DTH-3R Death Rain -- ClanTech, JMInc. Style!!!!!!!

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KamikazeJohnson
06/25/14 03:37 AM
50.72.218.68

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Still slow, so here's a 3050 Clan design.

Death Rain DTH-3R

Mass: 100 tons
Tech Base: Clan
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Tournament Legal
Era: Clan Invasion
Tech Rating/Era Availability: F/X-X-D-A
Production Year: 3070
Cost: 25,102,000 C-Bills
Battle Value: 2,543

Chassis: Unknown Endo-Steel
Power Plant: Unknown 300 Fusion XL Engine
Walking Speed: 32.4 km/h
Maximum Speed: 54.0 km/h
Jump Jets: None
Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor: Unknown Standard Armor
Armament:
1 ER PPC
2 LB 20-X ACs
2 LB 10-X ACs
Manufacturer: Unknown
Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown

================================================================================
Equipment Type Rating Mass
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Endo-Steel 152 points 5.00
Internal Locations: 1 HD, 1 LA, 1 RA, 2 LL, 2 RL
Engine: XL Fusion Engine 300 9.50
Walking MP: 3
Running MP: 5
Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks: Double Heat Sink 11(22) 1.00
Gyro: Standard 3.00
Cockpit: Standard 3.00
Actuators: L: SH+UA R: SH+UA
Armor: Standard Armor AV - 296 18.50
CASE Locations: LT, RT, LA, RA 0.00

Internal Armor
Structure Factor
Head 3 9
Center Torso 31 48
Center Torso (rear) 13
L/R Torso 21 31
L/R Torso (rear) 11
L/R Arm 17 33
L/R Leg 21 38

================================================================================
Equipment Location Heat Critical Mass
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
LB 10-X AC RA 2 5 10.00
LB 10-X AC LA 2 5 10.00
LB 20-X AC RT 6 9 12.00
LB 20-X AC LT 6 9 12.00
ER PPC CT 15 2 6.00
@LB 10-X (Cluster) (10) RA - 1 1.00
@LB 20-X (Cluster) (10) RA - 2 2.00
@LB 10-X (Slug) (10) RA - 1 1.00
@LB 10-X (Cluster) (10) LA - 1 1.00
@LB 20-X (Cluster) (10) LA - 2 2.00
@LB 10-X (Slug) (10) LA - 1 1.00
@LB 20-X (Slug) (5) RT - 1 1.00
@LB 20-X (Slug) (5) LT - 1 1.00
Free Critical Slots: 0

BattleForce Statistics
MV S (+0) M (+2) L (+4) E (+6) Wt. Ov Armor: 10 Points: 25
3 4 4 3 0 4 2 Structure: 5
Special Abilities: CASE, SRCH, ES, SEAL, SOA, FLK 3/3/1

MY BLURB:
Yeah I know. It's silly.
Peace is that glorious moment in history when everyone stands around reloading.
--Thomas Jefferson
Maurer
06/25/14 05:06 AM
98.154.219.23

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I'd hate to be on the recieving end of a 60 point cluster round shot critical hit galore.
"Captain! We're completely surrounded on all sides." - Kiff, Futurama
..."Excellent, then we may attack in any direction." - Zapp Brannigan, Futurama

"A fool fights a war on two fronts; only an idiot defends on one." - Fusilier
His_Most_Royal_Highass_Donkey
06/25/14 09:57 AM
172.56.17.9

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Quote:
Maurer writes:

I'd hate to be on the recieving end of a 60 point cluster round shot critical hit galore.



You have to get through the armor first. I have always seen AC-X weapons as a big wast of weight. If I am going to invest into an AC I want the solid punch to get through the armor then to wreck the IS to destroy the mech or tank out right and not to hope I can get lucky and get some kind of crit on something.
Why argue if the glass is half full or half empty, when you know someone is going to knock it over and spill it anyways.

I was a Major *pain* before
But I got a promotion.
I am now a General *pain*
Yay for promotions!!!
KamikazeJohnson
06/25/14 12:01 PM
50.72.218.68

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Quote:
His_Most_Royal_Highass_Donkey writes:

Quote:
Maurer writes:

I'd hate to be on the recieving end of a 60 point cluster round shot critical hit galore.



