Design Contest

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Karagin
10/30/17 08:06 PM
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Let's see what you folks come up with:

Talk the Hollander and make it into a LAM, one catch it has to keep it's main weapon.
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
Maurer
10/30/17 09:04 PM
45.48.53.140

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I submit to you:

Code:
BattleMech Technical Readout

Type/Model: Hollander BZK-F3
Tech: Inner Sphere / 3055
Config: Biped BattleMech
Rules: Level 2, Standard design

Mass: 35 tons
Chassis: Coventry BZK-III Endo Steel
Power Plant: 175 Omni Fusion
Walking Speed: 54.0 km/h
Maximum Speed: 86.4 km/h
Jump Jets: None
Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor Type: Lexington Limited High Grade Ferro-Fibrous
Armament:
1 Poland Main Model A Gauss Rifle
Manufacturer: Coventry Metal Works
Location: Coventry
Communications System: TharHes Muse 54-58K
Targeting & Tracking System: Cyclops 9
--------------------------------------------------------
Type/Model: Hollander BZK-F3
Mass: 35 tons

Equipment: Crits Mass
Int. Struct.: 58 pts Endo Steel 14 2.00
(Endo Steel Loc: 2 LA, 2 RA, 6 LT, 2 LL, 2 RL)
Engine: 175 Fusion 6 7.00
Walking MP: 5
Running MP: 8
Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks: 10 Single 3 .00
(Heat Sink Loc: 1 HD, 2 RT)
Gyro: 4 2.00
Cockpit, Life Supt., Sensors: 5 3.00
Actuators: L: Sh+UA+LA+H R: Sh+UA+LA+H 16 .00
Armor Factor: 72 pts Ferro-Fibrous 14 4.00
(Armor Crit Loc: 6 LA, 6 RA, 2 LT)

Internal Armor
Structure Value
Head: 3 8
Center Torso: 11 10
Center Torso (Rear): 4
L/R Side Torso: 8 8/8
L/R Side Torso (Rear): 3/3
L/R Arm: 6 6/6
L/R Leg: 8 8/8

Weapons and Equipment Loc Heat Ammo Crits Mass
--------------------------------------------------------
1 Gauss Rifle RT 1 16 9 17.00
(Ammo Locations: 2 CT)
--------------------------------------------------------
TOTALS: 1 71 35.00
Crits & Tons Left: 7 .00

Calculated Factors:
Total Cost: 2,585,160 C-Bills
Battle Value: 861
Cost per BV: 3,002.51
Weapon Value: 307 / 307 (Ratio = .36 / .36)
Damage Factors: SRDmg = 14; MRDmg = 11; LRDmg = 7
BattleForce2: MP: 5, Armor/Structure: 2/3
Damage PB/M/L: 2/2/2, Overheat: 0
Class: ML; Point Value: 9

BattleMech Technical Readout

Type/Model: Atlas AS7-D
Tech: Inner Sphere / 3025
Config: Biped BattleMech
Rules: Level 1, Standard design

Mass: 100 tons
Chassis: Foundation Type 10X Standard
Power Plant: 300 Vlar Fusion
Walking Speed: 32.4 km/h
Maximum Speed: 54.0 km/h
Jump Jets: None
Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor Type: Durallex Heavy Special Standard
Armament:
1 Deathgiver Autocannon/20
1 Doombud LRM 20
4 Hellion-V Medium Lasers
1 Thunderstroke SRM 6
Manufacturer: Yori 'Mech Works, Defiance Industries, Independence Weaponry
Location: Al'Nair, Hesperus II, Quentin
Communications System: Army Comm. Class 5
Targeting & Tracking System: Army Corporation Type 29K
--------------------------------------------------------
Type/Model: Atlas AS7-D
Mass: 100 tons

Equipment: Crits Mass
Int. Struct.: 152 pts Standard 0 10.00
Engine: 300 Fusion 6 19.00
Walking MP: 3
Running MP: 5
Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks: 20 Single 8 10.00
(Heat Sink Loc: 1 HD, 1 LA, 1 RA, 1 LT, 2 LL, 2 RL)
Gyro: 4 3.00
Cockpit, Life Supt., Sensors: 5 3.00
Actuators: L: Sh+UA+LA+H R: Sh+UA+LA+H 16 .00
Armor Factor: 304 pts Standard 0 19.00

