT 2 1.00
--------------------------------------------------------
TOTALS: 19 66 75.00
Crits & Tons Left: 12 .00
Calculated Factors:
Total Cost: 7,840,000 C-Bills
Battle Value: 1,441
Cost per BV: 5,440.67
Weapon Value: 2,040 / 1,855 (Ratio = 1.42 / 1.29)
Damage Factors: SRDmg = 26; MRDmg = 16; LRDmg = 7
BattleForce2: MP: 4, Armor/Structure: 6/6
Damage PB/M/L: 5/4/2, Overheat: 0
Class: MH; Point Value: 14
Specials: if
'Cause Kerensky didn't pilot just ANY Orion. 'nuf said.
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His_Most_Royal_Highass_Donkey
07/25/09 09:36 AM
24.4.97.143
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For a level 2 75 toner I think its weapons are week. Your spending 23 tons to do 22 or 18 points of long range damage and 8 tons to do 20 points for short range damage. At least you have the minimum amount of ammo to fight a non running battle.
My tactic ageist a lance of four of these would be to use very fast medium mechs staying at long range trying to get you to use up all of your ammo. When your out of ammo hopefully kill you with my laser armed mechs before you can retreat back to base. At worse I might only bring down your ammo reserves so in later battles you will be out of or so low in ammo that such mechs are worthless and will be forced to retreat off planet.
After every battle you have to use up four tons of supplies of ammo. Where I can devote that four tons to extra armor. If your the defender you can have a unlimited supply of ammo and armor on planet. If your the attacker you only have what you could load onto your drop ships.
Why argue if the glass is half full or half empty, when you know someone is going to knock it over and spill it anyways.
I was a Major *pain* before
But I got a promotion.
I am now a General *pain*
Yay for promotions!!!
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Venom
07/25/09 02:36 PM
207.191.200.101
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Quote:
For a level 2 75 toner I think its weapons are week. Your spending 23 tons to do 22 or 18 points of long range damage and 8 tons to do 20 points for short range damage. At least you have the minimum amount of ammo to fight a non running battle.
For a level 2 3058 75 tonner, it is undergunned. Thank God I am not stupid enough to place it in that era! Now for a 'mech designed to fight against technologicly inferior machines of the House armies, it doesn't do to bad. The real test it would have faced is the fight against the Usurper.
Quote:
My tactic ageist a lance of four of these would be to use very fast medium mechs staying at long range trying to get you to use up all of your ammo. When your out of ammo hopefully kill you with my laser armed mechs before you can retreat back to base. At worse I might only bring down your ammo reserves so in later battles you will be out of or so low in ammo that such mechs are worthless and will be forced to retreat off planet.
You would huh? Well thank God I am not stupid enough to put four of the same 'mechs in a lance(not saying it can't work, because it can, but not with every 'mech). This guy would likely be paired with a MAD-2R, a WHM-6Rb, and maybe a BLR-1Gb. One of my Royal Black Knights would also make an excellent lancemate.
Quote:
After every battle you have to use up four tons of supplies of ammo. Where I can devote that four tons to extra armor. If your the defender you can have a unlimited supply of ammo and armor on planet. If your the attacker you only have what you could load onto your drop ships.
Or whatever I could plunder.
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His_Most_Royal_Highass_Donkey
07/26/09 01:24 PM
24.4.97.143
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I would drop the AC10X and replace it with a PPC. Having the AC10X and the LRM is being redundant for crit hits.
Dropping the AC10X for a PPC and four DHS frees up two tons for use somewhere else. All you use is one more crit but you mech had 12 still free to be payed with. I would think of adding one more Streak SRM 2s since you like them and a half ton of armor.
My personal preference would be to swap the short range weapons and long range weapons locations so the mech could use the short range weapons and punch at the same time.
Quote:
For a level 2 3058 75 tonner, it is undergunned. Thank God I am not stupid enough to place it in that era! Now for a 'mech designed to fight against technologicly inferior machines of the House armies, it doesn't do to bad. The real test it would have faced is the fight against the Usurper.
How is having a non ER PPC getting into 3058 tech and getting away from 2750 tech? If I recall right the PPC is level 1 tech. Maybe things have changed since I bought the books that where published some 20 years ago and the PPC is now 3050+ level 2 tech.
The only place that I don't think its under gunned is where your ageist only a level 1 mech, and even then not by much if its a very well designed level 1 mech.
http://www.sarna.net/forums/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/150941/an/0/page/2#150941 My Blazzer I would give you a real good run for you money before you defeated it. My Blazzer II would wipe the battle field with you.