You have to get through the armor first. I have always seen AC-X weapons as a big wast of weight. If I am going to invest into an AC I want the solid punch to get through the armor then to wreck the IS to destroy the mech or tank out right and not to hope I can get lucky and get some kind of crit on something.



That's why I try to mount at least 1 ton of Slug ammo for my LB-Xs. Plus this thing gas the ERPPC.

Although...each hit has roughly a 1-in-86* chance of scoring a floating crit, which gives you a decent chance of critting someone with 20 or so hits.

*1/36 chance of rolling "armour pierced" x 15/36 chance of critting = 5/432 =1/86.4
Peace is that glorious moment in history when everyone stands around reloading.
--Thomas Jefferson
His_Most_Royal_Highass_Donkey
06/25/14 01:31 PM
172.56.17.9

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You don't have 20 chances you first roll on the missile chart under 20 missiles to see how many of the 20 hit. I would rather just get a good solid 20 point punch to the armor.
Why argue if the glass is half full or half empty, when you know someone is going to knock it over and spill it anyways.

I was a Major *pain* before
But I got a promotion.
I am now a General *pain*
Yay for promotions!!!
KamikazeJohnson
06/25/14 03:08 PM
24.114.22.110

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Quote:
His_Most_Royal_Highass_Donkey writes:

You don't have 20 chances you first roll on the missile chart under 20 missiles to see how many of the 20 hit. I would rather just get a good solid 20 point punch to the armor.



If all 4 LB-Xs hit, you would average 36 hits. The 20 was just an example.."if you delivered a total of 20 hits..."

In general, I prefer the big hits as well, but the Cluster shot has its uses (and actually averages more damage with a to-hit number of 9 or higher)

Anyway...I never said it was awesome...in fact, I believe I called it "silly"...
Peace is that glorious moment in history when everyone stands around reloading.
--Thomas Jefferson
ghostrider
06/26/14 08:49 PM
24.30.128.203

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I agree with the concept of a slug, since you don't have to roll on the crappy what did hit table for mechs. Against vehicles, this is death incarnate. Even hitting with half the possible shots, this would crit any vehicle to death.

Now where you came up with the idea of something carrying the 2 heaviest lbx cannons makes me wonder. Range could be a factor in an open clear battlefield. In a city, well head hits bite as much as the floating crits. technically could kill a pilot without getting thru the armor.
Karagin
06/26/14 11:36 PM
70.118.139.48

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Would fit well with many of the styles of play I have seen at conventions where attitude is when at all cost.
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
ATN082268
06/27/14 01:52 AM
69.128.58.222

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Quote:
Karagin writes:

Would fit well with many of the styles of play I have seen at conventions where attitude is when at all cost.



Aren't you supposed to try and win at tournaments and games in general?
ATN082268
06/27/14 01:56 AM
69.128.58.222

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Quote:
KamikazeJohnson writes:

Still slow, so here's a 3050 Clan design.

Death Rain DTH-3R

Mass: 100 tons
Tech Base: Clan
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Tournament Legal
Era: Clan Invasion
Tech Rating/Era Availability: F/X-X-D-A
Production Year: 3070
Cost: 25,102,000 C-Bills
Battle Value: 2,543

Chassis: Unknown Endo-Steel
Power Plant: Unknown 300 Fusion XL Engine
Walking Speed: 32.4 km/h
Maximum Speed: 54.0 km/h
Jump Jets: None
Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor: Unknown Standard Armor
Armament:
1 ER PPC
2 LB 20-X ACs
2 LB 10-X ACs
Manufacturer: Unknown
Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown

================================================================================
Equipment Type Rating Mass
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Endo-Steel 152 points 5.00
Internal Locations: 1 HD, 1 LA, 1 RA, 2 LL, 2 RL
Engine: XL Fusion Engine 300 9.50
Walking MP: 3
Running MP: 5
Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks: Double Heat Sink 11(22) 1.00
Gyro: Standard 3.00
Cockpit: Standard 3.00
Actuators: L: SH+UA R: SH+UA
Armor: Standard Armor AV - 296 18.50
CASE Locations: LT, RT, LA, RA 0.00

