ghostrider
07/23/17 03:53 PM
66.74.61.223
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Thought a threat discussing things that come up, and find out what others think about how to handle them.
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ghostrider
07/23/17 03:58 PM
66.74.61.223
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Scenario. Use any mechs you want, though the example is a normal 3025 panther, with a locust that has a pair of ams instead of the mgs. They are looking for a mech reported in their AO, and going the speed of the panthers walk.
They crest a ridge with the locust 2 hexes forward, and off to one side of the panther when they find an archer.
The archer sends 40 missiles towards the pair of mech, but only one 20 pack is targeted at each mech.
Would you allow the locust to use the ams on both missile groups, as they are pretty close together and in the general line of fire for both? Or stick with defending against the 20 that are locked onto the locust?
This is not asking if the ams can fire 2 times, but one ams per each 20 flight.
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happyguy49
07/29/17 07:53 AM
196.54.41.23
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RE Ghost AMS hypothetical:
If this were a game with players doing a campaign or otherwise using RPG elements, I would allow it but require a skill roll for the system they are trying to manually override to protect the lancemate with. (strict book rules don't allow that iirc)
There is even a new system that is designed to overcome the shortcoming of the standard and laser AMS (that shortcoming being the inability to use the system to protect an ally)
http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Advanced_Point_Defense_System
I only know about it from the wiki, I don't yet own Interstellar Operations.
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Wrangler
07/31/17 09:33 AM
137.71.220.54
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I thought AMS handles attacks per weapon system. If they have 2 AMS your should be able to destroy each volley. I need re-read the TW again see if it's combined both AMS. Which i think was done for balancing purposes, but i don't got the books in front of me.
When it hits the fan, make sure your locked, loaded, and ready to go!
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ghostrider
08/18/17 01:58 AM
66.74.61.223
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Since no one else seems to want to say anything, I will let you know how we handled it.
This case came about from a bad sensor roll. The two light mechs were not supposed to be surprised by the archer like that, so we agreed that the ams would be allowed to split between the two volleys, but only this time.
As it was, the locust went down from a thru armor crit to the gyro. It was hurt, but wasn't in a good position. The panther was in better shape, but was the target of the both lrms the next round.
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ghostrider
05/25/18 02:30 AM
66.74.61.223
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Had a game a while ago, where we decided the Concordat had a civil war, and two sides had control of one factory. We allowed 6 mechs and 4 vehicles to be produced from each factory in a campaign. We allocated resources so both sides knew what they could make with it, and put up a few mines. Each side was using IS units, though we did allow league tech.
During this campaign, we had found one scenario force us to declare what weapon hit first.
The situation came up as one of the mechs the was sent in to use a c3 slave to help his team mates combine fire on some units. Well it came down to the unit had 15 points left on their left torso. In that turn, he got hit by a Gauss rifle hit and chunks from an lb20x cannon.
The 15 was rolled first for damage, even though it was the second unit that hit. It is important, as the third piece from the 20x caused a critical that destroyed the ammo bin in that side. It turns out, this one shot ended the campaign, as they were defending their factories from the other side. The loss of the c3 network as this went down, allowed the other side to seize the factory. The battle was a nasty one from the start, and well played by both sides. But this one issue ended the campaign.
We decided after it was over and we discussed it, to name the order in which units would do the damage.
Has anyone had an issue like this?
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wolf_lord_30
05/25/18 08:51 AM
74.214.54.153
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You roll for hits and damage in the same order that you declared them in the beginning of the firing phase. So when you declare a mech, you are also declaring the exact order of the weapons being fired on that mech.
If they have 15 points of armor left and you shoot an ac20 and a medium laser, make sure you declare the ac20 first. That way you will get 2 chances for a critical hit instead of one.
So in your example above, if the order that the weapons were declared was Gauss rifle and then LB 20X, there was no problem. But if the LB 20X was declared first, that damage should have been resolved before the Gauss rifle was rolled to hit and do damage. Also, for further clarification, the c3 wouldn't have gone down until the start of next turn, allowing the defending side to get one turn of use.
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ghostrider
05/26/18 04:23 PM
66.74.61.223
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The problem stemmed from using multiple dice, of different colors. So when you got 6 or seven sets of dice being rolled to speed up the game, sometimes you run into the issue of dealing with things in order.
Up until a few games prior, you rolled the weapon, then the damage. So most would just go down their list of weapons. It wasn't a pick this to see if it hits, then use this weapon. It got annoying when people were firing weapons they normally wouldn't since they didn't hit with something before hand. And it slowed down the game even more as well as cause the arguments of sticking with what you said you will fire.