Internal Armor
Structure Value
Head: 3 9
Center Torso: 31 47
Center Torso (Rear): 14
L/R Side Torso: 21 32/32
L/R Side Torso (Rear): 10/10
L/R Arm: 17 34/34
L/R Leg: 21 41/41

Weapons and Equipment Loc Heat Ammo Crits Mass
--------------------------------------------------------
1 Autocannon/20 RT 7 10 12 16.00
(Ammo Locations: 2 RT)
1 LRM 20 LT 6 12 7 12.00
(Ammo Locations: 2 LT)
2 Medium Lasers CT(R) 6 2 2.00
1 Medium Laser RA 3 1 1.00
1 Medium Laser LA 3 1 1.00
1 SRM 6 LT 4 15 3 4.00
(Ammo Locations: 1 LT)
--------------------------------------------------------
TOTALS: 29 65 100.00
Crits & Tons Left: 13 .00

Calculated Factors:
Total Cost: 9,626,000 C-Bills
Battle Value: 1,557
Cost per BV: 6,182.4
Weapon Value: 2,120 / 2,120 (Ratio = 1.36 / 1.36)
Damage Factors: SRDmg = 33; MRDmg = 12; LRDmg = 5
BattleForce2: MP: 3, Armor/Structure: 8/8
Damage PB/M/L: 6/5/1, Overheat: 0
Class: MA; Point Value: 16
Specials: if


Rules calrification: You want to turn the Hollander into a LAM (Launch by Assault Mech) or LAM (Land Air Mech)? I think I have fulfilled the requirements of the latter.
"Captain! We're completely surrounded on all sides." - Kiff, Futurama
..."Excellent, then we may attack in any direction." - Zapp Brannigan, Futurama

"A fool fights a war on two fronts; only an idiot defends on one." - Fusilier
Karagin
10/30/17 10:27 PM
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LOL...well if you can figure out HOW to launch a light mech from an assault mech please let us know.
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
ghostrider
10/31/17 03:09 AM
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No listing of conversion equipment.
Doesn't look like weight for the equipment is counted for.
And I know this was gone over before here, but I have forgotten what was the end result for the new rules of lams. I believe you can't use endosteel or ferrous fiber armor with them. But as I said. I don't have the newer rules for them.

It is easy to launch a light mech from and assault mech. Pick up the throw.
Reiter
11/04/17 12:26 AM
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Quote:
Let's see what you folks come up with:

Talk the Hollander and make it into a LAM, one catch it has to keep it's main weapon.



Code:
               BattleMech Technical Readout

Type/Model: Hollander BZK-LAM
Tech: Inner Sphere / 3055
Config: Land Air BattleMech
Rules: Level 3, Standard design

Mass: 45 tons
Chassis: Coventry BZK-III Endo Steel
Power Plant: 225 Omni XL Fusion
Walking Speed: 54.0 km/h
Maximum Speed: 86.4 km/h
Jump Jets: 5 Standard Jump Jets
Jump Capacity: 150 meters
Armor Type: Lexington Limited High Grade Standard
Armament:
1 Gauss Rifle
Manufacturer: Coventry Metal Works
Location: Coventry
Communications System: TharHes Muse 54-58K
Targeting & Tracking System: Cyclops 9

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
==Overview:==
A mad man's request and a delivered failure of epic proportions.


==Capabilities:==
Intended to engage light and medium 'Mechs at extreme range and eliminate
them quickly, the Hollander mounts a single Gauss cannon around which the
entire 'Mech is built. The Gauss cannon provides devastating firepower and
range, but also poses [b]some inherent design limitations[/b].
Upscaled from a light mech to 45 tons, the Hollander LAM version is
now almost amost as heavy as the Phoneix Hawk LAM with less capabilities. Keeping
the Gauss Rifle as its main weapon, designers had to remove the lower arm
actuators to fit the wing assemblies and compensate for the weight of the
conversion equipment. Several added bonuses where realized, that an additional
ton of ammo could be supplied, 2 tons of armor to protect the vulnerable Gauss
Rifle plus CASE, and 5 jump jets added to give more mobility.
Many pilots now complain that it looks like they pilot a flying chicken with
the missing arms, but the heavy punch of the main gun offsets their weak egos and
to avoid a direct hand to hand scenario.

