Karagin
12/10/02 02:39 PM
68.21.149.69
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Please ignore the one below...seems the text went away...
Okay, what would the out come be of a war between the Trinty Alliance (CapCon, MC and TC) and the FedSuns?
Would it be similar to the walk over of the 4th War? Or would it be a slug fest that causes the Alliance to fall apart from the strain of a long war and lack of a quick victory or maybe it will be the finial straw to fragment the FedSuns? Time frame would be around say 3110.
Or do you have a better idea on what could happen? Thoughts? Comments? And please leave anything related to MWDA out of this one please...this is a what if and idea generator..
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Bloodrider
12/10/02 03:38 PM
152.163.189.136
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If it's just between the Trinity and the Fed Suns, then I'd say it would be a meat grinder. I'm not sure the alliance would fall completely apart, unless the casualty count was very high. The Magistracy is shaping up to be a serious ally of the Cap Con, because it's quite apparent that a marriage between Sun Tzu and Naomi Centrella is in the works. And as for the Concordat, well, they've never trusted the Fed Suns. I think the alliance would hold together pretty well, if they're tangling with the Fed Suns. I doubt it would hold together against anyone else, though, unless it was a defensive campaign. It kind of looks like a repeat of the Third Succession War in miniature to me, with both sides simply wearing themselves out on it.
Of course, if the LyrCom gets involved, well, that's a horse of a different color. 
"Gentlemen, you can't fight in here. This is the war room..." -from Dr. Strangelove
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Rotwang
12/10/02 08:24 PM
213.224.83.134
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Ok here is my take on things, I'm making up facts as we go along ...
1) Survivors of Clan Smoke Jaguar and other parties maneuver Sun Tzu and his alliance to attack the weakened FedCom. He sets up his forces to launch a blitzkrieg into Davion space and capture New Avalon. And he puts Kai in charge of the thing.
2) The allies lend troops for the Blitzkrieg, while Mark moves against Steiner. As usual he'll dawdle a little and capture a few world and then pause to see how things go, keep his gains and minimize losses.
3) Spearheaded by survivors of Clan Smoke Jaguar, Big Mac, several Warrior Houses and the Death Commandos as well as some Marik and TC units as well as a generous contingent of WOB to help bust up communications as the invasion progresses.
3) Davion is brushed aside by a direct drive for New Avalon, the defence at the border is in no state to mount a counter-attack before New Avalon would fall.
4) Marik's offensive pushes for the Steiner border, especially centered around Hesperus, Marik is willing to lose a few worlds on this one if only he can manage to finally crack that nut and dent Steiner pride, then settle afterwards.
5) As the dazed Davions scramble to defend their border the Blitzkrieg cuts a swath through Davion space, still reeling from the civil war, most units that try to stand are mauled and wiped out, any tough resistance is bypassed to be mopped up by a second wave and third wave.
6) As they push onto New Avalon the Commando's and the WOB strike teams find that the planet has poor defences at best, but as forces coming into striking range, they discover that a large force of mercenaries, including the Dragoons, Kell Hounds and Grey Death legion are about to reinforce the desperate defenders, courtesy of Theodore Kurita's bankroll, who repays his debt.
Grand melee ensues.
7) The gamble for New Avalon fails at the last moment, the invading force fails to take the planet and falls back, neither side is in any shape to mount a major offensive and the war grinds down into a war of attrition. Liao ends up owning plenty of Davion worlds, but losses are high, it'll take years before Liao can make a move again. Davion is pretty much exhausted, needs to rebuild fast.
8) Marik's offensive just barely manages to take the big prize of Hesperus, Steiners send all their forces to retake it, whatever remains is badly damaged and it ends with Marik being ousted at high cost and leaving next to nothing of the Hesperus factories.
9) War ends with gains for the Triple Alliance, but no dramatic shift in power yet.
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Karagin
12/10/02 08:42 PM
68.21.149.186
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Interesting...very dark and very nasty...I like it.
