Vapor
11/24/02 03:11 AM
202.128.69.122
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I just saw yesterday, for the first time, the new MW stuff that Wizkids is putting out. Is it just me, or is it not up to FASA standards at all? A 'mech with a chainsaw for a weapon? Have we gone from a Bt universe based on something close to reality, to one where the 'mechs look like some kind of Gundam robot? (not sure what they're called, I never did pay much attention to those cartoons  ) I hope Wizkids is going to continue putting out FASA quality material. The stuff I saw yesterday looks like something a 6yo kid would play with.
Just my 2 cents.
"For those about to rock, we salute you." - AC DC
"The evil that can come, from the heart of a man, must be answered in kind 'till it disappears, and we're safe." - Kansas
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Cray
11/24/02 06:38 AM
12.91.151.94
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There's a very good reason for a mech with a chainsaw:
After the WoB Jihad, the "Republic of the Sphere" (Terran Hegemony) is born. The Republic takes BATTLEmechs out of private hands and leaves them to the military.
In 3120, the HPG network shuts down and terrible things happen.
This leaves a lot of people without their "traditional" family-owned mechs. So they improvise: workmechs like the Forestrymech you noted are converted to fight and old, long-hidden battlemechs are repaired crudely and sent to work.
In short, the mech with the chainsaw you saw was a converted construction and labor machine, like a bulldozer turned into a tank.
Mike Miller, Materials Engineer
Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
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Vapor
11/24/02 06:53 AM
202.128.69.122
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I'm just wondering how effective a chainsaw designed and built to cut down trees would be against battlemech armor. The cost of retrofitting it would almost make it not worth it. If the chainsaw weren't strengthened and hardened immensely, it would shatter the first time it came in contact with another battlemech's hardened armor. Of course, that would make an effective anti-personnel device.
The main gripe I had, though, wasn't necessarily about the configuration of the 'mechs, but rather about their design. They are starting to look like something out of a children's cartoon. If Wizkids is trying to target the younger generation, that's great. But I hope they continue to produce FASA quality products for the older generation.
"For those about to rock, we salute you." - AC DC
"The evil that can come, from the heart of a man, must be answered in kind 'till it disappears, and we're safe." - Kansas
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Cray
11/24/02 08:23 AM
12.91.151.94
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Based on feedback on CBT's Dark Age's message board, a lot of old timers don't mind the game.
However, I do have more than a few gripes about the art. The DA Atlas is just ludicrous.
Mike Miller, Materials Engineer
Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
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Vapor
11/24/02 08:53 AM
202.128.69.122
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I'm sure if I actually sat down and tried it, I wouldn't mind the gameplay. However, like you, I'm not too keen about the artwork.
"For those about to rock, we salute you." - AC DC
"The evil that can come, from the heart of a man, must be answered in kind 'till it disappears, and we're safe." - Kansas
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Lance_Hawkins
11/24/02 12:41 PM
80.203.33.226
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About as effective as a sword, a hatchet or an axe is. Or a tree, or a mechfist, or a kick.
I espesially like the tree one 
I have seen the best of men go past, I do not want to be the last.
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Diablo
11/25/02 06:02 PM
66.203.180.31
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yeah. you'd think that if a tree can do something to a mech. a device used to cut down the tree could do something. maybe something like a modified sword where the chainsaw part doesnt start until you hit the gooey innards of the mech.
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Karagin
11/25/02 08:29 PM
68.21.149.52
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Since it seems folks think melee weapons on what are walking tanks sounds so cool...let's do away with the ammo and engery weapons having nothing but lances and swords and such...oh wait we already have that..it's call Dark Age...gee what an original uhmm idea, take Mage Knight and instead of knights and such fight we have mechs doing the same thing...Wow! That sounds like fun! NOT!
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Vapor
11/26/02 03:03 AM
202.128.71.85
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lol It sounds like you've got the same thoughts I have about MWDA.
"For those about to rock, we salute you." - AC DC
"The evil that can come, from the heart of a man, must be answered in kind 'till it disappears, and we're safe." - Kansas
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Karagin
11/26/02 02:24 PM
68.21.149.73
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Sounds like! 
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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MadWolf
11/30/02 06:15 PM
134.53.144.26
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Ya know, in the fourth succession war the inner sphere learned that MEchs and Meelee was a bad combo, Espcally when the clans remined them with that little thing called a GAUSS Rilfe. I dont think they would revert again, The regression of tech was becuase all of the star league people were long past dead and no-one remembers how to do things. After they relearned it they wouldnt loose it for atleat a few generations. the kids of the mech repaircrews whould have to die as long with there kids. HPG uplink or not, They still had space travel???? News would be slowed, But tech would just hit a standstill instead of a revert.
Nothing is Impossible, It is only Improbable.
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Karagin
11/30/02 07:00 PM
68.21.149.252
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Go look at MWDA...chain saws etc...plus the best tatic, if you want to call it that, in MWDA is to move your unit up to the other guy's best unit and touch it's based...thus it's out of the game until he destoryes the unit locking his unit...really points out that close physical combat is the main thing in MWDA...so why worry about things like Gauss Rifles or PPCs...just run up and touch the other guy and thus he is prevented from using the unit...a load of wasted BS if you ask me... 