--------------------------------------------------------
Type/Model: Hollander BZK-LAM
Mass: 45 tons

Equipment: Crits Mass
Int. Struct.: 75 pts Endo Steel 14 2.50
(Endo Steel Loc: 1 HD, 4 LA, 4 RA, 3 LT, 1 RT, 1 CT)
Engine: 225 XL Fusion 12 5.00
Walking MP: 5
Running MP: 8
Jumping MP: 5 [15]
Heat Sinks: 10 Single 1 .00
(Heat Sink Loc: 1 LT)
Gyro: 4 3.00
Cockpit, Life Supt., Sensors: 5 3.00
Actuators: L: Sh+UA+LA R: Sh+UA+LA 14 .00
Armor Factor: 96 pts Standard 0 6.00

Internal Armor
Structure Value
Head: 3 8
Center Torso: 14 14
Center Torso (Rear): 6
L/R Side Torso: 11 10/10
L/R Side Torso (Rear): 4/4
L/R Arm: 7 10/10
L/R Leg: 11 10/10

Weapons and Equipment Loc Heat Ammo Crits Mass
--------------------------------------------------------
1 Gauss Rifle RT 1 24 10 18.00
(Ammo Locations: 3 LT)
CASE Equipment: RT 1 .50
5 Standard Jump Jets: 5 2.50
(Jump Jet Loc: 1 CT, 2 LL, 2 RL)
LAM Conversion Equipment: 0 4.50
--------------------------------------------------------
TOTALS: 1 66 45.00
Crits & Tons Left: 12 .00

Calculated Factors:
Total Cost: 12,286,575 C-Bills
Battle Value: 1,706
Cost per BV: 7,201.98
Weapon Value: 406 / 406 (Ratio = .24 / .24)
Damage Factors: SRDmg = 12; MRDmg = 11; LRDmg = 7
BattleForce2: MP: 5J, Armor/Structure: 2/2
Damage PB/M/L: 2/2/2, Overheat: 0
Class: MM; Point Value: 17


Could of gone 50 tons, but that was the easier route. Still an ugly mech, could barely squeeze anything on there and still had no room for ferro fibrous armor which isn't really needed. At 45 tons, fits the bill and the intended roll for the original Hollander, except as a LAM which is as odd as a clown at a funeral.
Karagin
11/05/17 09:32 PM
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Nice job.
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
tmr01750195
11/23/17 12:28 AM
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ghostrider's belief that Catalyst Game Labs LAMs cannot mount endo-steel of ferro-fibrous armor is correct.

Catalyst Game Labs Interstellar Operations pp. 114-115

LAMs may only be constructed using Inner Sphere technology, cannot be OmniMechs. Only bipedal Mechs weighing up 55 tons may be constructed as LAMs. Minimum Jump MP is 3. LAMs get 1 ton of free fuel providing 80 thrust points. Structural Integrity is equal to the CT internal structure points. Conversion equipment for a Bimodal (Mech-Aerospace Fighter) devotes 15% total mass (rounded up to nearest whole ton). The Standard LAM (Land-Air Mech) only requires 10% of the unit's total mass to conversion equipment. LAMs may be equipped with up to 20 bomb bays (1 ton & 1 critical space) in the LT and RT. Each bomb bay carries 1 bomb.

Prohibited Technologies
Except as noted on this list, a LAM may use any equipment not prohibited to BattleMechs, IndustrialMechs, or aerospace fighters.

The following items are prohibited in LAMs:
Armor: LAMs may not use hardened armor and any other armor that requires critical hit slots, including ferro-fibrous armor, modular armor, and stealth armor. LAMs may use armored components, however.

Cockpits: LAMs may not use torso-mounted cockpits, nor any cockpits that requires additional critical hit slots.

Engines: LAMs may not use any engine other than a standard or a compact fusion engine and cannot mount a supercharger.

Gyros: Only standard, compact, and heavy-duty gyros may be employed by LAMs.

Internal Structure: LAMs may not use any internal structure that requires critical hit slots, such as endo steel.

