Shadrak
05/21/16 12:47 AM
98.101.165.116
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Type/Model: NGS AX1 Cohort Logistical Support Vehicle
Tech: Inner Sphere / 3025
Config: Wheeled Vehicle
Rules: Support Vehicle
Mass: 30.5 tons
Power Plant: Leveigh 659 ICE
Cruise Speed: 32 km/h
Maximum Speed: 54 (64) km/h
Armor Type: AmRoh 1300 (BAR 5)
Armament:
None
Manufacturer: Nexon Guardian Systems (previously Leveigh Brothers Heavy Industries)
Location: Various
Communications System: Westinghouse 1347XR
Targeting & Tracking System: None
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==Overview:==
Based on the Leveigh Brothers heavy MaxxResc Fire Apparatus Vehicle, the Cohort was introduced in 2432 by Leveigh Brothers as a military transport vehicle that would be air-portable and could sustain extended logistical operations while performing a variety of roles. After the introduction of the Leveigh Wild Boar in 2434 and Leveigh's Anton Armored Fighting Vehicle in 2443, Leveigh continued to seek new opportunities to expand its military vehicle offerings. Leveigh would introduce the XT fighting vehicle variants in 2445. When Leveigh spun off its military arm as Nexon Guardian Systems in 2459 the company introduced its DX line using the most advanced modern weapon systems.
==Capabilities:==
The Cohort is truly a support vehicle, even its armed variants. It has minimal armor and is generally slow. The XT variants are a great deal faster and have four times the armor of the base model, but even this armor is weak and highly suceptible to infantry and ancient weapons. Still, it is extremely effective for the cost when used in a support role, and the armed variants can be effective if properly protected by infantry and armor.
==Deployment:==
The MaxxResc is still in production today and can be seen in use on many different planets as a command vehicle, tender, and even as a ladder truck. Purchasers can get a basic MaxxResc system without an installed fire apparatus fairly easily and there are at least four companies that offer chassis modifications that will allow purchasers to conver the MaxxResc to a DX version of the Cohort provided the purchaser can locate adequate weapons and targeting systems. At least 400,000 cargo variants of the Cohort operate to support modern military forces today, and military analysts believe that nearly 25,000 DX and XT Models serve in modern militia forces.
==Variants:==
Leveigh always intended the Cohort to have a large number of variants. The Cohort has a base cargo variant, a variant that uses a 15 ton cargo container, a 16 ton liquid cargo carrier, and a comms vehicle that carried 16 tons of communication gear. Most variants did not significantly alter the chassis, but the wrecker/tower variant included a more robust chassis at the expense of one and a half tons of cargo space. About 25% of these tower variants also featured a hoist, so the standard tower had a cargo capacity of fifteen and a half tons and the wrecker had a cargo capacity of twelve and a half tons (enabling the wrecker variant to tow vehicles up to 44 tons). Leveigh fielded three major variants in 2445 based on the same turret structure. The first, the XT1 was an anti-aircraft system consisting of four heavy chain guns with five tons of ammunition and a highly advanced targeting system. Additionally, the XT1 had a larger engine and supercharger that enabled it to travel at speeds greater than eighty kilometers per hour, and it carried an additional one and a half tons of armor. The second, the XT2, was a very similar design, carried four revolver cannon in place of the heavy chain guns at the expense of two tons of ammunition. The third major variant was the AT3, an artillery variant that carried a three inch naval cannon as an artillery piece. This vehicle did not feature the heavier engine or supercharger, but it had the same armor layout of the other two designs. It also carried three tons of ammunition. To take advantage of more modern weaponry, NGS introduced the DX1, DX2, and DX3 in 2459. Lacking the off-road capabilities of the original vehicle (basically using the MaxxResc chassis), the DX models mounted identical turrets one and a half ton turrets and one and a half ton targeting systems and increased total armor coverage over the original by 500 kilograms. The DX1, and artillery variant, featured a Marksman Artillery Piece and a single ton of ammunition. The DX2, a support by fire variant, featured two LRM-15s and two tons of ammunition. The DX3, an anti-air variant, featured two AC-2s with two tons of ammunition and two machineguns sharing a single ton of ammunition.