Internal Armor
Structure Factor
Head 3 9
Center Torso 31 48
Center Torso (rear) 13
L/R Torso 21 31
L/R Torso (rear) 11
L/R Arm 17 33
L/R Leg 21 38

================================================================================
Equipment Location Heat Critical Mass
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
LB 10-X AC RA 2 5 10.00
LB 10-X AC LA 2 5 10.00
LB 20-X AC RT 6 9 12.00
LB 20-X AC LT 6 9 12.00
ER PPC CT 15 2 6.00
@LB 10-X (Cluster) (10) RA - 1 1.00
@LB 20-X (Cluster) (10) RA - 2 2.00
@LB 10-X (Slug) (10) RA - 1 1.00
@LB 10-X (Cluster) (10) LA - 1 1.00
@LB 20-X (Cluster) (10) LA - 2 2.00
@LB 10-X (Slug) (10) LA - 1 1.00
@LB 20-X (Slug) (5) RT - 1 1.00
@LB 20-X (Slug) (5) LT - 1 1.00
Free Critical Slots: 0

BattleForce Statistics
MV S (+0) M (+2) L (+4) E (+6) Wt. Ov Armor: 10 Points: 25
3 4 4 3 0 4 2 Structure: 5
Special Abilities: CASE, SRCH, ES, SEAL, SOA, FLK 3/3/1

MY BLURB:
Yeah I know. It's silly.




If I was going to go the death by a thousand cuts route, I would go with:

BattleMech Technical Readout

Type/Model: Critter
Tech: Clan / 3072
Config: Biped BattleMech
Rules: Level 2, Custom design

Mass: 100 tons
Chassis: Endo Steel
Power Plant: 400 XL Fusion
Walking Speed: 43.2 km/h
Maximum Speed: 64.8 km/h
Jump Jets: 4 Standard Jump Jets
Jump Capacity: 120 meters
Armor Type: Ferro-Fibrous
Armament:

2 Large Pulse Lasers
10 Streak SRM 4s
1 Light Active Probe

Manufacturer: (Unknown)
Location: (Unknown)
Communications System: (Unknown)
Targeting & Tracking System: (Unknown)

--------------------------------------------------------
Type/Model: Critter
Mass: 100 tons

Equipment: Crits Mass
Int. Struct.: 152 pts Endo Steel 7 5.00
(Endo Steel Loc: 2 LA, 2 RA, 1 LT, 1 RT, 1 RL)
Engine: 400 XL Fusion 10 26.50

Walking MP: 4
Running MP: 6
Jumping MP: 4

Heat Sinks: 11 Double [22] 0 1.00
Gyro: 4 4.00
Cockpit, Life Supt., Sensors: 5 3.00
Actuators: L: Sh+UA+LA+H R: Sh+UA+LA+H 16 .00
Armor Factor: 307 pts Ferro-Fibrous 7 16.00
(Armor Crit Loc: 2 LA, 2 RA, 1 LT, 1 RT, 1 LL)

Internal Armor
Structure Value
Head: 3 9
Center Torso: 31 47
Center Torso (Rear): 15
L/R Side Torso: 21 32/32
L/R Side Torso (Rear): 10/10
L/R Arm: 17 34/34
L/R Leg: 21 42/42

Weapons and Equipment Loc Heat Ammo Crits Mass
--------------------------------------------------------
1 Large Pulse Laser RA 10 2 6.00
1 Large Pulse Laser LA 10 2 6.00
5 Streak SRM 4s RT 15 100 9 14.00
(Ammo Locations: 2 LT, 2 RT)
5 Streak SRM 4s LT 15 5 10.00
1 Light Active Probe HD 0 1 .50
4 Standard Jump Jets: 4 8.00
(Jump Jet Loc: 2 CT, 1 LL, 1 RL)
--------------------------------------------------------
TOTALS: 50 72 100.00
Crits & Tons Left: 6 .00