Primitive Components: LAMs may not mount any primitive core components, such as engines, cockpits, gyros, and the like. Primitive and prototype weapons (see pp. 118 and 70) may be mounted on a LAM, however.

Extra-Large Weapons: LAMs may not mount any weapon system that must be allocated to more than one hit location (e.g. Right Arm & Right Torso), such as the Thumper or Arrow IV artillery weapons, nor may any weapon that can be optionally split between locations be mounted in more than one location. LAMs may not carry artillery weapons of any kind (bomb munitions are permitted via bomb bays).

Other Items: Aside from avionics and landing gear, any items that require the allocation of critical slots to more than one hit location may not be mounted on LAMs. This includes items that may normally be split between multiple hit locations on other BattleMech types. For example, a LAM may mount MASC or triple-strength myomer as either system may be allocated entirely in one hit location, but it cannot mount the Chameleon Light Polarization Shield, because that system requires 1 critical slot placed in each of the ’Mech’s limbs and side torsos.

LAMs also may not mount backhoes, bridge-laying equipment, combines, dumpers, external stores, mechanical jump boosters, partial wings, or jump packs/drop packs.

Finally, except for physical attack weapons, LAMs may not mount any weapon that requires a Piloting skill as part of its use (such as the heavy Gauss rifle).


Edited by tmr01750195 (11/23/17 12:30 AM)
tmr01750195
11/23/17 12:37 AM
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I go along with Karagin about the Hollander LAM being a nice design.
tmr01750195
11/23/17 04:26 PM
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Here is an attempt at using Catalyst Game Labs TechManual, Interstellar Operations, and MegaMekLab application. Hopefully I pulled the numbers from the application and put together the readout correctly

Code:
               BattleMech Technical Readout

Type: Hollander LAM Mk I
Base Tech Level: Inner Sphere (Advanced)

Tech Rating: E/D-F-F-F
Tonnage: 45
Battle Value: 1,321
Cost: 3,894,991 C-bills
Source: Interstellar Operations LAM Construction, TRO 3055

Mass: 45 tons
Chassis: Standard
Power Plant: Standard Fusion 180
Walking Speed: 43.2 km/h
Maximum Speed: 64.8 km/h
Jump Jets: 3 Standard Jump Jets
Jump Capacity: 90 meters
Armor Type: Standard
Armament:
1 Gauss Rifle
Manufacturer: Coventry Metal Works
Location: Coventry
Communications System: TharHes Muse 54-58K
Targeting & Tracking System: Cyclops 9

--------------------------------------------------------
Type/Model: Hollander BZK-LAM
Mass: 45 tons

Equipment: Crits Mass
Internal Structure: 75 pts Standard 14 4.50
LAM Conversion Equipment: 5.00
Engine: 180 Std. Fusion 6 5.00
Walking MP: 4
Running MP: 6
Jumping MP: 3
AirMech Walking MP: 2
AirMech Running MP: 3
AirMech Cruise MP: 9
AirMech Flank MP: 14
Safe Thrust: 3
Maximum Thrust: 5
Heat Sinks: 10 3 .00
Gyro Compact: 2 3.00
Small Cockpit: 4 2.00
Fuel: 80 .00
Structural Integrity: 16
Armor Factor: 80 0 5.00

Internal Armor
Structure Value
Head: 3 9
Center Torso: 14 11
Center Torso (Rear): 4
L/R Side Torso: 11 9/9
L/R Side Torso (Rear): 3/3
L/R Arm: 7 7/7
L/R Leg: 11 10/10

Conversation Equipment Allocation
Spaces
Location Item Remaining
Head: 1 Avionics 0
Center Torso: 1 Landing Gear 1
Right Torso: 1 Landing Gear 10
1 Avionics
Left Torso: 1 Landing Gear 10
1 Avionics
Right Arm: - 8
Left Arm: - 8
Right Leg: - 2
Left Leg: - 2


Weapons and Equipment Loc Heat Ammo Crits Mass
--------------------------------------------------------
1 Gauss Rifle RT 1 15.00
Ammo (Gauss): LT 16 2 2
Standard Jump Jet: RT 1 .50
Standard Jump Jet: RT 1 .50
Standard Jump Jet: RT 1 .50
--------------------------------------------------------


