Orbital Bombardment

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TRYCORP
06/16/02 02:13 PM
172.132.227.21

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Hey, some guy asked me about an idea of how to finish a campaign with a bang, and I figured, ORBITAL BOMBARDMENT! I want to take out a whole company with a Cameron Class Cruiser. Now, Can I do it?
"Machine Guns! Thats a Summoner out there! Do you plan to punch little holes in it, and have it fall down from too much ventilation!?!"

TRYCORP
Clan Nova Cat
CrayModerator
06/16/02 03:05 PM
12.91.128.157

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Yes. The rules are in BS and AT2 (which have differing rules). Just avoid civilian targets and you shouldn't get any major power too pissy.
Mike Miller, Materials Engineer

Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
Kottos
06/17/02 09:01 PM
12.90.0.63

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Well, the Cameron packs enough firepower in one broadside to level most of a mapsheet. I expect it could destroy a mech company easily enough.
Acolyte
06/18/02 05:14 AM
64.180.255.235

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cough, cough, sumofallfears, cough, cough.

Light a fire for a man, and you keep him warm for one night,
Light a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
Acolyte
CrayModerator
06/18/02 06:46 AM
64.83.29.242

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1) Nukes on inhabited planets violate the Ares Conventions and get people in all power groups riled.
2) There are more and better developed rules for orbital bombardment than nukes.
3) Orbital bombardment away from civilies doesn't annoy as many people as nukes.
Mike Miller, Materials Engineer

Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
TRYCORP
06/22/02 06:59 PM
172.141.47.33

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Well, that doesn't matter cuz we will all be dead anyway, so why should we care? heh However, Should I just say that the attack hit that sheet? (god complex comes in here) Because it could miss, and how can I tell if there are any survivors? (It would be neat if one poor green jenner pilot made it)
"Machine Guns! Thats a Summoner out there! Do you plan to punch little holes in it, and have it fall down from too much ventilation!?!"

TRYCORP
Clan Nova Cat
CrayModerator
06/22/02 08:28 PM
12.91.121.98

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>However, Should I just say that the attack hit that sheet?

The explosion isn't THAT big in AT2. In Hex 0, IIRC, you multiply capital damage by 10. A NAC/30 would do 300pts of damage (applied in 5pt groups) in the hex that was hit. The surrounding ring of hexes would take x8 damage (240pts for a NAC/30). The next ring out would take x6 (180pts for a NAC/30), then x4, x2, and then nothing.

The burst is 9 hexes in diameter, which will not cover a full board by any means. Light naval weapons - like naval lasers - are quite survivable. Capital missiles cannot target the ground at all. Single heavy naval PPCs should be survivable to assault mechs even at ground zero, as should light NACs.
Mike Miller, Materials Engineer

Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
NathanKell
06/22/02 09:41 PM
24.44.238.62

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Man, I keep forgetting how much AT2 toned down those rules: Invisible barriers at 5 hexes...5pt clusters...pshaw.
In BattleSpace, damage from the attacking Capital Bay (not weapon; bay) is reduced 20pts per hex away from ground zero. The only protection is if LOS is traced through a Level 2 (or higher) hill; targets with that in the way are "shadowed" and don't take damage. Note that woods does *not* provide cover.
Furthermore, the target(s) in the impact hex take damage as if punched...in the back! (Mwahaha.) Targets outside the impact hex take damage as if the attack originated in the impact hex.
-NathanKell, BT Space Wars
Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason, than that of blind-folded fear.
Thomas Jefferson
TRYCORP
06/23/02 03:37 PM
172.140.72.21

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So in other words, Mechs can survive it, but its still a B***** for um'? What about Naval Guass Rifles (If they have them) and can't I just throw some White Shars(I think thats there names) Out the airlock in the map sheets direction?
"Machine Guns! Thats a Summoner out there! Do you plan to punch little holes in it, and have it fall down from too much ventilation!?!"

TRYCORP
Clan Nova Cat
CrayModerator
06/23/02 03:57 PM
12.91.128.45

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Capital Missiles, including White Sharks, cannot be used for orbital bombardment. I guess they skimped on heat shields despite the dozens of tons available on the missiles.

Every other capital scale weapon WITH the range to reach through the atmosphere can be used for orbital bombardment. This includes the mediocre naval gauss rifles.

While mechs CAN survive the blast from smaller weapons or on the peripheries of bigger weapons' blasts, most warships have more than one capital scale weapon. Directing the 48 heavy naval PPCs of a McKenna onto one weapon board will result in a "World o' suck" for map board occupants.
Mike Miller, Materials Engineer

Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
Karagin
06/23/02 04:23 PM
63.173.170.110

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Treat the whole thing as an artillery attack and dish out the damage that way.