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Type/Model: Cohort
Mass: 30.5 tons
Equipment: Items Mass
Int. Struct.: 16 pts, Off-Road Modification 7.00
Engine: Leveigh ICE 4.50
w/Supercharger
Cruise MP: 3
Flank MP: 5 (6)
Fuel .50
Range: 1111 km
Heat Sinks: .00
Cockpit & Controls: .00
Crew: 3; Driver, Assistant Driver, Commander .00
Armor Factor: 15 pts BAR 5 .50
Internal Armor
Structure Value
Front: 4 4
Left / Right Sides: 4 4
Rear: 4 3
Weapons and Equipment Loc Heat Ammo Items Mass
--------------------------------------------------------
Cargo Body 0 0 17.5
--------------------------------------------------------
TOTALS: 30.5
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Shadrak
05/21/16 12:55 AM
98.101.165.116
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XT1
Type/Model: Cohort
Mass: 30.5 tons
Equipment: Items Mass
Int. Struct.: 16 pts, Off-Road Modification 7.00
Engine: Leveigh ICE 7.00
w/Supercharger 1.00
Cruise MP: 4
Flank MP: 6 (8)
Fuel .50
Range: 714 km
Heat Sinks: .00
Cockpit & Controls: 1.00
Turret: 1.00
Crew: 6; Driver, Assistant Driver, Commander, 3 man gun team .00
Armor Factor: 62 pts BAR 5 2.00
Internal Armor
Structure Value
Front: 4 13
Left / Right Sides: 4 12
Rear: 4 10
Turret 4 15
Weapons and Equipment Loc Heat Ammo Items Mass
--------------------------------------------------------
4 x Heavy Chain Gun Turret 4 8
Ammuntion (HCG) 250 Body 1 5
--------------------------------------------------------
TOTALS: 30.5
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Shadrak
05/21/16 01:01 AM
98.101.165.116
|
DX1
Type/Model: Cohort
Mass: 30.5 tons
Equipment: Items Mass
Int. Struct.: 16 pts, 5
Engine: Leveigh ICE 4.50
w/Supercharger .50
Cruise MP: 3
Flank MP: 5 (6)
Fuel .50
Range: 1111 km
Heat Sinks: .00
Cockpit & Controls: 1.50
Turret: 1.50
Crew: 6; Driver, Assistant Driver, Commander, 3 man gun team .00
Armor Factor: 31 pts BAR 5 1.00
Internal Armor
Structure Value
Front: 4 6
Left / Right Sides: 4 6
Rear: 4 5
Turret 4 8
Weapons and Equipment Loc Heat Ammo Items Mass
--------------------------------------------------------
Marksman Artillery Piece 15
Ammuntion (Marksman) 20 1
--------------------------------------------------------
TOTALS: 30.5
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Shadrak
05/21/16 01:02 AM
98.101.165.116
|
DX2
Type/Model: Cohort
Mass: 30.5 tons
Equipment: Items Mass
Int. Struct.: 16 pts, 5
Engine: Leveigh ICE 4.50
w/Supercharger .50
Cruise MP: 3
Flank MP: 5 (6)
Fuel .50
Range: 1111 km
Heat Sinks: .00
Cockpit & Controls: 1.50
Turret: 1.50
Crew: 6; Driver, Assistant Driver, Commander, 3 man gun team .00
Armor Factor: 31 pts BAR 5 1.00
Internal Armor
Structure Value
Front: 4 6
Left / Right Sides: 4 6
Rear: 4 5
Turret 4 8
Weapons and Equipment Loc Heat Ammo Items Mass
--------------------------------------------------------
2 x LRM-15 14
Ammuntion (LRM-15)16 2
--------------------------------------------------------
TOTALS: 30.5
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Shadrak
05/21/16 01:04 AM
98.101.165.116
|
DX2
Type/Model: Cohort
Mass: 30.5 tons
Equipment: Items Mass
Int. Struct.: 16 pts, 5
Engine: Leveigh ICE 4.50
w/Supercharger .50
Cruise MP: 3
Flank MP: 5 (6)
Fuel .50
Range: 1111 km
Heat Sinks: .00
Cockpit & Controls: 1.50
Turret: 1.50
Crew: 6; Driver, Assistant Driver, Commander, 3 man gun team .00
Armor Factor: 31 pts BAR 5 1.00
Internal Armor
Structure Value
Front: 4 6
Left / Right Sides: 4 6
Rear: 4 5
Turret 4 8
Weapons and Equipment Loc Heat Ammo Items Mass
--------------------------------------------------------
2 x AC-2 12
Ammuntion (AC-2)90 2
2 x Machinegun 1
Ammuntion (MG) 200 1
--------------------------------------------------------
TOTALS: 30.5
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Karagin
05/21/16 03:37 AM
61.40.222.5
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Where are the stats found for the Chain Gun you have mounted on the first one?
