2008 Battlemech Trade and Armaments Show

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KitK
12/10/08 10:31 AM
216.197.183.253

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2008 Battlemech Trade and Armaments Show

I have an idea for a “competition” of sorts. As people right their fluff, it is often in terms of their own personal battlemech manufacturing companies. Oh to outsell Defiance Industries or capture the latest lucrative DCMS battlemech contract! So hey, lets hold a tradeshow and tell the Inner Sphere what we’ve got offer. If successful we will follow it by creating battlemech companies (i.e. 4 lances) using mainly the entered battlemechs.

So here is what you should do to join the trade show.

1.) Search your design archives (or construct new Mechs if you want to) for the level-1 designs you would most like to see on the market. They can be your best, your worst, unusual, canon knock-offs, whatever you want to try to “sell.”
2.) Pick 4 – 1 in each weight class. Exception: You can repeat 1 weight class in exchange for another. For example, you’ve never produced a light Mech you like, but you have 2 great heavies. No problem, just only do it once. Your other 2 would then have to be 1 medium and 1 assault.
3.) Of your four Mechs, 1 may have an alternate configuration.
4.) Submit Mech summaries in a reply to the main thread and change your thread’s title to your company name so I can find it easily.
5.) Use the example summary below for a template. I am not looking for the full expanded Mech details and fluff. You can add them under your own company in a sub-thread if you want.
6.) The tradeshow will accept up to 15 sets of Mechs through Jan 1, 2009. After that I will compile a list and start the “selling.” I will also state any guidelines for Mech-company construction at that time. Selling will be open to everyone, not just the 15 entered posters.

Template Example:

Class: Medium
Name: Hunchback
Weight 50
Armor: 95%
Movement: 4/6/0
Heatsinks: 13
Weapons: AC20 (RT) Ammo 2(LT)
2 medium lasers (RA, LA)
1 small laser (H)
Battle Value: 851
Cost: 3,467,876
KitK
12/10/08 10:34 AM
216.197.183.253

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Class: Light
Name: Barracuda
Weight 35
Armor: 74%
Movement: 5/8/0
Heatsinks: 14
Weapons: 2 large lasers (RA, LA, flippable)
Battle Value: 663
Cost: 2,304,225

Alternate Configuration
Heatsinks: 10
Weapons: 2 AC2 (RA, LA, flippable) Ammo 1 (CT)
2 small lasers (RA, LA, flippable)
Battle Value: 494
Cost: 2,257,650
__________________________________________________________
Class: Light
Name: Jawbreaker (substituted for heavy Mech)
Weight 35
Armor: 74%
Movement: 4/6/0
Heatsinks: 10
Weapons: AC20 (RT) Ammo 2(CT)
Battle Value: 554
Cost: 2,357,460
___________________________________________________________
Class : Medium
Name: Gladiac
Weight 45
Armor: 78%
Movement: 4/6/0
Heatsinks: 17
Weapons: 2 PPC (RT, LT)
Battle Value: 796
Cost: 3,087,340
___________________________________________________________
Class : Assault
Name: Henchman
Weight 85
Armor: 100%
Movement: 3/5/3
Heatsinks: 18
Weapons: 2 large lasers (LA)
3 medium lasers (1RT, 2LT)
AC20 (LA,) Ammo 3 (LT)
Battle Value: 1440
Cost: 7,475,018
Prince_of_Darkness
12/15/08 08:31 AM
205.202.120.139

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I've got a good idea; I'll try posting them up tonight.
His_Most_Royal_Highass_Donkey
12/16/08 06:53 PM
24.6.54.109

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Assinine Industries is well known for their tanks. They supply light to medium tanks to militaries that cant afford battle mechs. They have both IC and fusion powered tanks at very affordable prices. By far most of the tanks that are built by Assinine Industries cost well less than one million CBs.

One of Assinine Industries slogans is "Just because you don't have the funding of a major house does not mean you cant have the fire power of one."

Another Assinine Industries slogan is "Why have one lance of mechs when you can have an army of tanks at the same cost."
Why argue if the glass is half full or half empty, when you know someone is going to knock it over and spill it anyways.

I was a Major *pain* before
But I got a promotion.
I am now a General *pain*
Yay for promotions!!!
MacLeod
12/16/08 08:00 PM
76.126.19.26

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[This is a placeholder post for until I finish fleshing out my designs]
Drugs don't kill people, pancreatic cancer kills people.