Couple of questions...what are the Clans doing while this is going on? Seeing how you have Stiener fighting for it's life as well, or it's national pride which is the same thing really, what are the Falcons doing?
Also would ComStar come to the aid of the FedSuns or not?
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Rotwang
12/11/02 08:54 PM
213.224.83.142
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Well I can change the following bits and end up with my idea of fluff for MWDA ...
Ok here is my take on things, I'm making up facts as we go along ...
The Star League is disbanded
1) Survivors of Clan Smoke Jaguar, WOB and other parties maneuver Sun Tzu and his alliance to attack the weakened FedCom. He sets up his forces to launch a blitzkrieg into Davion space and capture New Avalon. And he puts Kai in charge of the thing as a test of his loyalty. Sun Tzu’s “Maximillian” gene suddenly got awakened by a healthy dose of Gamma radiation and he figures he could end up the new lord of a new Star League
Marik is pushed along by WOB with promises of support. Sun Tzu calls out to the Crusader Clans and makes them an offer they can’t refuse offering them a spot in the new Star League, while WOB plans to wipe them out when they are all conveniently gathered on Terra where they can get a them in a big way even if it means splattering a continent against the moon in doing so. (Hell we got enough of them anyway)
2) The allies lend troops for the Blitzkrieg, while Mark moves against Steiner with WOB support. As usual he'll dawdle a little and capture a few world and then pause to see how things go, keep his gains and minimize losses.
3) Spearheaded by survivors of Clan Smoke Jaguar, Big Mac, several Warrior Houses and the Death Commandos as well as some Marik and TC units as well as a generous contingent of WOB to help bust up communications as the invasion progresses.
3) Davion is brushed aside by a direct drive for New Avalon, the defence at the border is in no state to mount a counter-attack before New Avalon would fall. Several Crusader Clans launch an all out assault on Steiner and Kurita. Victor and the Star League move to reinforce the borders and hold the Clans at bay, while gathering some forces to reinforce New Avalon, but he’s stuck commanding the Clan border.
4) Marik's offensive pushes for the Steiner border, especially centered around Hesperus, Marik is willing to lose a few worlds on this one if only he can manage to finally crack that nut and dent Steiner pride, then settle afterwards.
5) As the dazed Davions scramble to defend their border the Blitzkrieg cuts a swath through Davion space, still reeling from the civil war, most units that try to stand are mauled and wiped out, any tough resistance is bypassed to be mopped up by a second wave and third wave.
6) As they push onto New Avalon the Commando's and the WOB strike teams find that the planet has poor defences at best, but as forces coming into striking range, they discover that a large force of mercenaries, including the Dragoons, Kell Hounds and Grey Death legion are about to reinforce the desperate defenders, courtesy of Theodore Kurita's bankroll, who repays his debt.
Grand melee ensues.
7) The gamble for New Avalon seems to fail at the last moment, the invading force is nearly defeated when several Galaxies of Clan troops attack New Avalon having moved their forces through uninhabited systems. Realizing they are unable to stop this new threat, the Dragoons, Hounds and Legion pull back. Jaimie Wolf, along with the remains of Zeta batallion and some volunteers decides to hold the line while the rest of the planetary defenders move off-planet. Jaimie knows his time has come. But then he hears two voices over the comm. “You didn’t think you’d go into this one alone ?” It’s Morgan Kell and Grayson Carlyle. All three die knowing their friends and kin will carry on, regardless. It ends in a blaze of Glory with at least 20-30 enemy mechs laid to waste by three living legends.
8) Marik's offensive just barely manages to take the big prize of Hesperus. The Steiner commander detonates the nukes hidden under the factories as a last ditch attempt to prevent them being taken by the enemy. Marik is accused of using nukes and WOB and other factions take notes.
9) Theodore is assassinated by the Black Dragons for supporting an enemy realm. Kurita is in dissaray.