And why the BAR? Most support vehicles will have real armor on them, and I am speaking from, and as, someone who drives the vehicles like the M1074 PLS, we have armor on them and it's not the crap like BAR, so why did you go that route vs real armor for the vehicle in the game?
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Shadrak
06/03/16 03:05 AM
70.194.234.28
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Chain gun is a home design effective against low bar armor...range is 2/4/6 and damage is 10 hit minus BAR rating...so no damage to BAR 10 and up to 8 damage on BAR 2.
The M1074 PLS uses kit TLAS armor. This is the epitome of BAR. Battletech armor is more than TLAS. Chobham armor should be BAR 6 or 8 with Rolled Steel being BAR 4 or 5. In fact, in some variations of the TechManual BAR 8 doesn't exist until post space flight
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Karagin
06/03/16 06:44 AM
61.40.222.5
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Actually it has an armored cab now and it not a kit anymore. The idea of having two armor class types for vehicles is pointless, using the logic of this then light mechs should have different level of armor type vs medium mech etc...
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Shadrak
06/03/16 03:19 PM
70.194.209.9
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Quote:
Karagin writes:
Actually it has an armored cab now and it not a kit anymore. The idea of having two armor class types for vehicles is pointless, using the logic of this then light mechs should have different level of armor type vs medium mech etc...
The BAR 10 Armor is part of what a Battle mech and combat vehicle is. Primitives and retro tech might use low BAR armor.
Industrial mech and support vehicles use BAR armor with BAR 10 being the equivalent of normal armor. Battle Armor is, based on rules, effectively BAR 7 armor.
Anyway, BAR makes sense, but it does complicate gameplay.
Question, will a 105mm tank round defeat the armor on your truck? Will it defeat the armor on an M60 Patton? Will it defeat the armor on an M1A1 Abrams? Yes, yes, and no...and it it not simply a function of weight and thickness of the material...
Do I think BAR is the best way to represent this? No...but it is something that should be represented. It probably would have been better to have only 3-6 classifucations, not 10.
Have you designed a lot of support vehicles for the game? Armor weighs different amounts based on tech level and bar level, and armored support vehicles add even more chassis weight. It become much more efficient to build combat vehicles, but it is not cost effective and, based on the game fiction, it appears that these require special manufacturing capabilities...
Your armored cargo truck, however, is based a lot on commercial vehicle components. An MRAP is a commercial vehicle modified for military use. So I am trying to represent an environment where a planet has a population of 1 billion people but lacking combat vehicle construction capability...in a high threat environment, assuming you couldn't purchase a mech or combat vehicle, what would you do? Would you weaponize civilian vehicles? How would you do it? Throw rolled steel (BAR 5) on a heavy truck chassis, install radios, weapons, and targeting systems? If 5 of these vehicles could take out a mech, would it make sense to field them?
If not, then why does the game structure have regiments and regiments of infantry? Why does the SLDF have an army that is 100 times larger than the armies 9f the successor states on 2750? Where are the threats that justify this massive military build up and did they only exist during the star page Era or did they preferdate it?