Edited by tmr01750195 (11/23/17 04:41 PM)
Reiter
11/25/17 05:42 AM
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Quote:
The Wasp, Stinger and Phoenix Hawk are the only published LAMs, found in the unrevised edition of Technical Readout: 3025, along with the other "lost" or "unseen" BattleMechs such as the Marauder, Crusader, Warhammer and the non-LAM versions of the Stinger, Wasp, and Phoenix Hawk. The most current rules for the LAM system are in the out-of-print BattleTech Tactical Handbook



Pretty much my only source of info for LAMs and the boxset. I owned that stuff, before giving it to my brother 20 years later and he repainted my mechs *angry face*

I will allow myself to follow most rules, but Catalyst is in my opinion what Disney studios did to Marvel. You can buy the rights to the studio, doesn't mean I will care about it (and aside from Iron Man *cough power armor cough*), I only watch their other movies once *cough Black Panther looks like it is gonna suck cough*) or in the case of Catalyst, doesn't mean I have to follow their rules. This was just something I threw together, using the original Hollander tech with all its XL-Endo/Ferro so it could be called a failure as it says in the text.

Only caveat I will say, my Heavy Metal Pro is far outdated so it doesn't follow the rules when building otherwise it would of locked out XL-Endo/Ferro. HMP does put together nice TRO and self made copies of mech sheets. I think this version throws LAM into level 3 tech rules, but under that 3025 from the box set (level 1 tech rule) I could of sworn the minimum speed was 5/8/jj where as the weight of the engine and small amount of conversion tonnage limited the LAM from being too overpowered. A 50 ton 4/6/3 Phoenix Hawk would be able to carry 6 tons more under your rules with just tech 1 with no weight reduction tech, hence there is a dispute I would have over Catalyst rules for LAMs if you only reduce speed.
tmr01750195
11/25/17 01:20 PM
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Morning WA Reiter,

I really do like your Hollander LAM design as built.

The Phoenix Hawk, Stinger, and Wasp LAMs are in FASA 1609 AeroTech 1986 on page 36. I think AeroTech was published before FASA 8603 TRO 3025 in 1986.

Again I like your Hollander LAM and thank you for your comment.


Edited by tmr01750195 (11/26/17 12:31 AM)
Karagin
11/25/17 11:10 PM
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Okay let me clear up somethings, first Mega Mek IS NOT AN OFFICIAL BATTLETECH product and thus invalidates anything going through it.

Second, LAMS are a gray area in the game, CGL ignores them, even though they gave rules for them, but they did it in a manner of a footnote, like hey here they are go play and leave us alone. So if folks want the LAMs to have wave motion guns, then frankly who cares?

Third, no one likes a rules lawyer, nuff said.
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
tmr01750195
11/26/17 12:53 AM
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Post deleted by tmr01750195
Karagin
11/26/17 01:03 AM
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Not what I said. I said if folks want to build the mech with what ever is there, then hey they can, if they want to follow the rules 100%, they can.

I didn't say don't share or don't comment, I said no one likes a rules lawyer. Yes you pointed out the rules for LAMs and in doing so you showed how gray they are.
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
ghostrider
11/26/17 02:25 AM
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Wait. Did I hear rules lawyer, and megamek not being official from the same person?

Tmr only added to what I said about the materials used in the one lam design. I thought xl's weren't allowed either, but didn't post it.
The design is interesting atleast. Both of them.

As I have asked before of others, if it is not completely official, then please state it in the beginning of the post.
Well official isn't the right word. Done by the printed rules. Not much of the designs done here are official. Most don't work for or on the game.
Karagin
11/26/17 12:11 PM
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Yes you did. I have always said MegaMek isn't a valid program and rules lawyer...only when a mech or vehicle is built wrong in that some one tries to pass of 40 ton mech that is pushing 60 tons of stuff. Seen that once with someone trying to pass of a Spider with an 2 ER LL, 4 ML, 2 SRM4s and max armor and moving 7-11 and jumping 7.

Now here is an idea, post a version of the Hollander LAM without using XL or Ferro/Endo and still allow it to keep the Gauss, that would have been the better course for him tossing in the rules to show that hey here is what to do vs calling out the whole thing. Just saying.

