Tripod
Sergeant Major
Reged: 03/14/07
Posts: 255
Loc: Denton, TX
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I.C.E. Mechs
#145274 - 03/14/07 12:58 PM (12.49.227.28)
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A friend and I are working on a perversion of Bettletech and we wanted to make use of ICE mechs. As most posts begin here, I dont have a rulebook handy. I do remember ICE's weigh 2X the normal weight. Can someone list a brief overview of how they differ.
First off, I tried TDB(The Drawing Board) and it required 10 heat sinks, no less, costing 10 tons...this is not correct?
Vehicles that use ICE's and mount balistic weapons dont require heat sinks for these weapons correct? Would mechs?
Mechanical Jump Boosters only.
Gyro's Sensors Life support and cockpit's are still standard rules?
Also...
What is this Utility Mech Internal Structure? it weighs 2X and has 2X the points of internal structure? would this mean you could mount 2X the armor?
TY in advance
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TBA
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Toontje
Colonel
Reged: 01/18/04
Posts: 2578
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Re: I.C.E. Mechs
[Re: Tripod]
#145277 - 03/14/07 01:17 PM (88.159.69.69)
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There is a new book (out now?) which contains all rules, including several other engine types if I read it right such as fission, battery and fuel cell type.
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Rather to blow up, then.
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Tripod
Sergeant Major
Reged: 03/14/07
Posts: 255
Loc: Denton, TX
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Re: I.C.E. Mechs
[Re: Toontje]
#145278 - 03/14/07 01:27 PM (12.49.227.28)
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What is this new book called?
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TBA
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Cray
General
Reged: 07/27/01
Posts: 4131
Loc: North America
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Re: I.C.E. Mechs
[Re: Tripod]
#145296 - 03/16/07 12:09 AM (147.160.136.10)
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Quote:
A friend and I are working on a perversion of Bettletech and we wanted to make use of ICE mechs. As most posts begin here, I dont have a rulebook handy. I do remember ICE's weigh 2X the normal weight. Can someone list a brief overview of how they differ.
First off, I tried TDB(The Drawing Board) and it required 10 heat sinks, no less, costing 10 tons...this is not correct?
That's wrong. You get 0 free heat sinks with the ICE. You are NOT required to add 10 heat sinks, but you should add some.
Quote:
Vehicles that use ICE's and mount balistic weapons dont require heat sinks for these weapons correct? Would mechs?
ICE mechs generate heat like normal battlemechs. You might note that fusion-powered tanks generate heat very differently from fusion-powered battlemechs.
Quote:
Gyro's Sensors Life support and cockpit's are still standard rules?
Yes. Everything else is normal battlemech stuff.
Quote:
What is this Utility Mech Internal Structure? it weighs 2X
Yes.
Quote:
and has 2X the points of internal structure?
No. It has normal internal structure points and is more vulnerable to critical hits. See Total Warfare for the latest rules on bringing WorkMechs into combat. (Hint: it's about as advisable as bringing a bulldozer into battle against an MBT.)
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Mike Miller, Materials Engineer
Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
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Cray
General
Reged: 07/27/01
Posts: 4131
Loc: North America
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Re: I.C.E. Mechs
[Re: Tripod]
#145297 - 03/16/07 12:10 AM (147.160.136.10)
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Quote:
What is this new book called?
Total Warfare gives you the game play rules.
Tech Manual gives you the construction rules.
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Mike Miller, Materials Engineer
Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
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Tripod
Sergeant Major
Reged: 03/14/07
Posts: 255
Loc: Denton, TX
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Re: I.C.E. Mechs
[Re: Cray]
#145298 - 03/16/07 01:20 AM (12.49.227.28)
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a friend picked up the TW book. we saw the bit about fuel explosions from overheating...
what about fuel consumption? conventional ICE fighters burn fuel correct? do ICE vehicles or mechs?
also, would a supercharger be compatable with an ICE engine? i know it's supposed to be lowtech but is it not an interesting thought? i never understood a supercharged funsion engine anyways...lol
side note, is the term " ICE Engine " correct? shouldn't it be " IC Engine " ?