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ghostrider
06/03/16 03:41 PM
66.74.61.223
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You can base some of this issue with todays real life.
How long did it take to get body armor to our troops in the middle east?
Money is supposedly what prevented that. And as the game tag says, "life is cheap, battle mechs aren't."
The fact any of the militaries would put armor on support vehicles is a bit of a shock. Only those designed to support combat, like coolant trucks would be considered valuable enough to bother with it. Simple things like moving food or even building supplies is beyond what alot of commanders would consider worth it.
The money is better spent elsewhere, like their diners with state leaders. Or their mistresses.
And as it was brought up before, desperate people will arm what ever they have to fight with.
Weither it is smart to use full mech armor, or just something to stop a simple .22 slug thrower depends on who is paying for it.
The question about the size of armies, I believe predates the star league. The hemegony had set limits to avoid further revolts from the colonies, so needed the larger armor to keep the 'outsiders' in line. It was that way in colonization of the earth and doubt it would ever stop with humans.
If you want to really be nasty, the cost of the armies is why the colonies rebelled. They were paying to have the armies sit in their home towns. But that is being a little harsh on the army leaders 
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Shadrak
06/03/16 04:21 PM
70.194.209.9
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The problem with that explanation is you have a population of billions with capacity to make what amounts to cheap military vehicles. A 20 ton armored truck with two or three rocket launchers and a machine gun could seriously worry a locust, especially if you used 10 or 20 of them...
And when the hegemony retracted, there were MANY planets and collectives with a need for security vehicles...
As far as pricing, the cost of arming a firetruck is negligible compared to the truck itself...base truck is about 100,000 cbills...fire equipment 25,000 to 100,000 (sprayers, etc)....armed with a medium rifle and BAR 6 or 7 armor, you are looking at about the same cost.
Battle mech don't make a lot of sense in a universe with combat vehicles....they make a good deal more sense in a universe of armed support vehicles.
Infantry platoons also don't make a lot of sense in the current battle tech universe....the cost of equipping a platoon is about the same as a 15-ton or 20-ton armed support vehicle, and the vehicle is considerably more effective in engaging enemy units.
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ghostrider
06/03/16 06:23 PM
66.74.61.223
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Unless you have a pirate problem, why would you be wasting money on military?
Well other then having issues with Terra and what organizations is running it at the time.
Read an article about some small country that was going to pay their years gdp to have a politician speak in their country. I want to say it was like 536 thousand dollars. And factor in things like even with a billion or so people, not all words has the amenities of earth. Most had to import things, some needed water. Even 50,000 dollars is more then alot would have available to spend on defense. Hell, some were company owned communities that were left on their own when the companies pulled out. But that is off track a little.
And why bother with mobile platforms when you only needed to guard a few areas? Towers would be the best thing there, as they are easier to maintain.
And yes. They would make vehicles to protect themselves. Normal jeeps and halftracks would work fine in most cases. Even making military specific units is more possible to more industrious planets.
The response was more the support your use of different armors then argue against it.
And Karagin. The a10 uses a titanium tub the pilot sits in, but yet uses different armor for the rest of the air craft.
I can definitely see someone using better armor to protect the crew then the rest of the unit. Most would go the cheap route and hire new people once the olds ones die. Bottom line is more important the workers.
Someone will always hire in, since they need money. That's why the rich love when poverty is high. No worries about labor unions or even government agencies. No one will complain.
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Shadrak
06/04/16 03:42 PM
70.198.73.81
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You are certainly right about the cost and justification of a militia army, but FASA did not create a true futuristic dystopia, and later license holders exacerbated the problem by adding information that makes small militaries anachronistic. And towers would be efficient, so they could be an option as well....
Buy there are 5 trillion humans on 3000 planets across the inner sphere...that's an average of 1.6 billion per planet. Assuming a gdp of 16 trillion cbills pet planet and that taxes generated on that gdp amounted to 1.6 trillion cbills and that the military is allocated 2% of taxes or .2% of GDP you have a 32 billion chill defense budget. S9 most planets could field a marginal militia...