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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BroCaptMaximus
12/01/02 12:08 AM
24.240.225.242
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I don't think it is so much a question of technical reversion as it is a matter of them having to work with what they've got. Following the WOB Jihad and the founding of the sphere there was a Sphere wide disarmament. The result was that there aren't very many honest to goodness Battlemechs in the Sphere except those controlled by the various military forces. The escalating tensions though have brought about an influx of new warriors that need rides. So in an effort to quickly bolster the various fighting forces they have started modifing various utility mechs for battle; and in some case they are even so desperate that they are sending unmodified untility mechs into battle.
What is boils down to is that they need mechs in a hurry so they are making do with what is available. They are adapting; they are overcoming.
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Vapor
12/01/02 02:22 AM
202.128.69.122
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I understand that WoB going completely bonkers and, in effect, creating the tech slow down was an idea that originated in FASA. Is that true? If so, does Wizkids have any plans to continue the storyline at all? Is that the intention behind the whole MWDA set up?
"For those about to rock, we salute you." - AC DC
"The evil that can come, from the heart of a man, must be answered in kind 'till it disappears, and we're safe." - Kansas
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Karagin
12/01/02 02:38 AM
68.21.149.24
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Based on what has been commented on and given as bonified fact, yes the WoB Jihad IS the cataylist that is the stage setter for MWDA, their actions give rise to Stone and his Republic and all the events that go with it.
Based on what TPTB are saying yes FASA came up with the WoB jihad idea...and given that WK has said that BT and MWDA will merge timeline wise then I think WK has plans to go one with THEIR VERSION of the game...which is aimed at kiddies and their parnets' pocket books.
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Vapor
12/01/02 02:40 AM
202.128.69.122
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I applaud Wizkids in their attempt to reach the younger generation with MWDA, but I feel they should use MWDA as an introductory product, and continue to provide FASA quality material for the older players.
"For those about to rock, we salute you." - AC DC
"The evil that can come, from the heart of a man, must be answered in kind 'till it disappears, and we're safe." - Kansas
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Karagin
12/01/02 02:57 AM
68.21.149.24
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That is a common feeling among the older players and what I have found very funny is hearing kids of the ages WK is aiming at, say they don't like MWDA for what ever reason and they would rather play BT and they have their reasons.
As one kid put it at a convention I went to on the 22nd thru the 24th of Novemeber, "BT wasn't broke, so why is WK messing with it?"
Out of the mouths of babes...comes wisdom that should be listened to...
But to answer your question, MONEY, folks know the name MECHWARRIOR ties into Battletch or at least to the computer games of the same name, thus WK figures these same folks, the computer players and BT crowd will buy into MWDA and thus they have a cash cow. So far based on what I have seen around where I live, the taste for MWDA has to be regional based since it seems very little is moving around here...
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Vapor
12/01/02 03:31 AM
202.128.69.122
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So far, all I've been able to find here is MWDA stuff. I still have another couple stores to check out, but I'm not holding my breath. I know that one store actually has MWDA tournaments, every now and then, so I guess it's picking up a little bit here.
"For those about to rock, we salute you." - AC DC
"The evil that can come, from the heart of a man, must be answered in kind 'till it disappears, and we're safe." - Kansas
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Karagin
12/01/02 05:38 AM
68.21.149.134
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You are on an island...the prices have to outrageous...what's the average price mark up for things on Guam, outside of the PX or BX or naval exchange?
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Vapor
12/01/02 05:53 AM
202.128.69.122
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It's not really as bad as you would expect, for most stuff. Fast food prices are the same as on the mainland. On average, though, you can expect to pay about 1.2 to 1.5 times what you would pay on the mainland. But that's a rough guess on my part. I'm not sure of the exact numbers.
"For those about to rock, we salute you." - AC DC
"The evil that can come, from the heart of a man, must be answered in kind 'till it disappears, and we're safe." - Kansas
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Karagin
12/01/02 06:40 AM
68.21.149.134
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Sounds the same as things run in Hawaii...
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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neochu
12/02/02 11:02 AM
209.202.75.74
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especially in the windsor area. There are MWDA materials all over the place a total marketing blitz. in the mall here there are three stores that carry MWDA stuff and none even in a radus of 400 km there is not a store that I know of. there is a possiblity of a store called Mind games in toronto but I have to go down there to get it or check it out not to mention the fact the the guy at games workshop thinks there not made any more. even three years ago there was a small store crowded into a corner in dt windsor but he went out of business. the thing is the gundam anime thing makes buisness men drool as the franchises of that type make money. then its pulled out and dumped to make new money. however there are still pockets of these stores all around in small places mech depot.com is a good one that sells the new minatures and other things fromk Iron wind and other manufacturers. its in Peralta NM I think if you find a store or area that sells this stuff in al arger city around you at least over 100,000 you may find a good community. and if this game is slowly spread from person to person. this game will come back. they have tried to cancel it three times before but it keeps coming back. If battletech is that good it will still stay. It may even begin a classic. Also I think the CBT game should have a rule book for kids. in the 12 area as The themes covered in battle tech are appropriate to other media out there.