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TBA
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Toontje
Colonel
Reged: 01/18/04
Posts: 2578
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Re: I.C.E. Mechs
[Re: Tripod]
#145299 - 03/16/07 04:13 AM (131.155.84.139)
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havent seen tech manual yet, but fuel consumption and such ought to be listed therein.
My guess (guess, I stress that) is a fuel listed such as 400 MP, with every MP spent reducing fuel supply by 1 (possibly running/flank MP costing double the MP for fuel consumption), and damage as MP remaining/10.
Seperate list for conversion from fuel mass to MP for different units of different weight. (Would be more or less similar to aerofighter rules in this regard)
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Rather to blow up, then.
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Cray
General
Reged: 07/27/01
Posts: 4131
Loc: North America
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Re: I.C.E. Mechs
[Re: Tripod]
#145320 - 03/16/07 03:21 PM (147.160.136.10)
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Quote:
what about fuel consumption? conventional ICE fighters burn fuel correct? do ICE vehicles or mechs?
Standard ICE mechs have a 600km range without additional fuel tanks. Fuel cell-powered WorkMechs have a 450km range without extension.
Quote:
i never understood a supercharged funsion engine anyways...lol
The term "supercharger" in that application is a generic term for a gizmo meant to enhance the engine. It isn't necessarily a compressor driven by the engine's crankshaft. 
Quote:
side note, is the term " ICE Engine " correct? shouldn't it be " IC Engine " ?
You are correct.
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Mike Miller, Materials Engineer
Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
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KamikazeJohnson
Major
Reged: 01/01/02
Posts: 1391
Loc: WINTERpeg, MB, Canada
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Re: I.C.E. Mechs
[Re: Cray]
#145324 - 03/16/07 07:42 PM (206.45.167.67)
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Quote:
Quote:
side note, is the term " ICE Engine " correct? shouldn't it be " IC Engine " ?
You are correct.
Whew! That clears that up...now if I can just remember my PIN number so I can get cash at the ATM machine...
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I kill $%!^.
And I enjoy the hell out of it.
--Ted Nugent
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Karagin
General
Reged: 04/21/01
Posts: 6326
Loc: Ft. Hood TX (Killeen)
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Re: I.C.E. Mechs
[Re: KamikazeJohnson]
#145364 - 03/16/07 10:04 PM (24.26.220.4)
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Oh no not that joke again! LOL!
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Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Askhati_Sonix
Sergeant Major
Reged: 02/12/07
Posts: 200
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Re: I.C.E. Mechs
[Re: Karagin]
#145381 - 03/18/07 02:37 PM (168.209.97.42)
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Spank me if it sounds silly, but what about a fission engine? It could function as an intermediary between the ICE (lowTech) and the standard fusion - maybe 1.25x or 1.5x standard tonnage, 0.75x normal cost, and two extra crits in the CT?
Call it a brain-fart if you want...
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Evolve or DIE!
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Tripod
Sergeant Major
Reged: 03/14/07
Posts: 255
Loc: Denton, TX
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Re: I.C.E. Mechs
[Re: Askhati_Sonix]
#145382 - 03/18/07 04:30 PM (12.49.227.28)
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"There is a new book (out now?) which contains all rules, including several other engine types if I read it right such as fission, battery and fuel cell type."
new books are "Total Warfare" or "Tech Manual"
not sure of the rules/stats...
If i started a new thread, would anyone be interested in coming up with, or sharing some ICE designs? Some friends and i are coming up with our own tech manual for a scenario we are working on. most of the designs will be theme based so fluff should be easy, and somewhat interesting...
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TBA
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Askhati_Sonix
Sergeant Major
Reged: 02/12/07
Posts: 200
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Re: I.C.E. Mechs
[Re: Tripod]
#145389 - 03/19/07 02:21 AM (155.232.128.10)
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So does anyone have this new book yet? I am quite curious on the new engine types - can someone please give a quick summary on how they differ from the standard fusion engines?