Now, would you want to? During the Age of War, certainly (where are these designs, by the way?). Prior to reunification, Periphery would want to have military equipment.
In a truly feudal system, local lords would want forces to protect their power from citizens, other nobles, and even their leige lord. If your leige lord restricted access to battle mechs, you would probably want some alternative to give you a fighting chance against regular house horses. If your fellow vassal Lords had access to military equipment that you would want to have access to military equipment as well, and you would want to increase your power relative to the othervassal lords to protect your Holdings.
And you mention piratesomething and, by implication, external threats from invasion by regular successor house armies. .
But military power is also a sign of government legitimacy (military parades), national pride, and government legitimacy.
Speaking of a feudal governing system...does it even make sense with current BT fiction?
Edited by Shadrak (06/04/16 03:48 PM)
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ghostrider
06/04/16 07:53 PM
66.74.61.223
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Now now. Making sense is not part of the game.
But I do agree they would want some sort of force just to protect their butts.
I will say, I was thinking of the backwater worlds where they were lighter in pop and things that didn't bring in much money.
But I agree. The issue goes hand in hand. Less money, more jury rigging equipment. More money for military would mean more likely of having better equipment. Also some cheaper leaders trying to pad their pockets would use lower (cheaper) grade materials in their forces. I mean, you can always bribe your way offworld if your forces fail.
Another issue is the way they make you feel about alot of planets in the innersphere. It sound like only a dozen per house have anything about anvils and hammers for tech. Welding steel plates to commercial vehicles is more likely then buying the expensive armors for use. I would expect some cheap tanks to be around. Maybe for the royal guards, while the rest of the planet had the iron sighted mgs, and cannons in plate welded commercial vehicles.
But this is only a small idea of what could be there.
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Karagin
06/04/16 09:13 PM
61.40.222.5
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See this is where things go down hill, I want to play Battletech, where you have mechs and vehicles that give each other a challenge and the mechs have the top dog slot since they are biped and can move around more, not logical but hey its' a game, and the vehicles don't die with one hit, granted that happens even with the normal rules for the vehicles, BUT using BAR, well you might as well be playing ClikyTech.
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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happyguy49
06/05/16 05:13 AM
98.30.242.159
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If the game of Battletech is "fixed" to make it more realistic, it would completely break all the thousands of pages of interesting fluff and make it incompatible with the fictional universe.
If the "fluff", or fictional universe is "fixed" to make it more realistic, it breaks the game.
I think yall should stop trying to do EITHER. Just play the games, enjoy the fiction, and accept that they can't really be reconciled consistently.
I remember a post, I mean like 15 YEARS ago or so, on some other now long-defunct BT forum, by somebody I can't remember.. he said, "Battletech isn't the future. It's the future of the '80's." Truer words never said
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Cray
06/05/16 11:58 AM
72.189.109.30
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Quote:
happyguy49 writes:
I remember a post, I mean like 15 YEARS ago or so, on some other now long-defunct BT forum, by somebody I can't remember.. he said, "Battletech isn't the future. It's the future of the '80's." Truer words never said
That's repeated in A Time of War, actually, when giving GM's advice on how to fill in technological blanks when PCs wander somewhere new and interesting in BT.
Mike Miller, Materials Engineer
Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
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Shadrak
06/05/16 04:20 PM
69.214.171.2
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Quote:
Karagin writes:
See this is where things go down hill, I want to play Battletech, where you have mechs and vehicles that give each other a challenge and the mechs have the top dog slot since they are biped and can move around more, not logical but hey its' a game, and the vehicles don't die with one hit, granted that happens even with the normal rules for the vehicles, BUT using BAR, well you might as well be playing ClikyTech.
See, when I play with my group we normally have a fully developed environment with a history, road to war, PMESII-PT analytical model built.
Our logistical and infrastructure requirements for our deploying forces are also assessed.