That's how my group does it or if it's aimmed at a fort or city, then we simple slag half the city and call it good and give out damage via the artillery rules if any mechs or vehicles happen to be in the area under attack.
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
TRYCORP
06/27/02 11:00 AM
172.173.95.228

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>>Directing the 48 heavy naval PPCs of a McKenna onto one weapon board will result in a "World o' suck" for map board occupants. <<

I love that heheheh
"Machine Guns! Thats a Summoner out there! Do you plan to punch little holes in it, and have it fall down from too much ventilation!?!"

TRYCORP
Clan Nova Cat
CrayModerator
06/27/02 11:27 AM
64.83.29.242

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>Directing the 48 heavy naval PPCs of a McKenna onto one weapon board will result in a "World o' suck" for map board occupants.

Oops, that should be "onto one map board"...thinking faster than I type...or vice versa.
Mike Miller, Materials Engineer

Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
Khan_Robinette
07/01/02 11:59 AM
216.24.92.31

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Of course if ya really wanna get their attention, crash the ship into the planet in the vicinity of the target area, yes a lot of it might burn up inn the atmosphere, but ahhh the beauty of a Cameron slamming into the ground where a battle is raging.
I feel a campaign coming on....
"Teach me and I'll teach you
If you need a hand I'll give you two
Respect me and I'll respect you
Disrespect me and I will destroy you"
CrayModerator
07/01/02 01:02 PM
64.83.29.242

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A BT warship will not burn up in the atmosphere unless it's moving much, much faster than orbital velocity.

Steel regularly survives atmospheric passage in RL. The magical armor of BT is guaranteed to make it through, and the magical materials of the interior of a warship will minimize interior damage from holed armor. Large sections of the ships' machinery is very heat resistant (all those tens or hundreds of thousands of tons of fusion engine, for starts, and the thousands of tons weaponry...fear a 2000-ton NAC/40 barrel dropping on your toes). Even if such structures were low melting point soft steel, "low melting point" is a relative term - steel would still largely survive atmospheric passage, plus the bulk and relatively low surface to mass ratio of such large objects would make sure most of the stuff hit the ground in one piece. But they aren't soft, low melting point steel, they're BT magical materials.

You might cause a warship to disintegrate into smaller pieces from, say, tumbling or around severe weapon-inflicted structural damage, but that just turns the crash into a shotgun meteorite bombardment. Again, watch out for the falling engines and NAC barrels.

The impact would be fairly impressive, like a nice, big meteor. A rather diffuse one, though. Warships are rather low in density for their mass. Warships are about as wide across as the crater a normal, dense nickel-iron meteor of the same mass would make.
Mike Miller, Materials Engineer

Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
MacLeod
07/01/02 02:12 PM
65.93.149.32

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KABOOOMIE!!!!! Hehe, use a Sovetski Soyuz (I'm not sure about the spelling) and take out Sian....
Drugs don't kill people, pancreatic cancer kills people.

... and whoever heard of a drug that causes pancreatic cancer?
CrayModerator
07/01/02 02:24 PM
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I believe warships, at typical orbital and escape velocities, are good for flattening one city, not one whole planet like Sian.

I'd be curious about a warship accelerated to an appreciable fraction of light-speed, though. It only takes about 15000 tons of fuel (and a year at 1G) for a 2.5-megaton warship to get moving that fast.
Mike Miller, Materials Engineer

Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
MacLeod
07/01/02 02:41 PM
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Okay, so it couldn't take out the whole planet, but it could take out Sun-Tzu's palace and fry the bugger...
Drugs don't kill people, pancreatic cancer kills people.

... and whoever heard of a drug that causes pancreatic cancer?
Khan_Robinette
07/01/02 06:10 PM
216.24.107.254

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Throw in a little oil and

TA DA!

Deep fried Tzu Chicken :P
"Teach me and I'll teach you
If you need a hand I'll give you two
Respect me and I'll respect you
Disrespect me and I will destroy you"
MacLeod
07/01/02 07:07 PM
65.93.149.32

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Hehe. Brings a whole new meaning to Chinese food.

Okay, I'll admit it, that there was one terrible joke.

But I know someone's gonna laugh at it.

Personal note: that was not a direct attack against either Chinese people or any form of Chinese food. Some of my best friends are composed primarily of won tons.
Drugs don't kill people, pancreatic cancer kills people.