@ Tripod:
Sure, what are you looking for specifically? I did a theme-based series of BattleMechs some time ago (search this forum for the PAF company and designs like the Sparviero, [Saetta) for a Periphery-based BattleMech supplier, and this ICE idea of yours has a very definate Periphery sound to it. Would love to see what you guys have so far.
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Evolve or DIE!
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Cray
General
Reged: 07/27/01
Posts: 4131
Loc: North America
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Re: I.C.E. Mechs
[Re: Askhati_Sonix]
#145395 - 03/19/07 06:06 AM (147.160.136.10)
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Quote:
Spank me if it sounds silly, but what about a fission engine? It could function as an intermediary between the ICE (lowTech) and the standard fusion - maybe 1.25x or 1.5x standard tonnage, 0.75x normal cost, and two extra crits in the CT?
Fission engines are available for WorkMechs only. They are addressed in the new Tech Manual.
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Mike Miller, Materials Engineer
Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
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Askhati_Sonix
Sergeant Major
Reged: 02/12/07
Posts: 200
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Re: I.C.E. Mechs
[Re: Cray]
#145450 - 03/22/07 02:09 AM (155.232.128.10)
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Since we are on the topic of WorkMechs and the like, could anyone please explain why the WorkMechs have an internal structure that weights twice as much as the IS on a BattleMech? Also, are there any perks to this extra weight (eg increased lifting capacity, extra crits), or not?
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Evolve or DIE!
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Toontje
Colonel
Reged: 01/18/04
Posts: 2578
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Re: I.C.E. Mechs
[Re: Askhati_Sonix]
#145452 - 03/22/07 05:48 AM (131.155.84.139)
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Probably similar to the difference between standard IS and endo IS. No perks, just cheaper at the cost of some additional weight.
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Rather to blow up, then.
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Cray
General
Reged: 07/27/01
Posts: 4131
Loc: North America
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Re: I.C.E. Mechs
[Re: Askhati_Sonix]
#145460 - 03/22/07 02:24 PM (147.160.136.10)
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Quote:
Since we are on the topic of WorkMechs and the like, could anyone please explain why the WorkMechs have an internal structure that weights twice as much as the IS on a BattleMech?
For the same reason that a fighter jet has a lower structural weight (for the same strength) than a civilian aircraft.
BattleMechs are built with complicated composite materials. Standard internal structures are composites of foamed aluminum cores cased in strong steel and wrapped in silicon carbide fibers. Endosteel uses super-strong, heavily alloyed steel produced in zero-G, cored with a modified aluminum foam that is also a zero-G product.
WorkMechs are built with simple, cheap, civilian materials, like plain steel tubing.
There are no perks to the WorkMech structure except (per Tech Manual) reduced cost. The WorkMech structure is more vulnerable to crits, twice as heavy, and provides the same number of internal structure points as BattleMech structures.
Oh, there is another advantage to WorkMech structures: civilian firms can buy it. Governments won't be inclined to let John Deere-3067 build its latest DiggerMech on a BattleMech structure.
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Mike Miller, Materials Engineer
Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
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Askhati_Sonix
Sergeant Major
Reged: 02/12/07
Posts: 200
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Re: I.C.E. Mechs
[Re: Cray]
#145473 - 03/22/07 11:40 PM (155.232.128.10)
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Point. Although that lovely shade of green John Deere uses would look SO sexy on a refitted WorkMech...
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Evolve or DIE!
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Askhati_Sonix
Sergeant Major
Reged: 02/12/07
Posts: 200
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Re: I.C.E. Mechs
[Re: Askhati_Sonix]
#145526 - 03/25/07 06:03 AM (168.209.97.42)
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Are there currently any items in use that can increase the lifting capabilities of a 'Mech? Something perhaps like enhanced actuators, a different IS, anything like that?
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Evolve or DIE!