Quote:
Or whatever I could plunder.
Well if you where attacking me you would not find any AC10X or LRM ammo to plunder. Going with 2750 tech all you would find is gauss rifle ammo. If you where going with 3050+ tech you would also find light gauss rifle ammo and MRM ammo. That's all that you would find in the way of ammo. As for armor standard is all that you would find, I don't like FF armor.
Why argue if the glass is half full or half empty, when you know someone is going to knock it over and spill it anyways.
I was a Major *pain* before
But I got a promotion.
I am now a General *pain*
Yay for promotions!!!
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His_Most_Royal_Highass_Donkey
07/26/09 01:32 PM
24.4.97.143
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I am not sure if the Blazzer II is 2750 tech legal or not. I am not sure what is post 3050 and pre 2750.
Why argue if the glass is half full or half empty, when you know someone is going to knock it over and spill it anyways.
I was a Major *pain* before
But I got a promotion.
I am now a General *pain*
Yay for promotions!!!
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Venom
07/26/09 10:14 PM
207.191.200.101
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Quote:
I would drop the AC10X and replace it with a PPC. Having the AC10X and the LRM is being redundant for crit hits.
A)It wouldn't be an Orion B)You can never have enough crit-seekers. If you have been playing as long as you claim you should know both of those things.
Quote:
How is having a non ER PPC getting into 3058 tech and getting away from 2750 tech? If I recall right the PPC is level 1 tech. Maybe things have changed since I bought the books that where published some 20 years ago and the PPC is now 3050+ level 2 tech.
ER PPCs and PPCs are 2750 Star League tech. Everything in the old Compendium for the IS is 2750 Star Leauge tech.
Quote:
The only place that I don't think its under gunned is where your ageist only a level 1 mech, and even then not by much if its a very well designed level 1 mech.
That is pretty much the prey that it is intended to fight. You see donkey, sometimes it makes the game more fun to NOT design a 'mech that does the most damage. People who do that are called munchkins. Sometimes it is fun to take a concept and a 'mech and have some fun. In this case I took the SLDF Royal Division upgrades from TRO:3075 and the venerable Orion since it was Kerensky's chosen 'mech.
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Venom
07/26/09 10:20 PM
207.191.200.101
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From what I have seen most all of your designs either do not add up as far as tonnage/crits or are out and out illegal, so I doubt the legality of anything you post. But hey, play the game your way, just don't tell me how to play by the rules.
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Tripod
07/26/09 11:23 PM
192.91.75.29
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The weapons loadout of the original and of this version remind me of the generic omnio mech weapons loadout. An AC, a LRM, some backup lasers with srm's...seems fitting it was Kerensky's choice and seems similar to the omni's.
Mechs that are less than perfect are not singled out in a battle and taken down first either. This one would be a scrapper, lacking an XL engine...
But I do agree that it lacks a knockout punch, thats what his lancemates are for....
TBA
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His_Most_Royal_Highass_Donkey
07/27/09 12:14 AM
68.24.104.202
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Quote:
From what I have seen most all of your designs either do not add up as far as tonnage/crits or are out and out illegal, so I doubt the legality of anything you post. But hey, play the game your way, just don't tell me how to play by the rules.
A bit rude, but hey everyone has there opinions about others.
I did not tell you that you're braking any of rules or how to play the game. I just gave my opinion on your battlemech.
Why argue if the glass is half full or half empty, when you know someone is going to knock it over and spill it anyways.
I was a Major *pain* before
But I got a promotion.
I am now a General *pain*
Yay for promotions!!!
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Venom
07/27/09 12:53 AM
207.191.200.101
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==Overview:==
The Orion is one of the most long-serving designs in the universe. Origionaly
developed in the early days of Battlemech construction it has survived for 500
years. The Orion has been upgraded many times through the years, even seeing
use in Clan Wolf as a IIC model.
==Capabilities:==
The Orion's troublesome KaliYama Autocannon was replaced with an upgraded LB-X
that adds to the 'mechs LRM rack in anti-aerospace operations. In addition
the ammo feed that had caused problems was redesigned. The SRM-4 was stripped
out in favor of of the new Hovertech Streak system, providing excellent
accuracy and ammunition management. Medium Pulse Lasers replace the Irian
Weapon Works standard models to increas shot-range accuracy. The LRM rack was
mated to an Artemis IV System to improve accuracy and the whole system was
redesigned to avoid the wiring issues that plague standard Orions.