Imagine it is the 4th succession war and your COMPANY of Battlemechs must conduct a raid on a planet with a population of 500 million...this planet is earthlike...70% water and 30% land area...how densely populated is it? Is it mostly self sufficient? How far apart are the resources and industries spaced? How far apart are the population centers?
Let's imagine that the GDP of this planet is 5 trillion c-bills...there must be some kind of economic activity beyond dirt farming to generate 10,000 cbills in income for the average resident. What are these industries? Germanium mining? Fossil fuels? Industrial Farming?
There must be several things of value, several industrial centers. .are they within a 100 km radius on this earth sized planet? If so, 1 battalion of mechs might protect it. If not, you will need something to transport the mechs (dropships, air transports, rail ways) to get your mechs to the fight before the Raiders execute a combat drop secure the goods and reload a VSTOL dropship...
The entire window for a raid like this, after it defeats your air power, is probably less than 12 hours...so something to fix the raiders or slow the raiders would be helpful.
Now, lets imagine you have a battalion of vedette tanks defending a major pass to a high value target in an area that doesn't allow for a combat drop. Those vedette have an operational range somewhere around 500km...so if you are trying to deploy them to the pass while the attackers are burning in from their jump points, you will need some way to deliver fuel.
So, when we begin a scenario we normally have an order of battle that includes support units so that our battalion of 36 mech can effectively defend an area the size of Texas against am enemy that can conduct a combat drop from a union dropship or that can land a dropship 100 km from am objective and march in to secure the target before our forces can travel the 500 km from their bases to the target (assuming our bn is responsible for an area the size if texas, 500 km is not absurd).
Anyway, it is how you play I guess, and our scenarios tend to be fairly detailed. I know that not everyone plays that way, but sending a Spider off to kill 10 or 15 fuel trucks in our games can prevent an effective counter attack or prevent an armor unit from reinforcing a defending unit.
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ghostrider
06/05/16 06:21 PM
66.74.61.223
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I agree, that is a little more detailed then some like to play, but it is very much based in reality. The illusion that you have all this stuff at your fingertips for just snapping your fingers is why most don't understand some of the problems. As there is no real running time or range limit to a fusion reactor, people forget things like fuel depots are needed, and without then, ICEs aren't going to be used as much.
It would be interesting to see just how involved your group is with this. A simple mission to remove the fuel depot might very well stop counter attacks or even proper defenses. Even cargo haulers using ice fuel would stop.
And figuring out what is worth it, or where things are located depends on things like resources themselves. A gold mine is probably not going to be in the middle of a farm. And uranium would kill those in that area after a while.
Defiance industries is a good example of that. Most are after the factories, so the farms on the planet are left alone for the most part. So a rifle platoon might be all needed to patrol the farmlands. Well with appropriate vehicles.
The factories would have the lions share of defenders as well as almost all the anti air. Even capital weapons would be smart to put there.
With the example of Texas, if you goal is to stop oil pumping, that is going to take a while and alot of traveling. I would think light fast vehicles would be more efficient, but most would prefer to run mechs. Problem is, you don't know defenses, so trying to say spiders are all you need is not smart. You may come up against some towers or vehicles that would stop a spider easily.
I do like the prep work though. Knowing what you have where makes it more interesting when you play a campaign. Depriving the german war machine of fuel went a long way to helping end he war quicker in wwII.
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Shadrak
06/05/16 10:08 PM
70.208.128.200
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Quote:
ghostrider writes:
I agree, that is a little more detailed then some like to play, but it is very much based in reality. The illusion that you have all this stuff at your fingertips for just snapping your fingers is why most don't understand some of the problems. As there is no real running time or range limit to a fusion reactor, people forget things like fuel depots are needed, and without then, ICEs aren't going to be used as much.
It would be interesting to see just how involved your group is with this. A simple mission to remove the fuel depot might very well stop counter attacks or even proper defenses. Even cargo haulers using ice fuel would stop.
