TRO Backwaters

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Shadrak
11/28/15 06:29 PM
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As I have mentioned in other threads, I believe the Battletech is missing a large segment of the defense industry given the number of threats, available production capacity, and economic capability.

To address this, I have been working on TRO Backwaters, a collection of designs that are built using support vehicle rules and range from tech level B to tech level F. These designs could be locally produced by local automotive and shipbuilding industries rather than by military powerhouses like Defiance and Earthworks.

The document is very rough and needs more work, but I wanted to see if I could get it up since it will give a little bit more of a reason for why I created the Tethys/Thetis design (try to engage a Battle Cruiser sitting 10 mapsheets off the coast blasting you with naval artillery with an a Battlemech...its not going to happen even if the Battlecruiser is a WWII relic). The art is rough and the layout needs additional work, but I believe the designs are solid.

If you use any of these, please let me know how they play. Even if you don't use them, let me know what you think of combat systems built under support vehicle rules. Attachment (341 downloads)
Shadrak
11/28/15 06:33 PM
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Backwaters 2 Attachment (382 downloads)


Edited by Shadrak (11/28/15 06:35 PM)
Shadrak
11/28/15 06:39 PM
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Backwaters3 Attachment (348 downloads)
Shadrak
11/28/15 06:43 PM
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Backwaters4 Attachment (350 downloads)
ghostrider
11/28/15 06:49 PM
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I have said that about using orbital drops. Don't have to be explosives or anything, just send an asteroid towards your target. Do it right, and you can take out a base without risking anything, especially if the defenders don't have aerospace assets.

But you do have a point. The backwater worlds should have at least a vehicle set they can build locally and maintain, as the houses are unlikely to let them use front line units. I would think the vedette/scorpion designs would be the normal. ICE units under 50 tons, with mainly ammunition weapons as a norm.

And scary idea, but use of land lines to use to call in artillery strikes, so the enemy can't jam and radio signals or home in on their location from using them.
Shadrak
11/28/15 06:50 PM
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Sometimes low tech becomes the way to beat high tech...as we are seeing with ISIS.
ghostrider
11/28/15 06:56 PM
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Some of the units seem a little too low tech. Granted, it is possible on some worlds that might be the only way to get some sort of defenses up, and even give some ideas on how a pirate world my have defenses.
Interesting that there has not been much describing pirate planets, since most assume they use the combat vehicles of the innersphere and not have anything home grown.

You have given me some food for thought with this.
Shadrak
11/28/15 07:00 PM
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I haven't gotten Tech level D (emergence of Battlemechs) up yet...there is a pretty big jump from C to D that I noticed after finishing the designs...pretty major. It would take a 10-15 to 1 ratio with Tech Level C units to take out a similarly sized mech...Tech level D it is about 3-5...

Now, if the more recent weapons like chemical lasers and light autocannon were available, it would be even a little more even.

Also, don't think about these vehicles facing off against a 3075 mech, think about them facing a 3025 mech 5 on 1.
ghostrider
11/28/15 07:03 PM
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Now you got me thinking.
What do you use if you don't have depleted uranium to make shells for autocannons?
Not all planets will have oil for fuel.
Some might be so metal poor, they could not even make barrels or missile tubes.

Some might have issues making ICEs. What do you do then?
Ideas on hand cranked turrets?
Autoloading mechanisms?'

And for cray. Do they use jacketed slugs in AC's?
Is that the armor piercing shells?'
Shadrak
11/28/15 07:15 PM
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Those are certainly scenarios I can see.

My thought is that ammo is readily imported as finished shells or as components, but the vast majority of these older systems should be explosive based. If a planet is Tech Level C but doesn't have access to DU, they will have to look for an alternative or they may not actually be at Tech Level C...

In any event, in cases like your example, I believe the inhabitants of the planet would seek out some defensive system they could use that would be locally produced in the event they couldn't purchase an alternative from a major company.

As far as ICE, some alternative must be available...solar, steam, etc...and perhaps they build static fortifications...if you have a planet with a significant population (10+ million people), and any kind of resources, people should create some kind of defensive system even if it is a torsion-powered ballista firing a bolt with a 5kg explosive warhead. Maybe they utilize a tech level A...