==Battle History:==
The most famous use of an Orion was the use of General Kerensky's ON1-KR to
kick down the gates to the palace where the Usurper Amaris was hiding.
==Notable 'Mechs & MechWarriors:==
General Aleksandr Kerensky, Commander-in-Chief of the SLDF, Regent, Protector
and Defender of the Star League and the pilot of an olive-drab O1N-KR.
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Venom
07/27/09 12:56 AM
207.191.200.101
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I always thought of the Atlas as a "super-sized" Orion. You take one step up on the AC and the missiles and move things around a bit but very similar loadout.
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Zandel_Corrin
07/27/09 09:00 PM
123.2.140.247
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That would make sense as it was Kerensky himself who set out the specifications for the atlas.
"A mech as powerful as possible, as impenetrable as possible and as ugly and foreboding as conceivable, so that fear itself will be our ally."
Galaxy Commander
Zandel Corrin
Night Dragon Clan
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KitK
07/29/09 02:43 PM
198.169.14.92
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I find the Orion a bit under-heatsinked, so I am glad to see the doubles.
My initial thought was that its firepower hadn't changed much, nor was it impressive. That's been brought out already. I was glad, too, for the reminder that this mech is for a very era specific and has a very specific low-tech enemy in mind. This moderates any complaint I'd have about the firepower. These modifications would give the Royal a nice edge in its era without a huge cost increase from an XL engine. The standard engine over the XL engine is a 9.5 ton strategic, stylistic, and cost efficency choice that demands a compromise in firepower or/and armor that has to be made in the 3050s plus as well. I think the compromise is well done, perserving the flavor of the ON1-K.
Thanks for the Atlas comparison too. It is an interesting observation.
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Venom
07/30/09 03:27 AM
207.191.200.101
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I thought long and hard about an XL engine, but what to do with the extra weight? Jumpjets? Usefull but it didn't feel right-why would Kerensky kick down the gate when he could jump over it  I thought about going with ER Large Lasers instead of the MPLs, but that seemed like it would change the 'mech to something...else. I also thought about making it a 5/8/0, but I did not think the XL was worth it. In the end I just decided to go with a simple weapons upgrade, I thought that was what Kerensky would have done.
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Prince_of_Darkness
07/30/09 06:44 PM
71.214.4.128
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If anyone wants to know, this is actually Kerensky's Orion; don't ask me where I found it, tho.
Kerensky's Orion CANON
Rules Level: Experimental Tech
Tech Base: Inner Sphere
Era: All Eras (non-canon)
Chassis Config: Biped
Production Year: 0
Mass: 75 tons
Chassis: Unknown
Power Plant: Unknown 300 Fusion Engine
Walking Speed: 43.0 km/h
Maximum Speed: 64.5 km/h
Jump Jets: None
Armor: Unknown Ferro-Fibrous w/ CASE
Armament:
1 Gauss Rifle
1 Snub-Nose PPC
1 SRM-4 w/ Artemis IV FCS
1 Medium Laser
1 Medium Laser
Manufacturer: Unknown
Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown
================================================================================
================================================================================
Kerensky's Orion CANON
Tech Base: Inner Sphere
Chassis Config: Biped
Era: All Eras (non-canon) Cost: 7,628,250
Tech Rating/Era Availability: E/X-X-F BV2: 1,821
Equipment Type Rating Mass
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: 114 points 7.50
Engine: Fusion Engine 300 19.00
Walking MP: 4
Running MP: 6
Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks: Double 10(20) 0.00
Gyro: Standard Gyro 3.00
Cockpit: Standard Cockpit 3.00
Actuators: L: SH+UA+LA R: SH+UA+LA
Armor: Ferro-Fibrous AV - 231 13.00
Armor Locations: 1 CT, 8 LT, 1 RT, 2 LL, 2 RL
CASE Locations: 1 RT 0.50
Internal Armor
Structure Factor
Head 3 9
Center Torso 23 35
Center Torso (rear) 11
L/R Torso 16 24
L/R Torso (rear) 8
L/R Arm 12 24
L/R Leg 16 32
================================================================================
Equipment Location Critical Mass
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gauss Rifle RT 7 15.00
Snub-Nose PPC LT 2 6.00
SRM-4 LT 1 2.00
Artemis IV FCS LT 1 1.00
Medium Laser RA 1 1.00
Medium Laser LA 1 1.00
@SRM-4 (Artemis) (25) RT 1 1.00
@Gauss Rifle (8) RT 1 1.00
@Gauss Rifle (8) RT 1 1.00
Seems odd, but this is what it is.