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Karagin
12/02/02 02:31 PM
68.21.149.236
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Actually BT has always had a simplfied rule book, it came with the BOX SET of the game...had easy to use format and made teaching the game very easy...to bad they couldn't keep the BOX SET in print or reprint the rule book from it as needed...
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Bob_Richter
12/02/02 03:07 PM
134.39.195.23
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...did anyone ever tell you that you're an idiot?
MOST of the 'Mechs in MWDA *DO NOT* HAVE MELEE WEAPONS!
-Bob (The Magnificent) Richter
Assertions made in this post are the humble opinion of Bob.
They are not necessarily statements of fact or decrees from God Himself, unless explicitly and seriously stated to be so.
:)
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Bob_Richter
12/02/02 03:11 PM
134.39.195.23
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>>>Ya know, in the fourth succession war the inner sphere learned that MEchs and Meelee was a bad combo,<<<
Actually, precisely the opposite thing happened, the Hatchetman (the only Melee-weapon-carrying 'Mech of the time) shone and led to the development of such monstrosities as the Axman and the Berserker.
>>>Espcally when the clans remined them with that little thing called a GAUSS Rilfe.<<<
The, um, Clans didn't come around until about 3050, some TWENTY YEARS after the Fourth Succession War.
Even when they did, melee weapons (as mounted on the Hatchetman and Axman) proved SO EFFECTIVE against the Clans' tactics that House Kurita decided to develop the Sword.
In other words, you just flunked Battletech History 101.
-Bob (The Magnificent) Richter
Assertions made in this post are the humble opinion of Bob.
They are not necessarily statements of fact or decrees from God Himself, unless explicitly and seriously stated to be so.
:)
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Bob_Richter
12/02/02 03:12 PM
134.39.195.23
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NEWS FLASH!
THIS IS PRECISELY WHAT IS HAPPENING!
DOESN'T ANYONE PAY ANY ATTENTION AT ALL?!
-Bob (The Magnificent) Richter
Assertions made in this post are the humble opinion of Bob.
They are not necessarily statements of fact or decrees from God Himself, unless explicitly and seriously stated to be so.
:)
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Bob_Richter
12/02/02 03:14 PM
134.39.195.23
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From this post it is clear that YOU HAVE NEVER PLAYED MWDA.
I find THAT amusing.
-Bob (The Magnificent) Richter
Assertions made in this post are the humble opinion of Bob.
They are not necessarily statements of fact or decrees from God Himself, unless explicitly and seriously stated to be so.
:)
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Karagin
12/02/02 04:18 PM
68.21.149.111
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Did anyone ever tell you that you need to read:
No personal attacks
Speak to each other in a civil manner
MOST of the mechs that they have shown us, DO have melee weapons...
So how about you go away and leave folks alone since you start off once more with the personal attacks...
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Karagin
12/02/02 04:21 PM
68.21.149.111
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Listen here Bob, I have played the game, and I find it to a joke.
But coming from you and your biased stance nothing surprises me.
And once more you start with the attacks on folks you can't agree or get along with.
Try reading the rules again Bob, here let me help you out:
No personal attacks.
Speak to each other in a civil manner.
Maybe you feel you are above the rules, but news flash you aren't.
So seeing how you can not follow them and in doing so allow others to have an opinion, please do not reply to my posting.
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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ChalengerII
12/02/02 05:24 PM
62.254.0.4
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never realy seen the use of melle weapons except in close range ambushs everytime someone uses them on me I just fall back while fireing as fast as possible into the nearest enemy mech each time. By the time hes close enought and has won the inititive (Only once have I seen a melle weapon attack something which is avoiding it without winning the initative) there tends to be too few mechs left to make an inpression and a kick is generaly only slightly less useful.
Challenger
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MadWolf
12/02/02 07:26 PM
134.53.144.37
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The Fourth sucession war was a point of refrence. The clans did invade after the fourth sucession war, Granted it was 20 years, But 20 years on the battletech time line isn't all that much. Meelee was used much because the weapons were staring to wear out and become more scarece. They worked with what they had. And yes Meelee comabt is extreemly lethal. But it risks your own mech and you have to be right next to the mech you want to meelee with. They did make the axeman, and at the time it was effective. Then the clans invaded. things HAD to change. People had a refresh of weapons tech and figured out that if an axeman was comming, just stay away from right next to it. A mech with any sort of range whould just engage it from afar. Stay out of the swinging arc and it cant unleash its primary weapon.  An uller with a gauss rifle can pick at a axeman at great distance then move in with the kill of the medium lasers and the axeman could never get a swing in. I've done such a thing before. Another thing aginst meelee weapons is that they are only as effective as the weight of the mech. a 20 tonner with a hatchet is kinda silly. and a 100 tonner with a hatchet is scary at first untill you realize that they are so slow that they can not really use it effectively. I may have failed BThistory 101, But i know tactics well enough that if i had a axe and the other guy has a gun, I loose........ 