And a few times, the weapon in question was 'forgotten' to be marked down as destroyed as crits or limb being gone were done.
The issue wasn't the turn it was destroyed, but the fact the ammo explosion destroyed it. The person would have been safe, as the units that hit him were destroyed that round. The issue came about as the mech was the spotter for others. Yeah, the torso damage would have had them pull back, but by then, the network was disrupted. The stupid thing was, his right side was untouched.
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wolf_lord_30
05/28/18 09:39 AM
74.214.54.153
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Yeah, speeding up the game might cause some confusion as to what hits first, etc. However, as far as people shooting different weapons than declared, I hate being a rules lawyer, but the Warhammer background I have grates at people changing the rules to suit their current situation. That just needs to be addressed in a firm manner before the game begins.
An easy answer to forgetting things or even marking down the order of weapons being shot is contact paper and vis a vis (west erase) pens. It works better than pencils and erasers.
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ghostrider
07/09/18 11:32 PM
66.74.61.223
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The question came up as to if the A.E.S system would work for pill boxes or even full turrets.
The discussion came about as someone suggested, you can mount mech arms on turrets for weapons, such as a rifleman's arm.
Other then the rules not saying one way or another, that we could could find, the logic does seem to say it should be allowed.
As myomers can be used to flip arms, it would still be limited to only several arcs, but when firing from a cliff side, that shouldn't matter. You wouldn't be firing into the cliff.
The only real thing we could come up with is limiting the weapons to the 100 ton arm. Which if not lifting items not mounted to it, calls into question just what a mech can lift in arm mounted weapons. The panther and the ppc comes to mind here, though there are plenty others that could be used.
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ghostrider
08/14/18 08:47 PM
66.74.61.223
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The conversation came around to missiles and ams.
It was proposed that it be allowed to use MGs and pulse lasers against missile fire to take them down like the ams does.
It was suggested that the ONLY fire on the missiles with no other targets to even try.
The initial thought was 11+ just to hit.
Then it was suggested the more mgs/pulse lasers you have, the more likely you will hit something. We thought for every 5 of the types to use, would make it +1 easier to engage them.
It is something we are thinking about, but not sure. Doing this benefits the ones 55 ton mg'er, as well as detracts from the ams system itself.
But it does have some merit. You fire as much as you can in front of a missile strike and something is bout to hit.
The thought of ultras being in here was declined as you could not move them enough to cover a pattern, even with the ultra mode on.
The thought of using lbx cannons is questionable as well.
The pulse would not gain their -2 to hit like this.
And we thought for every 5 of the types to use, would make it +1 easier to engage them.
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happyguy49
08/15/18 05:35 AM
196.52.39.33
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Might be an interesting hail-mary house rule, you are right to make it 11+ though. Absent luck even the twichiest 14 year old humans just couldn't aim fast enough and well enough to shootdown missiles. That's why irl the Iron Dome, Phalanx CIWS, etc. are all automated systems.
I did not like how the (early oughts??) rule revision sort of nerfed the AMS systems though. Now you only get a -2 on the cluster hits table?? Lame. Used to be you could hit as many as 12 missiles (2d6, clan system) of an incoming flight; if you had a good roll you could shootdown everything except an LRM 15 or 20. You could even mount multiple AMS systems and set them to fire in sequence, making a unit damn near invulnerable to all but the most massive missile attacks.
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ghostrider
08/15/18 11:46 AM
66.74.61.223
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I agree it was screwed up, they nerfed the AMS. With the laser based system, no ammo loads, so it becomes an almost required system on units.
As was said. Putting something in the path of the oncoming missiles, with enough fire, something should hit. The -2 on the cluster hits might work with this, as opposed to the ability to destroy any flight of srm 2. Any more then that, wouldn't happen. And that is even considering luck doing a chain reaction to the missiles.
It is still in the debate phase. Ideas, comments, complaints would be nice.
And we originally thought to make it a 12 to hit. But with that, most wouldn't even bother. Holding off all attacks except that? Might was well try to take down the unit firing.
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ghostrider
09/08/18 12:07 AM
66.74.61.223
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Did the rules ever cover a small hole in the use of pods on mechs?
How compatible are they?
Can I take one from a clan omni and use it in an innersphere omni?
If so, does that mean I get a clan case with zero crits for free, as all clan pods are considered to have them?
This came up, and it sounds solid that you should, as I haven't seen anything suggesting the pods are that different.
We believe the implication is the IS omni pods are based on the clan ones, so the hook ups would be the same.
This isn't about the clan weapons/sinks being lighter and less crits, but the case being the focus of this thought.
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