What ideas do you have for those type of situations? Attachment (220 downloads)
Shadrak
11/28/15 07:19 PM
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Wish I could post a bigger file and now glad my drawerings aren't any bigger Attachment (211 downloads)
Shadrak
11/28/15 07:23 PM
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Backwaters 8 Attachment (192 downloads)
Shadrak
11/28/15 07:26 PM
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Backwaters9 Attachment (190 downloads)
Shadrak
11/28/15 07:31 PM
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Backwaters10 Attachment (191 downloads)
Shadrak
11/28/15 07:34 PM
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Backwaters11 Attachment (337 downloads)
Shadrak
11/28/15 07:37 PM
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Backwaters12...to end Attachment (185 downloads)
Shadrak
11/28/15 07:41 PM
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Will it fit? No...splitting it as well...describes general background. Attachment (188 downloads)
Shadrak
11/28/15 07:50 PM
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Second section Attachment (198 downloads)
Shadrak
11/28/15 07:53 PM
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Charlise Attachment (179 downloads)
ghostrider
11/29/15 12:39 AM
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If I know right, depleted uranium is used in the mg ammo as well.
And with the point of limited dropships in the Innersphere running supplies, I just had the thought that if there is a problem with lmited cargo space, do you ship in fresh food and water, or ammunition?

It does beg to be asked if other metals could be used in cannons and such besides the standard rounds?
Would a jacket tear up the inside of the barrel?
Would a softer metal jam up the barrel?


I will post the next set of question in another thread if I think of more.
You have put in some effort to not only making the designs but illustrating them as well.
I'm a thread jacker. Now were is that toy gun?
Maybe not a good joke in todays mind set.
Shadrak
11/29/15 12:00 PM
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Quote:
ghostrider writes:

If I know right, depleted uranium is used in the mg ammo as well.
And with the point of limited dropships in the Innersphere running supplies, I just had the thought that if there is a problem with lmited cargo space, do you ship in fresh food and water, or ammunition?

It does beg to be asked if other metals could be used in cannons and such besides the standard rounds?
Would a jacket tear up the inside of the barrel?
Would a softer metal jam up the barrel?


I will post the next set of question in another thread if I think of more.
You have put in some effort to not only making the designs but illustrating them as well.
I'm a thread jacker. Now were is that toy gun?
Maybe not a good joke in todays mind set.



I'm not sure that DU is completely necessary, but even if it is the primary material for BT weapons, there should be an alternative...maybe not one that is highly effective against BAR10 armor, but something available in some form or fashion. I think this is the intent of the primative weapons (Primative Rocket Launchers, Light/Med/Heavy Rifles, etc.)...they use a lower grade explosive that must meet a minimum threshold to damage a battlemech. Tungsten Carbide may not work, but some kind of heavy/hard carbide or some alternative...maybe a solid, heavy round with a carbide tip? I don't know...and, of course, there is explosive rounds...

Finally, there would be the possibility of mounting energy weapons on a machine...I had thought about a primitive chemical laser that is less efficient than the cannon version to match the ones refererenced in the cannon materials...
Light: 1.5 tons, Damage 3, 1/2/3 range, 10 shots
Medium: 3 tons, Damage 5, 2/4/6 range, 10 shots
Heavy: 5 tons, Damage 7, 4/8/12 range, 15 shots

each weapon has an internal chemical supply that has to be recharged after expended...weapons that have not completely expended their chemicals might cause serious explosive or chemical damage if it suffers a crit.

Then there would be a primitive flamer....

For the man-portable system, I am thinking a revolving rifle or pump action rifle with a 4 gauge-size explosive round...maybe a 4 round cylinder.
RockJock
12/21/15 04:08 PM
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My groups have always gone on the basis that certain weapons and vehicles are always around, almost everywhere. Jeeps with MGs, Dump Trucks(or other heavy trucks with light armor) and standard or Light ACs, Rocket Launchers on anything and so on. The closest I've seen is probably the units listed in Operation Klondike as refits. Basically every planet, or area has their own "version" but the weapons are pretty standard, as are the frames.

I like anything that expands that idea.
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