Bulldog FCE II

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Retry
03/30/14 03:17 PM
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Redesigned the normal Bulldog Fuel Cell Engine variant, it resembles the original Bulldog better than the canon one, IMO.
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Bulldog Medium Tank FCE II
IS advanced
60 tons
BV: 895
Cost: 2,608,800 C-bills

Movement: 4/6 (Tracked)
Engine: 240 Fuel Cell

Internal: 30
Armor: 161 (Ferro-Fibrous)
Internal Armor
Front 6 40
Right 6 32
Left 6 32
Rear 6 23
Turret 6 34

Weapons Loc Heat
SRM 4 TU 3
SRM 4 TU 3
Small X-Pulse Laser FR 3
LB 10-X AC TU 2

Ammo Loc Shots
SRM 4 Ammo BD 25
SRM 4 Ammo BD 25
LB 10-X AC Ammo BD 10
LB 10-X Cluster Ammo BD 10

Equipment Loc
Targeting Computer BD
Armored Chassis BD
Karagin
03/30/14 03:26 PM
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Where are the heat sinks?
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
Retry
03/30/14 03:29 PM
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They're included in the total weight.
ghostrider
03/30/14 03:52 PM
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this is one of the few things I liked the large laser on. The 10x does give it a little more options it could use.

Would think an mg with half ton ammo would be better then the xpulse.
Why add in an energy weapon, when you pulled the main one out?
Retry
03/30/14 04:03 PM
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Fuel Cells have 1 free heat sink, It lets one smaller energy weapon be feasibly put on the chassis, such as the SXPL, for enhanced anti-infantry performance
(-3 vs. infantry targets at much better range brackets than MGs can be a serious lifesaver against higher tier conventional infantry)
Karagin
03/30/14 05:57 PM
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So one free heat sink and the XSPL does three...so where are the other two heat sinks? Again what ever program you are using is not showing us everything and thus is incorrect.
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
Retry
03/30/14 06:03 PM
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The other two heat sinks are already considered in the weight of the design, along with the power amps. It doesn't need to be shown because it's already calculated in the design.

Unless you want to calculate the tonnage yourself and prove it wrong.
Karagin
03/30/14 06:29 PM
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Actually it does need to be shown Retry, other wise the design is not showing everything and lends to some one saying it's illegal to use. Again I suggest getting your self a better design program like the official from Rick aka Heavy Metal Pro Series or one of the free ones out there. Those ALL show the correct weights, correct items and do so in a manner that doesn't leave on wondering what is going on.

So where are the two extra heat sinks showing? Oh wait they are not, nor is the the free single heat sink either. So this design is not correct since the program has omitted items needed to show the users what all is there.
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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03/30/14 06:35 PM
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If you can't indirectly infer what is there or not from the game rules, it's not of my concern.

Now are you going to prove it an illegal design or not?
Karagin
03/30/14 06:51 PM
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Read the construction rules Retry, the heat sinks need to be listed, since vehicles have to have enough heat sinks to fire all energy weapons. That is well known common knowledge. It is illegal in that it is NOT listing the heat sinks.
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
Retry
03/30/14 07:04 PM
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The heat sinks are on the design regardless of whether or not they're listed.
Karagin
03/30/14 07:27 PM
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If they are not listed, then they are not there. Hence the part about the program you are using being faulty. You are posting incomplete data.
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
Retry
03/30/14 07:32 PM
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They are not listed yet they are there. They aren't separate crit slots or any crap like that that actually affects the vee in-game.
Karagin
03/30/14 07:38 PM
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They do affect the vehicle in the game, if they are not there, and yes the sheets do show them, then the vehicle can fire the energy weapons if they are not shown then it can't fire the weapons.
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
Retry
03/30/14 07:41 PM
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They are there.
KamikazeJohnson
03/30/14 08:21 PM
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Quote:
Karagin writes:

So one free heat sink and the XSPL does three...so where are the other two heat sinks? Again what ever program you are using is not showing us everything and thus is incorrect.



The original post lists the SXPL at 3 tons, which would be the total of the weapon and the required Heat Sinks.

SXPL: 1 ton
Required Heat Sinks: 3 tons
Integral Heat Sink: -1 ton
Total: 3 tons.
Peace is that glorious moment in history when everyone stands around reloading.
--Thomas Jefferson
Karagin
03/30/14 08:24 PM
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I get that part, but the rules call for the heat sinks to be shown, thus Retry's design is not following the rules in listing the heat sinks so that they can be seen and shown.
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
Retry
03/30/14 08:26 PM
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It's an outline.
Karagin
03/30/14 08:28 PM
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SO are the states the other programs post, YET those all show the heat sinks, so why is your design program special and not showing it?
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
Retry
03/30/14 08:33 PM
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I don't know why it doesn't show such limitedly useful trivia.

Either go through your own designer and plug numbers in to PROVE it can't be a valid design or "go home", so to speak.
Karagin
03/30/14 08:34 PM
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Trivia? Glad to know something that is mandated by the rules is trivia to you.
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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03/30/14 08:37 PM
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Heat sinks are mandatory for vehicles, and it should be assumed whatever heat sinks that are needed are there.
Karagin
03/30/14 08:40 PM
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Yes they are mandatory and your stats are not showing them.
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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03/30/14 08:43 PM
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They're not shown because it's inferred to be calculated within the final tonnage.
Karagin
03/30/14 08:46 PM
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They are shown on the Record sheets, thus should be in the stats.
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
Retry
03/30/14 08:55 PM
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They are in the stats, just not the posted ones because they don't get exported on for whatever reason.
Karagin
03/30/14 09:01 PM
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Then contact MegaMek and have them correct it.
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
Retry
03/30/14 09:04 PM
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I'm not going to contact them because *you* have an issue with it.
ghostrider
03/31/14 02:26 AM
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as you said it yourself, do not infer they are there or not there.

All components needed to use a vehicle should be listed. It is possible that someone didn't insert the correct information in the matrix used.

For all we know it does not require control components.

For a while I have seen the x-pulse laser. What is the difference between a normal pulse laser and the x pulse?

And retry, this is a good reason for people to not trust specific programs. Without all the information, I could put up a design that does not have anything needed to make it run. Just say the program doesn't show it.
But when I use it people ask how did this or that happen.
Oh. It wasn't listed before you agreed to let me use it.
Retry
03/31/14 07:38 PM
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I'd like to know, Karagin, which rulebook, page number, etc. that says that any internet forum outline of a vehicle must have the heat sinks on a vehicle design specifically listed.
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