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Cray
General
Reged: 07/27/01
Posts: 4131
Loc: North America
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Re: I.C.E. Mechs
[Re: Askhati_Sonix]
#145545 - 03/25/07 03:43 PM (147.160.136.10)
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Quote:
Are there currently any items in use that can increase the lifting capabilities of a 'Mech? Something perhaps like enhanced actuators, a different IS, anything like that?
There's the lift hoist item for workmechs. The Tech Manual covers it.
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Mike Miller, Materials Engineer
Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
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KamikazeJohnson
Major
Reged: 01/01/02
Posts: 1391
Loc: WINTERpeg, MB, Canada
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Re: I.C.E. Mechs
[Re: Askhati_Sonix]
#145550 - 03/25/07 11:06 PM (207.161.41.161)
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Quote:
Are there currently any items in use that can increase the lifting capabilities of a 'Mech? Something perhaps like enhanced actuators, a different IS, anything like that?
TSM doubles your lifting capacity when active, but I gather you're looking for something more low-tech?
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I kill $%!^.
And I enjoy the hell out of it.
--Ted Nugent
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Toontje
Colonel
Reged: 01/18/04
Posts: 2578
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Re: I.C.E. Mechs
[Re: KamikazeJohnson]
#145551 - 03/26/07 12:57 AM (88.159.71.247)
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industrial TSM
Always on, but has some drawbacks that slipped me for the moment.
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Rather to blow up, then.
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Askhati_Sonix
Sergeant Major
Reged: 02/12/07
Posts: 200
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Re: I.C.E. Mechs
[Re: Toontje]
#145554 - 03/26/07 02:25 AM (155.232.128.10)
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Where can I get the rules on this Industrial TSM? And how exactly does the lifthoist function - is it basically like a crane built into the location (I assume torso only), or does it work differently?
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Evolve or DIE!
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Toontje
Colonel
Reged: 01/18/04
Posts: 2578
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Re: I.C.E. Mechs
[Re: Askhati_Sonix]
#145563 - 03/26/07 08:04 AM (131.155.104.195)
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TW
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Rather to blow up, then.
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Christopher_Perkins
Sergeant Major
Reged: 01/20/08
Posts: 361
Loc: Stafford Virginia, United Stat...
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Re: I.C.E. Mechs
[Re: Cray]
#150581 - 05/17/08 12:17 AM (24.125.201.167)
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Quote:
Oh, there is another advantage to WorkMech structures: civilian firms can buy it. Governments won't be inclined to let John Deere-3067 build its latest DiggerMech on a BattleMech structure.
Exception to that would be Diving Mechs and Minining Mechs that would need the closed construction of BattleMechs...
Environemntal Sealing or Water Proofing of these would probably be costly enough to just make it cheaper to do it Battlemech Chassis with construction mech options
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Christopher Robin Perkins
It is my opinion that all statements should be questioned, digested, disected, tasted, and then either spit out or adopted... RHIP is not a god given shield
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Flouralok
Newbie
Reged: 03/27/11
Posts: 1
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Hello, I'm renewed to the forum turned up here to essay support and your moral hearts.
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His_Most_Royal_Highass_Donkey
Captain
Reged: 06/18/08
Posts: 915
Loc: Somewhere on the US highways
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Re: I.C.E. Mechs
[Re: Cray]
#161305 - 05/05/11 12:24 PM (68.31.190.5)
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Quote:
(Hint: it's about as advisable as bringing a bulldozer into battle against an MBT.)
Bulldozer blades make great armor against smaller weapons. A great many solders where saved by hiding behind a bulldozer blade. Now that wont protect you from a modern main gun of a tank. But back in WW2 it could from some of the smaller main guns of tanks.
Also bulldozer blades are mounted onto tanks for anti mine duties. The mine might put a big hole into the blade but with the space between the blade and the tanks armor the blast would not hurt the tank.
Also with modern missiles a solder could hide behind a bulldozer blade protected from the tanks machine gun and fire the missile into the tank.
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Why argue if the glass is half full or half empty, when you know someone is going to knock it over and spill it anyways.
I was a Major *pain* before
But I got a promotion.
I am now a General *pain*
Yay for promotions!!!
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