... and whoever heard of a drug that causes pancreatic cancer?
novakitty
07/01/02 07:14 PM
209.242.100.230

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If someone could get the aim right, a hyperspace jump into a planet should cause an even bigger boom.

However, very few people would even consider doing the testing to find out how a gravity well affects a hyperspace jump. Without that, the formulae needed to determine how to aim at a gravity well inside a much larger gravity well, with some other gravity wells nearby are completely unknown, untheorized, and unusable.
meow
MacLeod
07/01/02 07:16 PM
65.93.149.32

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Yeah, but I'd love to see the results of that on Sian...

Hehe... fry the Capellans!!!

DEATH TO SUN-TZU!!!
Drugs don't kill people, pancreatic cancer kills people.

... and whoever heard of a drug that causes pancreatic cancer?
novakitty
07/01/02 07:31 PM
209.242.100.230

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If we look as some other sci-fi (though I cannot remember which ones) the result of matter attempting to share phsical space with other matter is very severe. Although most of any atom is open space, two atomic nuclei within one electron shell will push apart from each other with a great deal of force. 250,000,000 tons of this should be able to quite quickly change a solid planet core into the largest fragmentation explosive ever devised. A few thousand huge chunks of high speed, high density iron moving out would probably tear the (relatively soft) surface of the planet into a large collection of shards. If anything lives, be amazed.
meow
MacLeod
07/01/02 07:45 PM
65.95.255.225

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Yeah, there was something like that in an episode of "The X-Files" (One of the good old ones, not the crappy ones with Dogget and no Mulder). There was this alien experiment or something, so Mulder and Scully were sent to investigate, and they found pieces of matter that were integrated with each other permanently. They found a Gila monster with its rear half stuck in a rock, and two quarters fused together, and a telephone booth stuck in a gas station, and stuff like that. It had all happened in one big KABOOM!

Does anyone remember anything else from that episode? I know it was a two-parter...
Drugs don't kill people, pancreatic cancer kills people.

... and whoever heard of a drug that causes pancreatic cancer?
NathanKell
07/01/02 08:08 PM
24.44.238.62

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That's, what, 0.985c? And with a 2.5 million ton warship.
28,519,954,255MT equivalent KE (1MT ~= 4,192TJ, right?)
Yes, that is 28.5 billion megatons.
-NathanKell, BT Space Wars
Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason, than that of blind-folded fear.
Thomas Jefferson
NathanKell
07/01/02 08:14 PM
24.44.238.62

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Assuming that the superposition of matter you describe would be equivalent to the ship's mass in antimatter coming into contact with the other matter, that would generate roughly 107,500,000,000MT (1kg AM ~= 43MT, right?)

And there is BT support for this: that's what the IR and EM pulse are when a jumpship arrives insystem--the annihilation of the free hydrogen it "displaces" when the KF field collapses.
-NathanKell, BT Space Wars
Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason, than that of blind-folded fear.
Thomas Jefferson
novakitty
07/01/02 09:16 PM
209.242.100.230

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I did not remember that detail, does that mean that the jump into the planet would not itself destroy the jumpship?

If that is true, and the post jump conditions do not destroy the vessile, one jumpship could destroy countless planets.
meow
MacLeod
07/01/02 10:02 PM
65.95.255.225

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No, it would destroy the JumpShip. After the KF field collapsed, the resulting chain reaction from the displaced matter, which previously only moved outward, destroying the planet, would now move inward and devastate the JumpShip.

Of course, you could find some way to protect the JumpShip by pulling on some other sci-fi, like using stasis fields from Star Trek, that made it invulnerable for a short period of time. It just might work with something stolen from Star Trek, because in one novel the Voyager was able to withstand a slightly powered down supernova. (The Final Fury: Invasion Book IV by Dafydd ab Hugh).
Drugs don't kill people, pancreatic cancer kills people.

... and whoever heard of a drug that causes pancreatic cancer?
novakitty
07/01/02 10:03 PM
209.242.100.230

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Dual jump drives, fully charged, one to get, one to get out.
meow
MacLeod
07/01/02 10:10 PM
65.95.255.225

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That would work, unless in the instant between jumps and when the KF field was down some of the energy came in...

Explosion in mid-jump... <shudders> not a pretty way to go.

Of course, on a double-jump the ship doesn't need to fully materialize... but it does so that it will annihilate the matter inside the planet...

It's a messy business. But it's a great way to kill Sun-Tzu!
Drugs don't kill people, pancreatic cancer kills people.

... and whoever heard of a drug that causes pancreatic cancer?
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