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Christopher_Perkins
07/30/09 08:01 PM
173.66.226.144
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Quote:
ER PPCs and PPCs are 2750 Star League tech.
ER PPC is SL Tech
PPC is Age of War (so yeah, the SL did have it)
Quote:
Everything in the old Compendium for the IS is 2750 Star Leauge tech.
Perhapse... i do know that C3 was not present in the SL era, and there may have been a few other things...
there are some new "old" equipment in TW, TM, TO & SO that were introduced as SL Tech Equipment as well, much of this would have been SLDF Prototypes
Christopher Robin Perkins
It is my opinion that all statements should be questioned, digested, disected, tasted, and then either spit out or adopted... RHIP is not a god given shield
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Venom
07/31/09 04:12 AM
207.191.200.101
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I kinda doubt that is canon...if it was the SRM-4 would be arm-mounted.
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Tripod
08/01/09 09:30 AM
8.23.64.195
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What is the tech date on snub ppc's?
TBA
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Venom
08/01/09 04:36 PM
207.191.200.101
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Prototype:Around the fall of the SL
Production:3067
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Tripod
08/02/09 03:14 AM
192.94.94.106
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Wow! I had no clue they were prototyped that long ago. Is this prototype date new fluff or has the idea for the snub ppc been arround all this time?
TBA
Edited by Tripod (08/02/09 03:15 AM)
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Prince_of_Darkness
08/02/09 11:31 PM
71.214.4.128
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Quote:
Wow! I had no clue they were prototyped that long ago. Is this prototype date new fluff or has the idea for the snub ppc been arround all this time?
Well, we know of the Phoenix Hawk royal upgrade that features one with an ER Large Laser just before the exodus, and the idea is that the clans used some of that tech to form their advanced cER PPC. It's been around since the very end of the Star League, having about 30 years before disappearing- but it was only in the end of 3067 did the DC resurrect the idea from some unknown source (memory core? Nova Cat info? Cache?) which was quickly stolen and reverse-engineered by the Word of Blake.
The actual idea, however, has been around for a very long time. The Star League sourcebook talked of it (along with the Atlas II and an unseen-as-of-yet Wolverine II) but for over 20 years it has been nothing but speculation to the players and fans; oddly enough, they thought along that same lines as Catalyst did, building a "sawed-off shotgun" of the PPC world.
(Is that enough? I worry when I type for this long that I am getting into a tangent.)
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Prince_of_Darkness
08/02/09 11:37 PM
71.214.4.128
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UPDATE:
Oh shit! I found a picture of Kerensky's Orion, and the SRM is in the torso:
Don't know where the GR is, however; but I think my earlier post is correct nonetheless.
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Prince_of_Darkness
08/02/09 11:41 PM
71.214.4.128
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To explain this effectively, Jackmc on the Classic Battletech boards (this thread here) said it best:
You've got to truely visualize the role of this mech. It's mechwarrior is a guy who's both the politicla and military CINC of his faction. You don't want him fighting, you want him commanding and only shooting in a defensive situation. So you give him a defensive loadout, not an offensive one. Another thing to factor in is that he's such a high-value target, head hunter units are going to be pressing the lance hard if they find him, and that means he's not going to have the luxury of a long range duel. They are going to be up in his face fast.
When you consider that, his loadout makes sense. He can't just go all close-in because he needs some credible long-ranged throw to keep snipers off him if he should happen to get isolated, and this is achieved by giving him a weapon that will shred many high-speed harassers with a single shot. The great thing is that his long range beatstick is just as effective close in. Once it does get to close in, he's got the heatsinks to alpha while running for two turns and then only has to drop a single light weapon every other turn to stay under 5 heat. It's a very good loadout for what amounts to a support vehicle intended to be be sheparded by combat units.
Honestly, there's only one change I would make to it. I'd add endo and use the free mass to add ECM, 1 D-sink and 1 extra ton of ammo.
-Jackmc
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Venom
08/03/09 03:37 AM
207.191.200.101
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Huh *shakes head at poorly done retcon*. If Clan Wolf knew that Kerensky's Orion mounted a SNPPC-a design that helped lead to the cER PPC-why would the Orion IIC mount LRMs instead?
Quote:
Oh shit! I found a picture of Kerensky's Orion, and the SRM is in the torso:
Try not to be too smug, I rarely belive a readout that could have been made by HMP as canon. Hell, before I bought TRO:3060 I didn't belive that the Orion IIC would move the SRM to the torso either.
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