Nothing is Impossible, It is only Improbable.
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MadWolf
12/02/02 07:31 PM
134.53.144.37
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I have a feeling that there will ba another flame war, and people will come here and see how much our UBB board looks like a arguement held buy six year olds. Every body, just keep some sense that were are mature people here, ok??
Nothing is Impossible, It is only Improbable.
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Toastrider
12/03/02 12:05 AM
172.165.241.34
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Bob, Bob, Bob.
I hope nobody's filed a complaint with Nic yet. It'd be a shame for you to abruptly vanish for acting like that.
MadWolf, you do need to go back and reread your timelines. Incidentially, the Gauss is not a Clan innovation; the 2750-era Highlander and King Crab had Gauss rifles, just to name two.
The only thing I learned from the Fourth Succession War was that pissing off Hanse Davion was a REALLY BAD IDEA  Now there was a guy who could carry a grudge like nobody's business
Jury's still out on MWDA. I just... I cringe at the storyline leading up to it (reminiscent of Bob Budiansky's writing on the old Transformers comic, first run). I am not fond of the Clix system either; it strikes me as a rewired version of the CCG with pre-painted Mechs. I miss seeing about a hundred different kinds of Mechs alone, to be honest.
--Toasty
"The survivors, not the victors, write the history books."
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Nightward
12/03/02 01:19 AM
210.50.61.250
|
What the hell is wrong with you two? How many times do you have to air the same tired old personal grievances here?
I think it might be best if you pair simply didn't respond to each other's posts.
Yea, verily. Let it be known far and wide that Nightward loathes MW: DA. Indeed, it is with the BURNING ANIMUS OF A THOUSAND SUNS that he doth rage against it with.
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Karagin
12/03/02 02:27 AM
68.21.149.65
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You know I have asked him do just that...not to read or reply to my post...but I guess he is not goingto listen to reason. Maybe you should PM and tell him how tired you are of this crap...
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Vapor
12/03/02 02:53 AM
202.128.71.85
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If that IS, in fact, Wizkid's goal in putting out MWDA, why are they taking so long to put out anything else? They jumped all over MWDA, why haven't I seen any strides towards anything else?
"For those about to rock, we salute you." - AC DC
"The evil that can come, from the heart of a man, must be answered in kind 'till it disappears, and we're safe." - Kansas
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Vapor
12/03/02 02:57 AM
202.128.71.85
|
I still have my box set. Not physically with me, it's in storage (for which I kick myself several times a day), but I've still got it.
"For those about to rock, we salute you." - AC DC
"The evil that can come, from the heart of a man, must be answered in kind 'till it disappears, and we're safe." - Kansas
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Vapor
12/03/02 03:02 AM
202.128.71.85
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My memory of the start of the Fourth Succession War is a little clouded. Who was Hanse Davion mad at? I was under the impression that all the planets he invaded were to be a wedding gift to his bride. The invasion did kick off on his wedding day, right? And things just snowballed from there, as situations tend to do in the BT universe.
"For those about to rock, we salute you." - AC DC
"The evil that can come, from the heart of a man, must be answered in kind 'till it disappears, and we're safe." - Kansas
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Bob_Richter
12/03/02 04:15 AM
4.35.174.250
|
>>>How many times do you have to air the same tired old personal grievances here? <<<
How many times do I have to tell you that I have no standing grievance against Karagin?
>>>I think it might be best if you pair simply didn't respond to each other's posts. <<<
I will not be censored.
-Bob (The Magnificent) Richter
Assertions made in this post are the humble opinion of Bob.
They are not necessarily statements of fact or decrees from God Himself, unless explicitly and seriously stated to be so.
:)
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Bob_Richter
12/03/02 04:22 AM
4.35.174.250
|
>>>The clans did invade after the fourth sucession war, Granted it was 20 years, But 20 years on the battletech time line isn't all that much.<<<
In the Third Succession War, you'd be right. Afterwards, you'd be quite wrong.
>>>Meelee was used much because the weapons were staring to wear out and become more scarece.<<<
Nope. Noone knows quite why they put a Hatchet on the Hatchetman (as it thus became known,) but the results are a matter of historical record. The success of the design led to the creation of the Axman.
>>>They did make the axeman, and at the time it was effective. Then the clans invaded. things HAD to change.<<<
Wrong again. The Axman's record against the Clans was every bit as impressive as the Hatchetman's record against the Kuritans. This is also a matter of historical record. The success of the Axman led to divers designs, including the Berserker.
>>>I may have failed BThistory 101,<<<
And you did. Don't forget it.
>>>But i know tactics well enough that if i had a axe and the other guy has a gun, I loose........ <<<
What's that Weird Al song?
"Everything you know is wrong" or something like that.
You can only pick a hatcheter apart at range if
1) The map is completely flat.
2) Your opponent is an idiot.
3) You ALWAYS win the initiative.