Calculated Factors:
Total Cost: 30,429,334 C-Bills
Battle Value 2: 2,817 (old BV = 2,703)
Cost per BV2: 10,802.04
Weapon Value: 3,965 / 3,057 (Ratio = 1.41 / 1.09)
Damage Factors: SRDmg = 42; MRDmg = 23; LRDmg = 12
BattleForce2: MP: 4J, Armor/Structure: 8/6
Damage PB/M/L: 5/4/1, Overheat: 4
Class: MA; Point Value: 28
Specials: prb
ghostrider
06/27/14 02:39 AM
24.30.128.169

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big problem with the streak is if there is ecm going on. Granted, most assault mechs don't tend to carry it, being within range of one would.

But then if you are looking for crits, maybe something with lots of little lrms might work as well. Stand back and pepper everything.. use of swarm missles could be helpful, and yeah, ecm would stop the swarm.

But the streak clusters would be nice when they lock.
KamikazeJohnson
06/27/14 09:28 AM
50.72.218.68

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Quote:
ghostrider writes:

Now where you came up with the idea of something carrying the 2 heaviest lbx cannons makes me wonder. Range could be a factor in an open clear battlefield. In a city, well head hits bite as much as the floating crits. technically could kill a pilot without getting thru the armor.



This came abut as a side-effect of playing around with designing a JagerMech IIC. Pretty much, I was curious if it was possible, so I tried it. I was really surprised to have room for the ERPPC as well, that was a bonus!
Peace is that glorious moment in history when everyone stands around reloading.
--Thomas Jefferson
Karagin
06/27/14 10:18 AM
70.118.139.48

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Yes ATTN you are, but not to the point that you have to use loop holes to win.
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
CrayModerator
06/27/14 06:43 PM
67.8.171.23

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Quote:
ATN082268 writes:

Aren't you supposed to try and win at tournaments and games in general?



First rule is to have fun. That doesn't necessarily entail victory, just playing the game.
Mike Miller, Materials Engineer

Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
ghostrider
06/28/14 06:20 PM
24.30.128.198

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As I said before, I have seen more games end from a critical hit then not. You can have the best design every, but it was taken out due to a head hit, or the floating crits.

Now there is ways to increase the crit chances, like the lbx cannons.
Streaks are another way. Though I do wonder why use 4 packs. Why not 2 or 6? Well 6 I can see the size limiting how many you can have and fire. 2's would give you more to fire. Guessing the number of crits available would limit them.

You could go with an extremely fast machine gun carrier. That would get you the chances of crits. And the cost for the atn mech is alittle high. The armor and internals should be normal, but I guess the extra wieght wouldn't allow all the packs.
His_Most_Royal_Highass_Donkey
06/30/14 12:33 AM
208.54.5.153

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I have the opposite experience. Most mechs fell do to their armor and all of the IS being destroyed and crits having little to do with anything other than being a minor annoyance.
Why argue if the glass is half full or half empty, when you know someone is going to knock it over and spill it anyways.

I was a Major *pain* before
But I got a promotion.
I am now a General *pain*
Yay for promotions!!!
ghostrider
07/01/14 03:35 AM
24.30.132.51

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So no engine or gyro hits in the first 2 volleys that ended up causing extra damage as the mech fell a few times, or prevented weapons from being used? Or even overheating shut downs?

I will say you have had a lucky carreer then. Ammo hits and full engine/gyro hits in the first 2 rounds have stopped alot of promising battles, on both sides. Even a single engine hit prevented a good battle in such things as normal marauders and such.
But then some people have good luck, while others have bad luck.

Nice to know some people get to enjoy a full game and not have to quit because most everything is immoble or have no weapons they can fire due to bad (or good depending on view) hits.

And not all of them were extremely bad crits. Something simple like a heat sink gone hurts when it is in the first round or two.
His_Most_Royal_Highass_Donkey
07/01/14 01:19 PM
206.29.182.184

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I would love to know how you got crit hits when the armor has not taken enough damage to eliminate all of the armor to start even getting crits. In most of the games I have played by the second round very little damage was even done to the armor let alone having the armor being fully penetrated and having internal structure damage done.
Why argue if the glass is half full or half empty, when you know someone is going to knock it over and spill it anyways.

