AmaroqStarwind
04/21/18 10:24 PM
174.235.17.105
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So, I just want to put it out there that Heavy Lasers kinda suck, but so far I haven't really found any ways to make them better without also making them unbalanced.
I was wondering if anyone on here had an ideas that could make them better. Thoughts?
One thought I had initially was making them Heat-Inducing weapons, but then that would be stepping on both Plasma Rifles and on Flamers. Another thought I had was making them function more like Ultra Autocannons, where it is a standard laser that can fire more than once in a single turn at the risk of overheating (and thus temporarily putting itself out of commission while it cools), but at the same time, that seems more like a Pulse Laser thing.
As I said, I would like to hear everyone's thoughts on this. What would you do to make Heavy Lasers better, but hopefully not overpowered?
Discord: Amaroq the Kitsune#1092
Telegram: @Lycanphoenix
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Retry
04/22/18 12:03 AM
64.189.130.11
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Increase the tonnage on the Large by 1 ton and retcon the heavy/Improved heavy series as IS weaponry.
There's very little breathing room or niche for heavy lasers in Clantech.
The SHL has to compete with the ERSL, which has twice the range, more accurate at all ranges, and produces 1 less heat for a single point less damage (5 vs 6). As such, the SHL struggles to out-DPS the ERSL at range 1 (and often doesn't, depending on the to-hit number) and loses out rapidly as ranges increase. The cERSL isn't even considered to be a particularly good weapon as it's so short ranged.
The MHL competes with some of the most effective and efficient clan weapons available: the cERML and cMPL. Both outrange the MHL, both run much cooler, both take up only 1 crit slot as opposed to the MHL's 2, both are more accurate at all range brackets (cMPL especially), and 7 damage isn't all that far off from the MHL's 10 damage. The ultimate result is that the MHL also struggles to achieve a favorable DPS over both the ERML and MPL at short ranges in addition to lacking the versatility of either weapon.
The LHL has to compete with not just the cERLL and cLPL, but the cERPPC as well. This time, the LHL has a significant damage buff over the clan lasers (16 points vs 10 points), and so it can headcap mechs and insta-gib Heavy BA (which neither LPL nor ERLL can do), so let's primarily compare it to the cERPPC. The cERPPC has only 1 less point of damage and 2 tons for 1 less critical, 3 less heat, far better range brackets and more accuracy across every single one of them. Compared to the cERPPC, the LHL once again struggles to out-DPS its competition at its most optimum (short range) brackets, which I'm pretty sure the LHL can only do so at something absurdly low TH numbers like 3's or 2's.
I've only ever been able to find two real roles for two of the lasers: The MHL can be combined with a clan flamer on a vehicle with a standard fusion engine for an extremely powerful punch for only 1.5 tons. The LHL can be stuffed on a very light (20t if not lighter) Clan battlemech with DHS for a very light headcapping weapon. That's about it.
But if you make the Heavy series IS weapons, suddenly they just make sense.
A SHL is now basically an IS SL, with more than double the heat and a slight cost in accuracy for double damage, and fits well in the IS paradigm.
A MHL is now basically an IS ML, with more than double the heat, more bulk, and a slight cost in accuracy for double damage, and fits well in the IS paradigm.
A LHL is now basically an IS LL, with more than double the heat, more bulk, and a slight cost in accuracy for double damage, and fits well in the IS paradigm.
The SHL competes well with its IS competition (other small lasers and variants) without displacing them entirely.
The MHL competes well with its IS competition (medium lasers and variants) without displacing them entirely.
The LHL competes well with its IS competition (large lasers and PPC variants) without displacing them entirely (well, except the Blazer, but that one was rather awful anyways).
Call the lasers a Federated Suns invention that's rushed to the front during the Clan invasion or something. Existing stock IS designs could be modified fairly easily with these lasers.
Install some DHS on a Phoenix Hawk and you can get a very worrying LHL head capper on a venerable chassis. Same with the Thunderbolt. Exchange that ML on the Shadow Hawk with a Heavy variant, even without DHS, and it sucks a bit less. Pretty much all the oversinked bug mechs like the Locust, Stinger, and Wasp can substantially benefit from upgrading to a Heavy laser.
So to "improve" heavy lasers, I wouldn't really change the lasers themselves, I'd just change who has them so that the people inventing them and putting them in production actually have a compelling reason to do so.
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AmaroqStarwind
04/22/18 05:31 AM
174.235.17.105
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So basically, making them available to both technology bases? I can get behind that.
I guess while we're on that line of thought, maybe change Chemical Lasers to Primitive/RetroTech, instead of Clan Tech.
I also find it funny that you mention the Binary Laser, because that is actually a perfect candidate for just taking the Large Laser and then giving it Ultra Autocannon mechanics. That also means you could make Binary versions of all the other Laser weapons.
- - - -
(Option 1)
Another alternate rule for Heavies that I thought of a while ago; why not treat them the same as Armor Piercing ammunition for Autocannons?
(Option 2)
If the Heat Inducing option sounds more appetizing, though, then maybe make it just 1 Point for Small, 1d3 –1 Points (min 1) for Medium, and 1d3 + 1 Points for Large. This would mean that actual Flamers and the various Plasma weapons are still relevant.
(Option 3)
Finally, if instead just taking the simpler route where Heavies become Inner Sphere weapons, then for the Clan versions you could increase the range to better keep up with their ER cousins. The whole driving principle behind Heavy Lasers is just pumping more power into the beam, something that Clan ER Lasers could handle fairly well.
Discord: Amaroq the Kitsune#1092
Telegram: @Lycanphoenix
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