I've seen Hatchetmen, Axmen, Berserkers (and things far MORE potent in melees) all use their weapons effectively in combat against those desperately trying to avoid that result.
-Bob (The Magnificent) Richter
Assertions made in this post are the humble opinion of Bob.
They are not necessarily statements of fact or decrees from God Himself, unless explicitly and seriously stated to be so.
:)
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Bob_Richter
12/03/02 04:24 AM
4.35.174.250
|
Hanse Davion was (or so the story goes) persuing a grudge against Mad Max Liao.
His practical achievement in 4SW was, however, to connect the two halves of the new Federated Commonwealth.
-Bob (The Magnificent) Richter
Assertions made in this post are the humble opinion of Bob.
They are not necessarily statements of fact or decrees from God Himself, unless explicitly and seriously stated to be so.
:)
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Bob_Richter
12/03/02 04:25 AM
4.35.174.250
|
WizKids isn't producing Classic Battletech, FanPro is.
A number of products (somewhat greater than 1, I believe) have already been released.
-Bob (The Magnificent) Richter
Assertions made in this post are the humble opinion of Bob.
They are not necessarily statements of fact or decrees from God Himself, unless explicitly and seriously stated to be so.
:)
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Bob_Richter
12/03/02 04:27 AM
4.35.174.250
|
Whatever, Karagin.
-Bob (The Magnificent) Richter
Assertions made in this post are the humble opinion of Bob.
They are not necessarily statements of fact or decrees from God Himself, unless explicitly and seriously stated to be so.
:)
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Vapor
12/03/02 04:33 AM
202.128.71.85
|
The uniting of the Federated Suns and the Lyran Commonwealth was achieved through Hanse Davion's marriage to Melissa Steiner, not the Fourth Succession War. If I remember correctly, Hanse's main thrust in his invasion was into Kuritan space.
"For those about to rock, we salute you." - AC DC
"The evil that can come, from the heart of a man, must be answered in kind 'till it disappears, and we're safe." - Kansas
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Vapor
12/03/02 04:34 AM
202.128.71.85
|
Ok, then. Who is FanPro, and why have I never heard of them before?
"For those about to rock, we salute you." - AC DC
"The evil that can come, from the heart of a man, must be answered in kind 'till it disappears, and we're safe." - Kansas
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Bob_Richter
12/03/02 04:45 AM
4.35.174.250
|
>>>If I remember correctly, Hanse's main thrust in his invasion was into Kuritan space. <<<
You remember wrong.
It was into the Capellan Confederation.
>>>The uniting of the Federated Suns and the Lyran Commonwealth was achieved through Hanse Davion's marriage to Melissa Steiner,<<<
Politically, yes.
I was talking about physically.
-Bob (The Magnificent) Richter
Assertions made in this post are the humble opinion of Bob.
They are not necessarily statements of fact or decrees from God Himself, unless explicitly and seriously stated to be so.
:)
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Bob_Richter
12/03/02 04:46 AM
4.35.174.250
|
And you haven't heard of them because you are a terribly underinformed person (meaning no disrespect.)
Go look on www.ClassicBattletech.com and come back when you're done.
-Bob (The Magnificent) Richter
Assertions made in this post are the humble opinion of Bob.
They are not necessarily statements of fact or decrees from God Himself, unless explicitly and seriously stated to be so.
:)
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Vapor
12/03/02 05:23 AM
202.128.71.85
|
He did gobble up a bunch of Kuritan planets, though. My point, however, was that he didn't attack any Lyran worlds.
"For those about to rock, we salute you." - AC DC
"The evil that can come, from the heart of a man, must be answered in kind 'till it disappears, and we're safe." - Kansas
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Vapor
12/03/02 05:26 AM
202.128.71.85
|
How new is that site? I've done numerous searches for BattleTech sites over the past few years, and I've never turned up that one.
Another question. Are they not allowing products to be purchased via their web page? Or am I just not finding the way to do it?
"For those about to rock, we salute you." - AC DC
"The evil that can come, from the heart of a man, must be answered in kind 'till it disappears, and we're safe." - Kansas
Edited by Vapor (12/03/02 05:36 AM)
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Karagin
12/03/02 07:48 AM
68.21.149.194
|
Go to this site:
www.classicbattletech.com
It has the links you are looking for and is FP's US page...acutally it's suppose to be the offical BT page.
Fast Forward Games (think that is right) is the company that is main hub for buying BT stuff, there is a link on the CBT site.
Hope this helps.
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Warner_Doles
12/03/02 09:57 AM
206.27.40.58
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In reply to:
"I've seen Hatchetmen, Axmen, Berserkers (and things far MORE potent in melees) all use their weapons effectively in combat against those desperately trying to avoid that result."
Agreed. A Ti Ts' ang is one dangerous mother in the field. That Dragonfly he he likes so much would be eaten alive by a 60 ton machine that is nearly as fast as it is! 24 points on a strike with TSM hot. (Berserker too... but I don't like it much. )
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Warner_Doles
12/03/02 10:04 AM
206.27.40.58
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In reply to:
"MOST of the mechs that they have shown us, DO have melee weapons..."