... and whoever heard of a drug that causes pancreatic cancer?
KitK
12/17/08 11:21 AM
128.233.93.228

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I look forward to seeing what MacLeod and PoD bring to the table, and hopefully 13 other's too.

Now, tanks....didn't you take some vow to never enter a tank again...anyway, vehicles in general - I had been giving it some consideration. It makes some sense to have vehicular support for a battlemech company, which by the way is the primary focus of the trade show, not their support lances. Nevertheless, I think vehicles would be something readers and posters out there would enjoy. I have 3 problems with them: 1.) I don't know how I would like to integrate them into the buying phase, 2.)I don't want to manage them, 3.) I wanted to keep things simple. So, if someone else (or HMRHD himself) whats to start a new thread or follow up under HMRHD's post to handle and incorporate vehicles - go for it! I'm all for expanding the trade show in that direction. I, however, will only deal with the battlemechs in the show.

KitK
MacLeod
12/18/08 11:52 PM
76.126.19.26

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Class: Light
Name: Enenra
Weight: 25
Armor: 90%
Movement: 7/11/7
Heatsinks: 10
Weapons:
Medium laser (RA, flippable)
Small laser (LA)
Small laser (Head)
Battle Value: 580
Cost: 2,043,646

Class: Light
Name: Raiju
Weight: 35
Armor: 87%
Movement: 6/9/4
Heatsinks: 12
Weapons:
Large laser (RA, flippable)
2 medium laser (CT)
Battle Value: 914
Cost: 2,791,575

Class: Medium
Name: Raijin
Weight: 50
Armor: 90%
Movement: 4/6/4
Heatsinks: 16
Weapons:
PPC (RA, flippable)
Large laser (LA)
Medium laser (LA)
Medium laser (H)
Battle Value: 1177
Cost: 3,652,750

Class: Heavy
Name: Tengu (Daitengu variant)
Weight: 70
Armor: 74%
Movement: 3/5/0
Heatsinks: 20
Weapons:
2 PPC (RA, flippable)
LRM 15 (LA), Ammo 2 (LT)
Large laser (RT)
Medium laser (LT)
Battle Value: 1352
Cost: 5,176,670

Class: Heavy
Name: Tengu (Kotengu variant)
Weight: 70
Armor: 96%
Movement: 4/6/4
Heatsinks: 17
Weapons:
2 large laser (RA)
SRM 6 (LA), Ammo 1 (LT)
Medium laser (RT)
Medium laser (LT)
Flamer (H)
Battle Value: 1431
Cost: 5,748,323
Drugs don't kill people, pancreatic cancer kills people.

... and whoever heard of a drug that causes pancreatic cancer?
Fang
12/19/08 08:47 AM
12.54.128.7

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WoW! How did I miss this? You can bet Ground Zero will be forth coming in this event.
One by one, the rabbits are stealing my sanity.....
Fang
12/20/08 04:33 AM
12.54.128.7

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Assault: 'Blackfoot' GZT-BLF-91
Designer: Fang
Technology Base: Level 1, Inner Sphere / 3025
Mass: 95 Ton Custom
Configuration: Biped BattleMech
Total Cost: 8,922,908 C-Bills
Battle Value: 1,418
Equipment Mass
Internal Structure: 9.5
Engine: 285 Fusion 16.5
Walking MP: 3
Running MP: 5
Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks: 20 10
Gyro: 3
Cockpit: 3
Armor Factor: 272 17
Armor Type: Standard
Internal
Structure Armor
Value
INT ARMOR
Head 3 9
Center Torso 30 45
Center Torso (rear) 14
R/L Torso 20 26
R/L Torso (rear) 11
R/L Arm 16 26
R/L Leg 20 39
Weapons and Ammo Location Critical Tonnage
Autocannon/20 LA 10 14
4 Medium Laser's LT 4 4
Autocannon/20 (Ammo 10) LT 2 2
PPC RA 3 7
LRM 15 RT 3 7
LRM 15 (Ammo 16) RT 2 2

