Are there any anarchy groups in the Inner Sphere/Periphery

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Newtype
10/31/08 11:49 AM
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Quite curious.
Karagin
10/31/08 06:47 PM
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Sure, check out Interstellar Players for some and the follow up book with the same title but the number 2 is added. At one time WoB fit into this grouping before they became the uber faction and took on an air of being able to do everything with very little when compared to the houses or Clans.

Added in rebel groups and factions that abound the Inner Sphere/Periphery and you have your extreme groups and individuals.
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
Venom
11/01/08 04:49 AM
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Well, there are pirate groups in the periphery that may belive in anarchy like a high school student, but they too would be the first to die if it ever came to pass. Also, there are groups in the Lyran Commonwealth that seek democracy, but that is hardly anarchy.

Honestly, I disagree with Karagin that WoB is an anarchist faction. They did everything to work within the system to get their way that they even refurbished the Invincible to grease the palms of the Lyrans. Only after the 2nd Star League dis-banded did they start the jihad. And even then, the idea of anarchy is one of a lack of law and order. The WoBs want order based of the blessed Blakes teachings, the ends to the means matter none to them.
Karagin
11/01/08 11:31 AM
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Quote:

Well, there are pirate groups in the periphery that may belive in anarchy like a high school student, but they too would be the first to die if it ever came to pass. Also, there are groups in the Lyran Commonwealth that seek democracy, but that is hardly anarchy.

Honestly, I disagree with Karagin that WoB is an anarchist faction. They did everything to work within the system to get their way that they even refurbished the Invincible to grease the palms of the Lyrans. Only after the 2nd Star League dis-banded did they start the jihad. And even then, the idea of anarchy is one of a lack of law and order. The WoBs want order based of the blessed Blakes teachings, the ends to the means matter none to them.




Check things again, the WoB was running around doing all kinds of not so nice things in the Periphery and the Chaos March area. They were doing all of this before finding the golden fleece of instant mechs and manpower and then going from rabble with one single world allowed to them by Marik, to uber smash everything to reset the universe. They did not work with in the system at all. They worked out side of it and behind it, but never with in it. All of this before their appeal to join the growing power block called the second SL. Funny how they go to join it, why would they really need to since they held Terra which if you believe all the BS about Terra being so powerful and having mech factories they can pump out mechs by hundreds to thousands easily, would they need to join the SL, and it falls apart and off they go on rampage to destroy everyone to rebuild things. Right if that doesn't sum up an anarchy or nutcase group, then please tell us what does? Also note, I said that BEFORE they tried to join the 2nd SL, the WoB was doing all the things groups that support change and rebellion and anarchy are know to do, bombings, assassinations, killings, stealing, attempts to overthrow governments etc...then over night they changed.

The WoB were radical and extreme right wing style group, they are not your cuddly hug and forgive group, never were and never will be.
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
Zandel_Corrin
11/03/08 12:49 AM
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I must say i've missed that part of the cannon fiction.... last i've read the wobblies are just starting to gear up and enter the chaos march....

What happened after that?
Galaxy Commander
Zandel Corrin
Night Dragon Clan
Lafeel
11/04/08 10:22 PM
157.157.73.13

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Quote:

I must say i've missed that part of the cannon fiction.... last i've read the wobblies are just starting to gear up and enter the chaos march....

What happened after that?



Seems they've been doing all sorts of stuff while the Inner Sphere was focused on the clans.
Zandel_Corrin
11/04/08 10:30 PM
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The more i learn about this Jihard the less i think i want to know.... it all seems a bit of a streach that they can build up to that ammount with one plannet and lettle else....

If terra was really THAT good wouldn't the great houses have fought over it by now? I know about the whole comstar contract thing and the promise to Jerome Blake but really who expected that to last forever?
Galaxy Commander
Zandel Corrin
Night Dragon Clan
Lafeel
11/04/08 10:33 PM
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Quote:

The more i learn about this Jihard the less i think i want to know.... it all seems a bit of a streach that they can build up to that ammount with one plannet and lettle else....

If terra was really THAT good wouldn't the great houses have fought over it by now? I know about the whole comstar contract thing and the promise to Jerome Blake but really who expected that to last forever?



More than a stretch if you ask me, but that's the canonical timeline. We don't have to like it to live with it..