Actually I believe its 5 (8 if you count the MODS as a seperate 'Mech but really only one type of 'Mech) with Melee weapons that I can count of the top of my head.
ForestryMech
ConstructionMech
AgroMech
MiningMech
Hatcheman
This is only a handful of 'Mechs out of the total number out and coming out soon.
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Warner_Doles
12/03/02 10:17 AM
206.27.40.58
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In reply to:
"Are they not allowing products to be purchased via their web page? Or am I just not finding the way to do it?"
Correct. ClassicBattleTech.com will never be a site that product can be purchased from. Fast Forward Entertainment is our distributor and point of sale for product. You can find their site at Fast Forward Entertainment. For miniatures you can get them from Ironwind Metals. Good luck!
BTW, check out what is getting ready to be released in the next two months too. That information can be found at Product Information.
Enjoy!
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Toastrider
12/03/02 10:37 AM
172.155.115.46
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As told by the Prince himself at the end of Warrior: Coupe, Hanse Davion's rampage through the Capellan Confederation was to more or less break House Liao as a power in the Inner Sphere, mostly due to Max Liao's brain-wiping someone and reprogramming them to be a duplicate of the Prince. It wasn't the 'double' tactic that torqued Hanse off so much as it was how Max had more or less stolen the dupe's life, looks, and memory.
I don't think the Federated Suns or Lyran Commonwealth gained many Kurita worlds, from what I've read in the Warrior trilogy. The Lyrans didn't seem to get much due to shenanigans in the Isle of Skye (thanks, Aldo Lestrade, you PUTZ). And the Draconis March border was secured with the help of Wolf's Dragoons, who were battered from Misery but still strong enough to keep the pressure off the Federated Suns while the Feds pummelled the Capellans into oatmeal. The differences in the borders between 3028 and, say, 3040 don't seem particularly profound for the Drac/Lyran or Drac/Fed borders.
--Toasty
"The survivors, not the victors, write the history books."
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Toastrider
12/03/02 10:40 AM
172.155.115.46
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Luck always plays a factor in battles. However, I can think of a couple environments where hatchet-mounting Mechs are not only useful, but downright dangerous. Urban combat, heavy woods... any area where visibility and ranges are shortened by obstacles, and where you can't get up to speed easily. Walking around a corner and running into an Axman can be a real pain in the ass...
--Toasty
"The survivors, not the victors, write the history books."
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Karagin
12/03/02 11:07 AM
68.21.149.149
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That's nice, point is still vailded...most have melee weapons of some type...
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Warner_Doles
12/03/02 12:40 PM
206.27.40.58
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Eric define most please. You are using it as a statement that the majority of the MechWarrior Darkage miniatures have melee weapons. That persumption on your part is wrong and your statement is misrepresentation of the facts. 5 'Mechs out of the line does not constitute the majority or most. It represents a small percentage.
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Karagin
12/03/02 01:03 PM
68.21.149.239
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5 of the mechs that are relased have melee weapons of some type...then we toss in the Hatchetman and other mechs like the Axman that raises the total to 7, plus given the "low" number of combat mechs there will be MORE mechs with things like chainsaws and such...thus MOST of the mechs encounterd in MWDA will have some kind of melee weapon.
And given that this my opinion based off what I have seen of the miniatures out for the game and have used in several games, to me it's clear that the idea melee weapons is part of the fiction. I still stand by the idea that melee weapons belong on Solaris and there alone NOT out on the battlefield.
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Warner_Doles
12/03/02 01:18 PM
206.27.40.58
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5 of the mechs that are relased have melee weapons of some type...then we toss in the Hatchetman and other mechs like the Axman that raises the total to 7, plus given the "low" number of combat mechs there will be MORE mechs with things like chainsaws and such...thus MOST of the mechs encounterd in MWDA will have some kind of melee weapon.
Eric...5 'Mechs include the Hatchetman. The Axman hasn't been released. Even if it is, and all the other 'Mechs of the Classic BattleTech line are planned to be added at some time (including all the new Reseens) the Melee Weapon Equipped 'Mechs will be a very small percentage of 'Mechs so armed. Your original statement was that most of all the MWDA 'Mechs released are so armed. This is not the case. Look I know you abhor, hate and deplore any WizKids/MechWarrior Darkage, but if you are going to discredit something like this you should at least do so with the correct information so that what you say is credible. Otherwise it comes off as some half back assertion filled with emotional discontentment.
And given that this my opinion based off what I have seen of the miniatures out for the game and have used in several games, to me it's clear that the idea melee weapons is part of the fiction.
True, it is your opinion. None the less it doesn't make it correct in as much as you would want to believe. The truth of the matter that only a handful of 'Mechs have melee weapons in MechWarrior Darkage and Classic BattleTech. Even if they changed that and armed every 'Mech with a sword, club, ax, knive, bastardsword, katana or mace it wouldn't take nothing from the game. It would make close attacks even more deadlier. You may not like them and believe they belong in Solaris 7 arenas, again doesn't make it a fact. In your game yes. In the canon universe, mine or everyone else, no.