Medium:'Asgardian' GZT-ASG-01
Designer: Fang
Technology Base: Level 1, Inner Sphere / 3050
Mass: 55 Ton Custom
Configuration: Biped BattleMech
Total Cost: 4,323,829 C-Bills
Battle Value: 875
Equipment Mass
Internal Structure: 5.5
Engine: 220 Fusion 10
Walking MP: 4
Running MP: 6
Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks: 16 6
Gyro: 3
Cockpit: 3
Armor Factor: 168 10.5
Armor Type: Standard
Internal
Structure Armor
Value
Head 3 9
Center Torso 18 23
Center Torso (rear) 10
R/L Torso 13 16
R/L Torso (rear) 7
R/L Arm 9 18
R/L Leg 13 22
Weapons and Ammo Location Critical Tonnage
Flamer LA 1 1
SRM 6 LT 2 3
SRM 6 (Ammo 15) LT 1 1
PPC RA 3 7
Large Laser RT 2 5

The Light and Heavy to follow soon.
One by one, the rabbits are stealing my sanity.....
KitK
12/22/08 08:54 AM
216.197.183.253

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Great! I'll be watching for the other two. Feel free to use the abbreviated format for your Mech's stats. And, could you give me the BV and cost, please. Thanks


To everyone else out there - to be a success the trade show needs between 7 and 12 more sets of Mechs. I know infeasible, reusable, cloaking, fuel clams lurking at jump nadirs to for unsuspecting capital ship weapon head lights is intriguing, but we got a trade show going on! And, we need your Mechs!

KitK
MacLeod
12/22/08 02:12 PM
76.126.19.26

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If there aren't enough submissions by your deadline, KitK, I'd be happy to throw together another group of 'Mechs under a different corporation/design team. Doing these was actually the most I've done in BattleTech in about two years, and I forgot how much fun I actually had building 'Mechs!
Drugs don't kill people, pancreatic cancer kills people.

... and whoever heard of a drug that causes pancreatic cancer?
His_Most_Royal_Highass_Donkey
12/24/08 07:00 AM
24.5.142.150

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Quote:

I look forward to seeing what MacLeod and PoD bring to the table, and hopefully 13 other's too.

Now, tanks....didn't you take some vow to never enter a tank again...anyway, vehicles in general - I had been giving it some consideration. It makes some sense to have vehicular support for a battlemech company, which by the way is the primary focus of the trade show, not their support lances. Nevertheless, I think vehicles would be something readers and posters out there would enjoy. I have 3 problems with them: 1.) I don't know how I would like to integrate them into the buying phase, 2.)I don't want to manage them, 3.) I wanted to keep things simple. So, if someone else (or HMRHD himself) whats to start a new thread or follow up under HMRHD's post to handle and incorporate vehicles - go for it! I'm all for expanding the trade show in that direction. I, however, will only deal with the battlemechs in the show.

KitK




If you look back at my post you will see that I did not put in any designs. I only mentioned Assinine Industries. I have on intention of posting any tank designs because no one wants to see them. All I will get for my trouble is being flamed.
Why argue if the glass is half full or half empty, when you know someone is going to knock it over and spill it anyways.

I was a Major *pain* before
But I got a promotion.
I am now a General *pain*
Yay for promotions!!!
Fang
12/24/08 07:16 AM
12.54.128.7

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Blackfoot
Total Cost: 8,922,908 C-Bills
Battle Value: 1,418

Asgardian
Total Cost: 4,323,829 C-Bills
Battle Value: 875
One by one, the rabbits are stealing my sanity.....


Edited by Fang (12/24/08 07:17 AM)
Fang
12/24/08 09:03 AM
12.54.128.7

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Light
'Basilisk' GZT-BSL-3E
35 tons
Equipment Mass
Cockpit: Standard 3T
Engine: Fusion 175 7T
Gyro: Standard 2T
Walk: 5 MP
Run: 8 MP
Jump: 5 MP
Standard Heat Sinks: 10 0T
7 in Engine

Internal Structure Armor
Standard Standard
Tons 3.5 7
Head 3 9
Center Torso 11 16/5
L/R Torso 8 11/4
L/R Arm 6 11
L/R Leg 8 15



Standard Battle Value: 673

C-Bill Cost: 2,480,401

Qty Weapons and Equipment Location Critical Tonnage
6 Machine Gun LA 6 3
6 Machine Gun RA 6 3
1 Medium Laser LT 1 1
1 Medium Laser RT 1 1
1 Ammo (Machine Gun) 200 CT 1 1
1 Jump Jets CT 1 0.5
2 Jump Jets RT 2 1
2 Jump Jets LT 2 1
1 Heat Sink LT 1 1
Basilisk 5E variant
Replaces RA mg's with a single Large Laser. No medium lasers and one additional heatsink also mounted in the RA. arms i both variants are flippable