Nor do we have to use it, as long as we don't try to force Catalyst into accepting our views (don't reccomend it, usually more trouble than it's worth)
Zandel_Corrin
11/04/08 10:37 PM
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*laughs*

Yes that's true.... still i always liked the idea of somone swatting the WoB fly before it got to big.... now it seems that it mutated overnight and swatted the swatters!

On a similar point... would like to know what the clans were doing while this happened.... i don't see them just sitting back and accepting the wobblies methods... hell the last clan to use nuclear arms was annihilated!
Galaxy Commander
Zandel Corrin
Night Dragon Clan
Lafeel
11/04/08 10:40 PM
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There are strong implications that something bad happened in the homeworlds (no definitive information though), which would explain a lot of things.

Plus, the Wolverines weren't as annihilated as one might think, seems a lot of them joined sides with the Wobblies.
Zandel_Corrin
11/04/08 10:45 PM
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O.O

Are you serious about that one? Is there cannon to support that?

That seems very unlikely.... they are close to 300 years apart for startes...
Galaxy Commander
Zandel Corrin
Night Dragon Clan
Lafeel
11/04/08 10:49 PM
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There is. Although I don't have that book, I do belive they got a strong mention in Jihad conspiracies.

Plus, more than one article on this site's wiki section has implied that quite a few of them did get away, or were allowed to get away by other clanners.

If the latter is the case, it was a error they have had cause to regret since.
Zandel_Corrin
11/04/08 10:52 PM
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I do remember getting the feeling that some got away.... but joining the wobblies?

still the point remains the same.... whatever happened at the clan homeworlds must have been bad to keep them from stopping the nukes...... VERY bad.....

I think i smell my next campaign idea.....

;D
Galaxy Commander
Zandel Corrin
Night Dragon Clan
Lafeel
11/04/08 10:58 PM
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That's the spirit. Rather than let things get you down, use them as a oppurtunity.:D
Karagin
11/05/08 12:38 AM
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Quote:

There are strong implications that something bad happened in the homeworlds (no definitive information though), which would explain a lot of things.

Plus, the Wolverines weren't as annihilated as one might think, seems a lot of them joined sides with the Wobblies.




The last bit is the biggest load of BS on top of some other things in Jihad...but as you said we don't have to like it or use it...
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
Karagin
11/05/08 12:41 AM
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Getting away since they did not like the tryanny that the Clans were becoming only to later jump iin bed with the WoB is two different things and given what has been published about the Wolverines prior to the Jihad hinted at nothing that would suggest they would jump into any kind of alliance with the WoB or ComStar.
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
Lafeel
11/05/08 12:49 AM
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Quote:

Quote:

There are strong implications that something bad happened in the homeworlds (no definitive information though), which would explain a lot of things.

Plus, the Wolverines weren't as annihilated as one might think, seems a lot of them joined sides with the Wobblies.




The last bit is the biggest load of BS on top of some other things in Jihad...but as you said we don't have to like it or use it...



Never said I liked it myself, was just quoting Catalyst's official (afaik) stance on the matter.

I'd tend to agree that it is a stretch that they'd join the Wobblies. In fact, I'd say it is a lot less of a stretch that they would fight against the Wobblies.
Prince_of_Darkness
11/05/08 01:34 PM
205.202.120.139

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Actually, the last of the Wolverines joined the old Comstar, at first simply for the sake of safety (I have Jihad Conspiracies) since they were in such bad shape. A few others wanted to go even father and didn't trust em' (which I can understand) so they went past the Magestry of Canopus.

As for the production issues Zandel, I am actually surprised that the WoB didn't have a larger army then they do now. Remember that the Lyrans get a pretty good precentage of their weapons & 'mechs from Hesperus II, and that Earth has 7 times it's production capability. Add in the other worlds of the Protectorate that the WoB owned in 3060 and the hidden 5, and you get one hell of a production base to work off of.
Zandel_Corrin
11/05/08 06:00 PM
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I surpose that's right about the ability but how about the resorces?

Terra is / was the birth place of BTech humanity.... it would have little to no usable resorces left and for an army you have to get that stuff from somewhere.....