So let's see a version with no other high tech then the Gauss and the LAM equipment.
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
Reiter
11/26/17 02:17 PM
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If it seemed like I was snapping out, I am sorry. I usually don't explain myself well and hell...rarely ever built LAMs cause you where so limited in what you could put on it.
tmr01750195
11/27/17 10:22 AM
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Not having the out dated Official BattleTech Heavy Metal design software there is no possibility of submitting an entry to the contest.

Which BattleTech rule set or sets are legal to submit an entry: FASA, FanPro, or Catalyst Game Labs (CGL)?


Edited by tmr01750195 (11/27/17 02:07 PM)
ghostrider
11/27/17 11:37 AM
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Most here try to use the most up to date rule sets when dealing with things.
As noted in more and more posts, alternative things like time lines, and a few house rule sets are being done more and more.
Not sure about this design contest, but the website itself is not strict on what you use. Even how it is posted is not set in stone. There is a requested standard to it, but as most who have used megamek knows, that does not show all equipment that a others like to see in the data sheets.
The request to say a design is not using canon rules is asked, not required.

From what has gone on about LAMs, they are not as well defined as they could be. My last rule set dealing with them is Battle masters rules. Granted, a few of the rules seems less then well defined. Or maybe not understood well enough by me.

Not sure of the minimum speed thing. If it is valid, then the entry tmr put up violates it. If not, then it is a valid design. Slow, but valid.
Not sure if bumping it up 5 tons would help it any.
For some designs, that actually hurts for weight.
tmr01750195
11/27/17 01:53 PM
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Hello ghostrider,

Quote:
Most here try to use the most up to date rule sets when dealing with things.
As noted in more and more posts, alternative things like time lines, and a few house rule sets are being done more and more.
Not sure about this design contest, but the website itself is not strict on what you use. Even how it is posted is not set in stone. There is a requested standard to it, but as most who have used megamek knows, that does not show all equipment that a others like to see in the data sheets.
The request to say a design is not using canon rules is asked, not required.

From what has gone on about LAMs, they are not as well defined as they could be. My last rule set dealing with them is Battle masters rules. Granted, a few of the rules seems less then well defined. Or maybe not understood well enough by me.



Thank you for the clarification that the most members use the latest, which I believe is CGL BT rules.

I have reviewed the Preferred format which looks like pretty much the FASA layout. My FanPro collection is limited to the BattleTech Master Rules, one field manual, Combat Equipment, AT 2 Revised, and Maximum Tech Revised. For CGL's I've got BT boxed Set, TW, TM, TO, SO, AToW, and IO plus I think most of the free stuff.

I did notice the the Mega Mek readout was different and the material posted was a hybrid of the Preferred format, CGL IO LAM design example, FASA, and the TRO printed out from my Heavy Metal Plus, Aero, and Battle Armor software before it crashed. Unfortunately, I have misplaced my CD-ROMs and cannot find the receipt showing when I purchased them back in 2006 or 2007. Now I'll have to wait and buy them again sometime in 2018 even though they range from two to nine years when they were last updated.

The simplest and clearest LAM rules in my opinion came out in FASA 1609 AeroTech 1986. CGL Interstellar Operations is, again in my opinion, a bit better than the LAM rules in FASA 8630 Tactical Handbook 1994. The least clear LAM rules is toss-up between FASA 1626 BT Manual The Rules of Warfare and FASA 1640 The BattleTech Compendium. However, I do agree that they all still have gray areas.

Quote:
Not sure of the minimum speed thing. If it is valid, then the entry tmr put up violates it. If not, then it is a valid design. Slow, but valid.
Not sure if bumping it up 5 tons would help it any.
For some designs, that actually hurts for weight.



Thank you for the comments on the entry that was submitted.

There is a high probability that I messed up my entries when I put together the TRO. However, since the entry is invalid from the start there is no need to fix anything. How does one go about removing stuff that has been deemed invalid or over the top in other ways?


Edited by tmr01750195 (11/27/17 02:06 PM)
Karagin
11/27/17 05:08 PM
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The Heavy Metal Pro has work arounds for the new weapons and such, all of that can be found on the main page of Rick's website.