It would be far easier to discuss with you these things if you would simply state that in your opinion you believe as you stated here. Far less eruptions of discontentment would rise up from the depths of hades too!
I still challenge you to a MWDA dual at GenCon 2003 if you have the brass to do so...
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Warner_Doles
12/03/02 01:20 PM
206.27.40.58
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In reply to:
"any area where visibility and ranges are shortened by obstacles, and where you can't get up to speed easily. Walking around a corner and running into an Axman can be a real pain in the ass..."
Oh yeah. Try having a Ti Ts ang get you in the back when its TSM is active and you're back armor is already layed open, in the dark dank woods..while it was hidden from you too....
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Karagin
12/03/02 01:27 PM
68.21.149.239
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Only way I will play MWDA is if you agree to tossing out the rule about touching bases together...other wise I am not wasting my time with the game.
Now IF my drill dates stay as they are I might be able to do GenCon this year...that is also if Saddam stops trying to act like he is Mr. Cool.
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Warner_Doles
12/03/02 01:52 PM
206.27.40.57
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"Only way I will play MWDA is if you agree to tossing out the rule about touching bases together...other wise I am not wasting my time with the game."
Yeah I don't like that rule much either! Sure we can do away with the "roll if you touch bases crap" if you want... Besides, we won't get close enough for that. My Ryoken II will obliterate you before hand! muahahaha
"Now IF my drill dates stay as they are I might be able to do GenCon this year..."
Cool.. let's hope you can make it then!
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Karagin
12/03/02 02:24 PM
68.21.149.35
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I wonder if I can convince my CO that a trip to Ohio for GenCon would fall under small unit training...
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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ChalengerII
12/03/02 03:47 PM
62.254.0.4
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sure your practicing advanced armored combat
Challenger
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MadWolf
12/04/02 02:35 AM
134.53.28.106
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you can sit here and arge with me, that no prob, i acctually learn alot from this, but that little " everything you know is wrong" comment isn't helping prove your point about the axeman. It served no point. I'd still rather have a hunchback over a axeman. The only phyical attack i use is DFA and thats only in clint's usually.
Nothing is Impossible, It is only Improbable.
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Bob_Richter
12/04/02 04:36 AM
4.35.174.250
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I didn't suggest that he did.
-Bob (The Magnificent) Richter
Assertions made in this post are the humble opinion of Bob.
They are not necessarily statements of fact or decrees from God Himself, unless explicitly and seriously stated to be so.
:)
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Nightward
12/05/02 04:46 AM
203.134.42.225
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Who said anything about being censored? I'm not a moderator, so I can't delete your stuff. I'm just pointing out that I have heard these same arguments over and over and am tired of reading them. Karagin says he is happy not to reply to your stuff, so if you would just return the favour, the bickering would stop.
I'm not taking anybody's side, here- I'm just tired of the same old flame war BS that you two keep going.
Yea, verily. Let it be known far and wide that Nightward loathes MW: DA. Indeed, it is with the BURNING ANIMUS OF A THOUSAND SUNS that he doth rage against it with.
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Bob_Richter
12/05/02 01:52 PM
4.35.174.250
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You don't understand. I refuse to be censored, even by myself.
I will not deprive myself of the right to comment by refusing ever to answer someone's posts (no matter what I usually think of his opinions.)
Karagin can end the "bickering" on his own if that's truly his desire. It takes two to bicker, after all.
-Bob (The Magnificent) Richter
Assertions made in this post are the humble opinion of Bob.
They are not necessarily statements of fact or decrees from God Himself, unless explicitly and seriously stated to be so.
:)
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Bloodrider
12/05/02 06:33 PM
64.12.96.167
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>You don't understand. I refuse to be censored, even by myself.
I will not deprive myself of the right to comment by refusing ever to answer someone's posts (no matter what I usually think of his opinions.)<
Now that is twisted logic. I like it.
"Gentlemen, you can't fight in here. This is the war room..." -from Dr. Strangelove
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realworldviews
12/06/02 12:39 AM
24.98.65.31
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They are planning on re-releasing the BOX SET this month.
Check out the New releases on CBT.
Colonel Brian Davis
Gamers United
"Dreams become reality, for all who start off with a dream"
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realworldviews
12/06/02 12:49 AM
24.98.65.31
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in MWDA is to move your unit up to the other guy's best unit and touch it's based...thus it's out of the game until he destoryes the unit locking his unit...
You do have a chance to move away from another figure if you are touching bases. You just have to make a roll to do it.
I can see where you are coming from because I felt as strongly as you do when this all fbegan to come out. BUt I have come to relize that It's not the worst thing that could have happened. I have played BattleTech for at least 11 years and I would have hated to see it just disappear. And that is what could have happened. I have figured that if WK is able to make money off MWDA maybe they will send some of that toward CBT. At least they we can have more new stuff.
And Heck if you don't like the way MWDA plays, don't play it.
I now play MWDA sometimes, but my heart will always be with CBT and I play it as often as I get the chance to.