And figuring out what is worth it, or where things are located depends on things like resources themselves. A gold mine is probably not going to be in the middle of a farm. And uranium would kill those in that area after a while.
Defiance industries is a good example of that. Most are after the factories, so the farms on the planet are left alone for the most part. So a rifle platoon might be all needed to patrol the farmlands. Well with appropriate vehicles.
The factories would have the lions share of defenders as well as almost all the anti air. Even capital weapons would be smart to put there.
With the example of Texas, if you goal is to stop oil pumping, that is going to take a while and alot of traveling. I would think light fast vehicles would be more efficient, but most would prefer to run mechs. Problem is, you don't know defenses, so trying to say spiders are all you need is not smart. You may come up against some towers or vehicles that would stop a spider easily.
I do like the prep work though. Knowing what you have where makes it more interesting when you play a campaign. Depriving the german war machine of fuel went a long way to helping end he war quicker in wwII.
We have become more and more involved as different players challenge different aspects of scenarios...the ICE example is just one part of it...it comes from a player launching a diversionary attack on a target (mining area with valuable minerals-palladium, etc) plotted about 350 km from their primary target, an urban area hosting an information center with accounting records). The defender sent their Vedettes in to defend because they had higher speed than the attackers and could beat them to the target...the battle resulted in the three mechs (grasshopper, jump capable thunderbolt, and jump capable catapult) retreating along rough terrain that the vedette company could not follow. Defender chose to use civilian excavation equipment to dig in 4 of his vedettes with good overwatch of the avenues of approach. The remaining vedettes would serve as a quick reaction force to react in the event of a counterattack attack or the arrival of the remainder of the attackers mech company.
The attacker chose to attack his primary target, a heavy building in the heart of a city. The city defenders included an infantry battalion and a medium mech lance. The defender had a mech company posted 500 km away, and the defender discovered the attackers forces when they were about 150 km away from the city (area of mostly open grassland with some woods and a river crossing) Vedette had a straight shot on a major highway...so defender looked to move 4 of his vedettes to reinforce city defenders. Attacker challenged saying the vedettes would not have fuel. Defender eventually countered that the mining area had equipment using similar fuel mixtures and vedettea could refuel there, but this did mean that we now needed to consider road networks and fuel in our scenario planning.
From there, we have been looking at more opportunities to make it interesting. One attacker liked to pack his dropship with conventional aircraft and tag equipped light vehicles and infantry. Defender didn't want to allocate a large portion of his force to anti air assets, so he began using AA support vehicles with 2 Ultra AC2s (I have a version of this). I think it is 28 tons and moves 4/6 and is relatively cheap, but it helps him counter aircraft carrying Arrow and bombs/air deployed minefields.
Another attacker knew the defender was operating from a defensive position in a forested area. Attacker inquired about defender life sustainment activities...and then attacked the water and fuel convoys supplying the defenders. Defenders inquired about the range of attacker comms...then destroyed the attackers retransmission units so that the attackers had no comms.
So, it has grown more and more...players want to know about local civilian comms systems etc etc...player 1 uses insecure civilian comms in scenario 1, player 2 has a way to listen in on those comms by scenario 2.
New rule books help and the wiki is great for ideas and answers, but players are always looking for a leg up whenever a scenario builder creates a restriction.
New questio: How do you defend a land area the size of Asia with 36 battlemechs? Or even a regimental combat team?
Another question, how long are defenders in a defensive posture? Do they get rest time? Food? Recreation? Do they have families? Do families live near where they are stationed/deployed?
Edited by Shadrak (06/05/16 10:40 PM)
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ghostrider
06/05/16 10:30 PM
66.74.61.223
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You defend with a wish spell.
And part of what you describe drives me nuts about some games. I can understand the mine having some fuel for the generators and such, but they should not carry enough to run the units back to the city. So I agree with that.
Though I am wondering why the one person didn't call for an inferno airstrike on the forest and just start burning it. Take out anyone that comes to put it out. Might be too long to run.
And wouldn't the mechs look for bridges to take out that the tanks would need? Granted that would mean the mine is in an area that needed bridges to get to.