If you post a design and it's built with in the rules then we are all happy, if you post one that changes things, then we need to know that upfront as Ghostrider stated. The rules for the LAMS are a mess, and I think that is the point, to keep them that way and given the recent well ugliness with Harmony Gold, yeah we really don't need LAMs, beyond the hey cool idea, but not so great in "real" life concept which is what keeps them as part of the universe, they are the Gooney Bird of Battletech.

There are other programs out there that are free that can build LAMs, and they provide a text format to share the info.
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
tmr01750195
11/28/17 10:23 AM
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Thank you Karagin for the additional clarification.

On the BattleTech: The Board Game of Armored Combat forum mention was made of the Heavy Metal design software. The basic response was that the Heavy Metal design software was out of date and the use of MegaMek Labs or SSW was suggested.

Yes, the Heavy Metal Software site does have work a rounds which I had applied to my Heavy Metal Plus, Aero, and Battle Armor until the software crashed and uninstalled before locating the installation CDs leaving me with my clunky semi finished spreadsheets or following the recommendations from he BattleTech: The Board Game of Armored Combat forum.

Is there a chance for someone to please provide the names or links for the programs that are suitable for use for BT designs?

Since the design submitted by me is not deemed suitable how can I remove the item?


Edited by tmr01750195 (11/28/17 10:25 AM)
tmr01750195
11/30/17 01:26 AM
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Darn it, my apologies for really messing up the data sheet for my entry on 11/23/17 04:26 PM. I failed to notice that all the jump jets are in the right torso.

Can someone please let me know how to remove the mess from the contest?

I am embarrassed with the item, of course I'm going to blame web gremlins for the mistakes. ;-)

I still have not found other free applications or spreadsheets mentioned by Karagin. I am modifying one of my earlier spreadsheets to build LAMs. Based on the mess I made earlier the best idea not to post designs.

However, I have been testing the spreadsheet with the Hollander and as suggested by ghostrider bumping up the tonnage to 55 tons appears to let me keep the Hollander's Walking MP and armor rating.

The submitted design meets the Catalyst Game Labs LAM Minimum Jumping MP of 3 per the construction rules on Interstellar Operations p. 114.

Update 11/30/17 11:12 AM PST

I made another small error. Per IO the conversion equipment calculation rounds up to the nearest whole number. To keep the LAM at 55 tons Armor was reduced to 3.5 tons.


Edited by tmr01750195 (11/30/17 03:17 PM)
ghostrider
11/30/17 05:40 PM
66.74.61.223

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If I know right, the only way to remove the entry, after the short time period for editing, is getting the mods/owner to do so, and I believe they have issues with it as well.

There is a thread on the boards here that shows the preferred posting, but it is request. More then a few use megamek, though some of the information doesn't show up on there. Not sure if they did a downloadable version of it, so people could download it, then just make a copy and use it to put the info in.

It is nice bumping up the weight helped. A few points on the tonnage seems to make it worse.

And if you get the chance, there is a post were someone made a comic with an Urbanmech lam. It is funny in my opinion, but at the least amusing.

And this is straying a bit from the contest.
Karagin
11/30/17 08:31 PM
72.176.187.91

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http://www.sarna.net/forums/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/177207/an/0/page/0#177207

You can try for Skunkworks mech program, but based on my attempts to use it, it's not very user friendly, though your mileage may vary on it.

Also several other programs exist that allow LAMs to be made, as to them being up to date no idea on that, since all I use is Heavy Metal Pro and go from there.
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
tmr01750195
11/30/17 11:41 PM
76.121.197.44

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Hello ghostrider,

Thank you for the information that my very poorly edited design post will be stuck here. On the upside there is now a good example for others of what not to do when posting.

I've been tinkering with the design and I was able to increase the Armor 4.5 tons by using a small cockpit.
tmr01750195
11/30/17 11:57 PM
76.121.197.44

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Hello Karagin,

Thank you for supplying link with the the three design applications suggested by Nic Jansma.

I still have not found my Heavy Metal Plus, Aero, and Battle Armor installation CDs which means I'll have to wait for a while to purchase replacements.

I'll take a look at Solaris Skunkwerks to see if I can work with the application. However, if you found it not to be user friendly then there is a good chance that it will kick the tar out of me.
tmr01750195
12/03/17 04:10 PM
76.121.197.44

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Hello Karagin,

I tried SSW and gave up fighting with the interface.