Colonel Brian Davis
Gamers United
"Dreams become reality, for all who start off with a dream"
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realworldviews
12/06/02 12:59 AM
24.98.65.31
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well at least the weapony matches the figure.
400XL engine
2 -ER Large Lasers
1- Gauss rifle
2- Streak SRM 6
Not a bad mech, but they could have made it not so anorexic looking. It does look much better in person than it does in pictures. I have one and I thought that it was going to look like crap. But as I said it doesn't look that bad.
Colonel Brian Davis
Gamers United
"Dreams become reality, for all who start off with a dream"
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realworldviews
12/06/02 01:07 AM
24.98.65.31
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??? I can't find the personal attack in Bob's last post.
Now the post in a different part of this thread where he called you an idiot could probably be construed as a personal attack, but if that is the post you are referring to then you should have pointed out the rule in a reply to that post. Not in reply to a post in a different area of a thread.
But with that said I now return you to your regularly scheduled Flame war.
Colonel Brian Davis
Gamers United
"Dreams become reality, for all who start off with a dream"
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Karagin
12/06/02 03:27 AM
68.21.149.90
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No??? Really??? WOW!! Like they didn't already have that out several months ago... 
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Karagin
12/06/02 03:30 AM
68.21.149.90
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NEWS FLASH:
I won't be supporting MWDA by buying ANYTHING related to it.
Why are they going to spend money on us? It's clear that 80% of their work and effort are three things, Both versions of Hero Click and MWDA. BT is a something that is now the red head stepchild and we all know the sterotype for that now don't we...
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Karagin
12/06/02 03:33 AM
68.21.149.90
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Please do me and everyone else here a favor:
DON'T jump and stir things up.
I will not be replying to any thing Bob says and if he choses to comment on things I say I will talk to Slayer about that when and if it happens.
I have asked him not to reply and based on other folks comments and such they have asked him to do the same. So if you want to bother someone over this, please talk to him, since I am not going to worry about him anymore and if he feels he must comment just to flame or attack then I am sure the moderators and such will do something about it.
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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MadWolf
12/06/02 08:47 AM
134.53.144.25
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Man, mention MW:DA and everyone gets a silly look on there face . Oh well, Wizkids found a Money cow, Bought it and thats all that really can be done. We can B$%CH all we want but that won't really effect the outcome eh? At least we still have somthing to B@$#CH about because if battletech wasn't bought, it wouldn't exist anymore, execpt in the hearts of all her players. If life hands you a bone, it dosn't want to know how good it taste .
Nothing is Impossible, It is only Improbable.
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Vapor
12/07/02 02:29 AM
202.128.69.122
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Don't think of it as censoring. Think of it as showing a greater level of maturity.
No offense intended to anyone, but when arguments are dragged out over minor points, it tends to start sounding like a schoolyard argument over whose dad can beat up whose.
"For those about to rock, we salute you." - AC DC
"The evil that can come, from the heart of a man, must be answered in kind 'till it disappears, and we're safe." - Kansas
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NathanKell
12/07/02 02:39 PM
67.86.58.8
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And pretty soon Justin Allard gets dragged in, at that.
-NathanKell, BT Space Wars
Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason, than that of blind-folded fear.
Thomas Jefferson |
Nightward
12/07/02 10:04 PM
210.50.62.24
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No text
Yea, verily. Let it be known far and wide that Nightward loathes MW: DA. Indeed, it is with the BURNING ANIMUS OF A THOUSAND SUNS that he doth rage against it with.
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Bob_Richter
12/09/02 06:37 AM
4.35.174.250
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If I felt like showing a "greater level of maturity" I would do it through posting, not through failing to do so.
-Bob (The Magnificent) Richter
Assertions made in this post are the humble opinion of Bob.
They are not necessarily statements of fact or decrees from God Himself, unless explicitly and seriously stated to be so.
:)
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Bob_Richter
12/09/02 06:41 AM
4.35.174.250
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>>>I will not be replying to any thing Bob says <<<
Really?
COOL! I can now say ANYTHING I WANT and Karagin won't be able to do a thing about it.
Not that he's ever kept this promise before....:P
-Bob (The Magnificent) Richter
Assertions made in this post are the humble opinion of Bob.
They are not necessarily statements of fact or decrees from God Himself, unless explicitly and seriously stated to be so.
:)
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Vapor
12/13/02 02:43 AM
202.128.69.204
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Posting is fine. There's nothing wrong with posting. Everyone's entitled to their opinion. But leave the personal attacks behind.
"For those about to rock, we salute you." - AC DC
"The evil that can come, from the heart of a man, must be answered in kind 'till it disappears, and we're safe." - Kansas
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Chunga
01/03/03 03:40 PM
66.84.240.243
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In reply to:
...did anyone ever tell you that you're an idiot?
I have. Many, many times.
Chunga
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Chunga
01/03/03 03:46 PM
66.84.240.243
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In reply to:
Walking around a corner and running into an Axman can be a real pain in the ass...
Only if you're walking backwards.
Chunga
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