And considering the clan war and such any and all resorces would be in high demand and VERY expensive.... they might have made some deals with marik but the marik army has always been somwhat lacking.....
Galaxy Commander
Zandel Corrin
Night Dragon Clan
Prince_of_Darkness
11/05/08 07:34 PM
205.202.120.139

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There is always asteroid mining- it's not like our solar system's belt is going to run out anytime soon (or anywhere else, for that matter). Also, remember that we have been mining the Earth for thousands of years- yet we still are mining it. It probably doesn't have the resources it did in the past, but that doesn't mean it doesn't have any.
Also, it could come from the other worlds in the protectorate, and not to mention that with their production capabilities, they could make some nice deals in trade (like with the Taurians, for instance).

"Marik army Lacking"? Heck no. After the clan wars house Marik was obscenely rich in selling repair and refit kits to the other houses. Their army would probably be the best one if they didn't fight each other the entire time (well, aside form anything that carries an LGR).
Zandel_Corrin
11/05/08 09:48 PM
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I smell LGR bias..... you no like?
Galaxy Commander
Zandel Corrin
Night Dragon Clan
Prince_of_Darkness
11/06/08 12:19 AM
205.202.120.139

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Quote:

I smell LGR bias..... you no like?




God no. 12 tons and 5 crits for something that does 8 points of damage and only has 4 hexes more than a standard GR/ER PPC? To me, it's just not very useful.
Venom
11/19/08 07:14 PM
75.167.204.181

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Honestly, I think that catalyst put it together pretty well in the Blake Documents. The Wolverines realy had no choice. When ComStar offered them a home, they would have jumped at the chance to take it.

Realy all that was published prior was that the Ghost Bears let some Wolverines escape. Then a group calling itself the Minnesota Tribe raided some snake worlds and then disapeared as quickly as they appeared. The cannon left it pretty open to be developed.
Prince_of_Darkness
11/19/08 08:12 PM
205.202.120.139

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Actually, the Minnesota tribe was a trick to make the IS think something happened...and to point them in some other direction.
Zandel_Corrin
11/19/08 10:04 PM
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Any proof of that prince?
Galaxy Commander
Zandel Corrin
Night Dragon Clan
Karagin
11/20/08 05:05 PM
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Really? Terra has all of this ability yet, where was it when ComStar needed to rebuild the ComGuard after Tykuiad?

Sorry but telling us the same tired BS about how Terra is the golden goose, still doesn't explain anything, it is more of coppy answer to fend off folks who, like me, keep point out the issues and problems with the WoB's hidden army.
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
Karagin
11/20/08 05:13 PM
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What page in the Blake book does it state the number of factories on Terra? And also what page is the Wolverine info on...I am having trouble finding it in the mess that seems to be the new standard for BT sourcebooks that deal with the Jihad with all the "in-character" crap. What I would give for a return to the days when you could open a sourcebook and find the info you needed, as well as easter eggs, and not have to wade through wasted pages of miss typed paragraphs that try and fail to deliver flavor text that is best left for novels or scenario packs.
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
Prince_of_Darkness
11/21/08 03:40 PM
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Quote:

Any proof of that prince?




It's in the Jihad Documents. There is a section of nothing but half-sentences oddly spaced paragraphs taken from *someones* (Kail Liao, I believe, i'll have to check tonight) notebook that talks about it.

As for Karagin...it's all right in the beginning. The book states that earth has 7 times the production of Hesperus II, and coupled with the "Hidden 5" and whatever production they possess, I side with the notion of "Why don't they have a bigger army (outside, of course, of their own population)."
Lafeel
11/21/08 03:55 PM
85.220.115.86

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Actually I'd have to agree with Karagin there. If Terra had such extensive manufacturing capabilities, then why didn't Comstar use them?
Prince_of_Darkness
11/21/08 05:01 PM
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Quote:

Actually I'd have to agree with Karagin there. If Terra had such extensive manufacturing capabilities, then why didn't Comstar use them?




Because it was never their intention to actually invade/conquer the IS.

Even when the Comguards were devastated on tukayyid, they didn't want to take too many production facilities out of mothball. I don't know why- maybe they thought that they needed to use those resources elsewhere, but they still only had a couple by 3058- and within 3 years, the WoB had taken most of them out and had them churning out material.

But the Word didn't use them just for war material, however...
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