I was a Major *pain* before
But I got a promotion.
I am now a General *pain*
Yay for promotions!!!
KamikazeJohnson
07/01/14 01:58 PM
50.72.218.68

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Quote:
His_Most_Royal_Highass_Donkey writes:

I would love to know how you got crit hits when the armor has not taken enough damage to eliminate all of the armor to start even getting crits. In most of the games I have played by the second round very little damage was even done to the armor let alone having the armor being fully penetrated and having internal structure damage done.



Floating Crits i.e. rolling a "2" on the Hit Location Table. Depending on the use of optional rules, you either roll for a possible Critical Hit on the torso, or reroll location, apply damage, and roll for Crit on that location, regardless of remaining armour.
Peace is that glorious moment in history when everyone stands around reloading.
--Thomas Jefferson
His_Most_Royal_Highass_Donkey
07/01/14 02:40 PM
172.56.16.192

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Getting a roll of a 2 is a 1 in 36 chance.

I have never heard of this optional rule of a floating location on a 2 roll.

You have a 1.15% chance of getting a crit by rolling a 2 then getting a crit roll aka VERY unlikely. That could happen 1 out of every 87 times that you score a hit. I totally doubt you will get this by the second round in most of the games you play. You will see this happen once every blue moon even if that often. I will go with the safe odds of 86 out of 87 times that I hit that that wont happen and I only do damage to the armor with out getting a crit.
Why argue if the glass is half full or half empty, when you know someone is going to knock it over and spill it anyways.

I was a Major *pain* before
But I got a promotion.
I am now a General *pain*
Yay for promotions!!!
ghostrider
07/02/14 05:50 AM
24.30.132.51

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In the original game rule book, rolling a 2 on the where you hit tables offers the chance of what retry labeled as thru armor criticals. It has been there since the game came out under battle tech. I am sure it is still there in the new books.

It is not optional if you follow the guidebook. Not sure if they use it in tournaments, but pretty sure they do.

The roll for hitting a head is the same, and more then a few times someone has killed a pilot without getting through the armor elsewhere.

The only thing that makes the 2 roll more unlikely to do much is the 7+ on the critical chance roll. Nothing like a 12 on that with 3 hits or limb blown off.

Only way I thought it was even close to being optional is if everyone agrees not to use it.
Now your odds might seem extreme, but that is why the lbx cannon is more dangerous then people realize. Each fragment has a chance for the crit location. A full hit from a 20 means 20 chances.
His_Most_Royal_Highass_Donkey
07/02/14 11:54 PM
172.56.30.63

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Quote:
ghostrider writes:

A full hit from a 20 means 20 chances.



No you don't. You get a roll on the missile chart to see how many of the 20 hits. You only have a 3 in 36 chance to have all 20 hit. You have the same 3 in 36 chance to have only 6 hit. You have a 20 in 36 chance of having 12 hit.

I would rather have a good solid 20 point hit to one location. On lighter armored mechs you just blown something off with out even worrying of having to roll on the crit chart.

BTW its not 7+ for a crit, 2-7 is no crit, you need a 8+ for a crit
Why argue if the glass is half full or half empty, when you know someone is going to knock it over and spill it anyways.

I was a Major *pain* before
But I got a promotion.
I am now a General *pain*
Yay for promotions!!!
ghostrider
07/03/14 12:16 AM
66.27.180.109

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The full hit comment assumed you got all of the munitions to hit. Sorry if that wasn't clear..

Been a while. even at 8+ there was always the chance of a crit for a 2 on the hit locations table..

And I agree with the solid 20 points, as I said earlier. For the most part a 20 ton mech will almost certainly go down if hit by an ac 20 slug.

I just have had crits change the game before it had gotten past the first couple of rounds. I may have to suggest that we ignore those shots for the first few rounds the next time I play.
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