I've modified a spreadsheet to I hope the basic Catalyst Game Labs requirements I did for FASA that does not calculate Total Cost, Battle Value, Cost per BV,Weapon Value, Damage Factors, or BattleForce2 data.

May I post the design or should I wait until I have figured out how to do Total Cost, Battle Value, Cost per BV,Weapon Value, Damage Factors, or BattleForce2 data?
Karagin
12/03/17 05:56 PM
72.176.187.91

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Post away.
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
tmr01750195
12/03/17 11:30 PM
76.121.197.44

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Thank you Karagin for giving the clearance to make another attempt at posting an entry to the challenge. The data presented was done with a heavily modified Excel spreadsheet based on FASA 1604 BattleTech, FASA 1609 AeroTech, BT TechManual PDF CAT 35002 2007-2013 The Topps Company, Inc. Corrected Third Printing Published by Catalyst Game Lab, and BT Interstellar Operation PDF CAT 35006 2016 The Topps Company, Inc. Printed in USA Published by Catalyst Game Labs. I never completed including cost and I am still trying to get a handle on the BV,Cost per BV,Weapon Value, Damage Factors, or BattleForce2 data.

I am hoping that my editing is better than my first attempt. However I may be wrong when calculating the speeds in km/h

Code:
               BattleMech Technical Readout

Name: BZK-L2 Hollander LAM
Tech: Inner Sphere / 3055
Config: Biped Land Air Mech
Rules: Catalyst Game Labs TM & IO

Mass: 55 tons
Chassis: Coventry BZK-LAM
Power Plant: CoreTek 275 Standard Fusion
Walking Speed: 54.0 km/h
Maximum Speed: 86.4 km/h
Jump Jets: 3 Chilton Standard JJ
Jump Capacity: 90 meters
Armor Type: Lexington Ltd. Standard Grade
Armament:
1 Poland Main Model A Gauss Cannon (16)
Air-Mech Cruising Speed: 162.0 kph
Air-Mech Maximum Speed: 248.4 kph
Safe Thrust: 900 kph
Maximum Thrust: 1,440.0 kph
Manufacturer: Coventry Metal Works
Location: Coventry
Communications System: TharHes Muse 54-58K
Targeting & Tracking System: Cyclops 9

Type: BZK-L2 Hollander LAM
Mass: 55 tons

Equipment: Crits Mass
Int. Struct.: Std. 0 5.50
Engine: 275 Std. Fusion 6 15.50
Walking MP: 5
Running MP: 8
Jumping MP: 3
Air-Mech Cruising MP: 15
Air-Mech Maximum MP: 23
Safe Thrust: 5
Maximum Thrust: 8
Heat Sinks: 10 Single 0 .00
Gyro: 4 3.00
Cockpit Sml., Life Supt., Sensors: 4 2.00
Actuators: L: Sh+UA+LA+HA R: Sh+UA+LA+HA 16 .00
Fuel: 80 .00
Structural Integrity: 14
Armor Factor: 64 pts Standard 0 4.50

Internal Armor
Structure Value
Head: 3 7
Center Torso: 18 10
Center Torso (Rear): 3
L/R Side Torso: 13 8/8
L/R Side Torso (Rear): 2/2
L/R Arm: 9 6/6
L/R Leg: 13 6/6

Weapons and Equipment Loc Heat Ammo Crits Mass
--------------------------------------------------------
1 Gauss Rifle RT 1 16 9 17.00
(Ammo Locations: 2 RT)
3 Standard Jump Jets: 3 1.50
(Jump Jet Loc: 1 LL, 1 CT, 1 RL)
LAM Conversion Equipment: 6 6.00
--------------------------------------------------------
TOTALS: 1 48 55.00
Crits & Tons Left: 30 .00

Calculated Factors:
Total Cost: ? C-Bills
Battle Value: ?
Cost per BV: ?
Weapon Value: ? / ? (Ratio = ? / ?)
Damage Factors: SRDmg = ?; MRDmg = ?; LRDmg = ?
BattleForce2: MP: 5J, Armor/Structure: ?/?
Damage PB/M/L: ?/?/? Overheat: ?
Class: ?; Point Value: ?
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