Another thing would have been to blast holes in the highway if you could. I would ask if it was open plains or something else, but this is getting to much into it. A forested area would to fine, as you can force the vehicles to travel thru rubble or get stuck in the forest. Another possible counter is mining the highway.
An RTC has potential, but you have to limit what you can protect. If you have maybe 12 cities or places of interest, it is easier then having hundreds of spots where a single unit is stationed. Hot drops are an issue, but most would not risk it.
But it does sound like some of the people I played with in Phoenix. That is where the lam issue came from.
But I do like having more options. Do you use spec ops teams?
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Shadrak
06/06/16 01:03 AM
70.208.128.200
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We do use different types of spec ops depending on player and scenario. In one scenario a pharmaceutical company operating on a planet wants to eliminate control the local warlord is exerting on them. They hire PCs to recover some of their captured personnel and the PCs and the corporate security assist free farmers (using infantry and field guns as well as ared SUVs) attack the warlords forces. Warlord had a 3025 mech company and an assortment (about 200) armored support vehicles. Farmers had to be engaged and persuaded to launch a diversionary attack on the Warlord's shipping center so PCs could get to the detention facility.
In other cases, player had to destroy a specific target and used battle armor equipped troops with aerospace fighters delivering arrow iv.
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happyguy49
06/06/16 06:12 AM
98.30.242.159
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Quote:
Shadrak writes:
New questio: How do you defend a land area the size of Asia with 36 battlemechs? Or even a regimental combat team?
Interesting question. An area that large? Unless there is only one or two things on the continent worth defending you are better off parking your 36 mechs in orbit. On a small space station in LEO you should be over your enemies every 90 minutes or so. This will vary a fair amount on the size of the world, and how long its day is.
Drop them out the space station with coccoons to where they are needed. At the longest, you could have your battalion of mechs be where they are needed in an hour and a half. This is vulnerable to a feint though, if the enemy splits his forces and hits his ACTUAL target after the defenders have dropped to deal with the feint.
..if you have the resources, a station in geosynchronous orbit directly above the center of your Asia-sized continent, with an Overlord or three Unions to get them down or to take them to a high-altitude drop, would get you there faster than 90 minutes I think.
Either station needs to have a grav deck (to prevent muscle atrophy) and a shuttle to rotate crew and warriors. Side note: WE NEED RULES FOR SPINNING STATIONS! Even a somewhat small station could get away without needing a grav deck, if it is the right shape, (a spinning rod, or cross, or wheel, or cylinder). Current rules require grav decks in stations if you don't want the crews bones to turn to mush, this is bunk.
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ghostrider
06/06/16 11:51 AM
66.74.61.223
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That would be something. Though it might be easier to leave the units in drop pods on the dropships then moving them to the ships after you find an enemy. Though fighters would be the idea for orbital defenses. Delay the drops or even take down invading ships.
Any defense forces are vulnerable to the fients. On land it would be easy to drop a decoy on the far said of the land and hit once the mechs were moving out.
An RTC helps lessen this, as you have more troops and tanks you can station across the area, but this does show a problem with some defensive ideas on worlds. Asia might be a good sized continent on earth, but compared to others. It is small.
Now there is some issues with spinning stations and doing things. Orientation compared to perception of people like gunners. What is up? Top of the station?
You will be walking on the walls instead of a normal deck. So looking down is actually looking out. Training will help overcome this, so it isn't the end all issue.
Along with that, trying to target things will be even more complicated, though spheroid dropships don't really deal with this. Your ship is moving along a specific point of view. How fast does it turn? Can you fire all weapons towards a ship coming in from one direction, as no all the weapons might have a firing solution. Or spin to fast and not be able to target well.
But that is something to clear up if they do come out with rules like this.
As a side note, it will be a little more expensive to do so, but I would suggest splitting shift changes, so only half are being changed out. Helps avoid attacks during those change. You know when everyone is in the shuttle bay wanting to go home, or just getting off the shuttle.
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