10) WOB forces now move on Outreach and massacre everybody on planet. The badly mauled Dragoons are too far away to do anything, but vow that this second attack on their civilians will be avenged in blood … lots of it … They all move to Arc Royal to recuperate.
11) Davion resistance all but collapses. Davion troops flee wherever they can while Dukes and Generals gather as much troops as they can and concentrate around the remaining centers of power.
12) Steiner is on the brink of collapse, it can’t hold a two front war and Liao, WOB and Clan forces are racing to open a third front after the fall of New Avalon.
13) WOB drops a few nukes on some of their own allies, trying to put the blame on Comstar and Steiner.
14) The outraged Warden clans finally move, they call an alliance with whatever remains of Comstar, Davion and Steiner.
15) The assault on Steiner hits hard, Victor’s side struggles to get defences organized, but the warden clans give them the breather they so badly need.
16) Kurita remains the loose cannon, internal strife and clan invasions are taking the toll as the Black Dragons fail to take power. Omi Kurita moves in with an iron hand and kills of the rebellious factions, before preparing her realm to fight a war against Liao’s forces.
17) The WOB nukes and propaganda take their toll, Liao side forces switch to nukes and hit many planets on a broad front. As casualties become astronomical Steiner forces strike back with deep penetration hits inside Marik and Liao space. Things start to get real ugly.
18) The war becomes total. Destruction across the Inner Sphere reaches terrible levels. Some Warden Clans decided to pull out and refuse to fight on the side of barbarians willing to use nukes.
19) The 5th Succession war reaches new levels of brutality never seen in History, nearly 7 billion casualties and counting. As the deep raids strike at factories across the Inner Sphere, the supply system breaks up. By now armies cruelly lack the supplies they need for further offensives.
20) Out of the ashes one man, without a past, begins to unite forces around him. Just as the whole Inner Sphere is about to collapse under the most terrifying war in history, he raises the banner of a better world. He successfully builds a core of troops and manages to bring back the Wardens into the War, persuading the Inner Sphere is worth fighting for … As his movement grows it hits the terminally weakened Liao alliance unable to coordinate their forces.
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Karagin
12/11/02 09:11 PM
68.21.149.205
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Well...seeing how you still end up with the MWDA NUKE'EM tell the glow ending...I am not sure that this is any different then what we know will happen...
Is it possible to drop the whole nuke part?
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Rotwang
12/12/02 06:07 PM
213.224.83.142
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I warned about the MWDA link ...
It's not as much a nuke till they glow as a liberal use of the weapon. Let's say a couple of dozen are used mostly to take out the strategic factories, spaceports, staging areas and whatnot. What I wanted was :
A) WOB is only partially to blame for the wholesale slaughter, but still plays its part. If the universe is going to change, better change it with a VERY big bang
B) You get a good reason why they set up the Republic of the Sphere, and why mechs are so rare in MWDA. (Most of them were chewed up in the war)
Basically WOB helps set events in motion that end up in the worst war in recorded history, everybody starts to hit on everybody like a big barroom brawl that goes out of control.
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Karagin
12/12/02 06:44 PM
68.21.149.230
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Yes you did warn us, BUT your out come is really just a watered down version of MWDA...that is not what I am after...the idea is to get away from the silliness that is MWDA and look at the areas of the Inner Sphere that could be hot beds of fighting, thus idea that at some point between now and 3120 the Fed Suns and the nations that make up the Trinity Alliance go to war.
I am not worried about nor do I care about what the WoB is up to beyond that for this topic they are NOT planning to nuke anything or anyone and doing nothing but trying to take over a couple of worlds in the Chaos March. The main focus here is on the shared border between the FS and the CC and the TC.
Getting ideas such about what the rest of the Inner Sphere is doing if or when a war breaks out between these nations is great, linking into lawn mowers and nukes is not.
Another part of this was to get away from the whole idea of needing the WoB or nukes to bring about change and use parts of the IS that don't get a lot mention and try to use the game's detailed history to propell it forward not just the tired use of nukes and bad rip offs of another FASA game called Renegade Legion.
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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