Heavy
Helm Hammer
75 tons
Movement: 4/6/4
heatsinks: 18 standard
12.5 tons armor standard
Head 3/9
Ct 23/29 r10
Rt 16/20 r7
Lt 16/20r7
Ra 12/21
La 12/21
Rl 16/28
Ll 16/28
Weapons and ammo
PPC RA
LRM10 LT
Ammo(LRM)12 LT
Medium laserx3 RT
Flamer LA
Medium Laser LA
jumpjetsx2 RL
jumpjetsx2 LL
HeatsinksX2 CT
Heatsinksx2 RT
heatsinksx2 LT
Cost:6,904,625
BV:1249

sry, the Helm Hammer is a bit rougher than the others. Was built on the fly as a jump capable version of a differetn 75 lvl1 tonner from GZT called the Fell Hammer.
One by one, the rabbits are stealing my sanity.....


Edited by Fang (12/24/08 11:16 AM)
KitK
12/24/08 04:07 PM
216.197.183.253

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Thanks Fang, I've assigned your mechs a display booth area. (otherwise known as a spreadsheet)

Come on Sarna.net/forums, lets fill up the trade show!

KitK
Fang
12/29/08 09:32 AM
12.54.128.7

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C'mon! there have to be other designers out there interested in this. Please?
One by one, the rabbits are stealing my sanity.....
Lafeel
12/30/08 09:34 AM
157.157.75.183

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Don't have enough level 1 mech's sorry.:(
KitK
01/02/09 12:58 PM
216.197.183.253

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I must admit I am more than a little disappointed with the response to the tradeshow. I know the forums are "slow" here on Sarna, but those who do frequent it usually seem to more know about Battletech and mech construction than I do. So, I figured maybe I could get 10 sets of quality mechs.

I am extending the deadline a week, recognizing that it was the holidays and year-end, so people may have been busier than usual due to vacation, family, other, etc.

Also, to clarify where this is going, I will add a bit of my vision. The idea is to "sell" mechs. Once in the sell phase anyone who posts to the board and wants to participate can select 12 mechs, forming a company, one effectively "buying" them. A person can create as many unique companies as they want and comment on other's choices The point of view is a bureaucrat buying for a military, mercenary, etc. I am going to set up four purchansing catagories. 1 - Open company. 2 - Statistical company restricted to a BV and or C-Bill range based on sample mean. 3 - Historical replacement company where a classic battlemech company's mechs is replaced by the tradeshow mechs. So far, I have it set up for the 3025 Black Widow Company. And, of course, a different one could be presented by poster.

KitK
Fang
01/02/09 05:08 PM
75.181.134.216

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Don't have enough? all it takse is one for each of the four mentioned weight classes. C'mon, it's easy, fun, and and...well I'll think of something else in a second.
One by one, the rabbits are stealing my sanity.....
MacLeod
01/02/09 07:45 PM
98.234.140.111

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C'mon people, help out and have fun! Don't make me create a duplicate account and have conversations with myself to put in more submissions, like someone else we know...
Drugs don't kill people, pancreatic cancer kills people.

... and whoever heard of a drug that causes pancreatic cancer?
His_Most_Royal_Highass_Donkey
01/04/09 12:48 PM
24.5.142.150

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Quote:

C'mon people, help out and have fun! Don't make me create a duplicate account and have conversations with myself to put in more submissions, like someone else we know...




newtype has lots of fun talking to him self. The only person that agrees with him is himself.
Why argue if the glass is half full or half empty, when you know someone is going to knock it over and spill it anyways.

I was a Major *pain* before
But I got a promotion.
I am now a General *pain*
Yay for promotions!!!
Kovax
01/05/09 07:16 AM
75.146.193.46

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Seriously, I actually have a couple of designs done for this....
...but I forgot to bring them with me, again.

In the unlikely event that my somewhat outdated set of memory cells work well enough to remember about this tonight, I'll try creating the other two weight classes, and hopefully post them all here later in the week.

So far, the Light category entry is a cheap, basic Level 1 mech for those "cash strapped" buyers. The Medium is a bit more exotic. I could never understand why everyone seems to want to make a 100 ton "uberMech" with roughly the same speed as your average building? From a purely financial standpoint they don't make a lot of sense, to say nothing of the near uselessness of something bordering on immobile.

I've also had a set of cheap, superlight vehicles designed for a while to use as "mechanized infantry" transports and support. Mechanized Infantry is supposed to include its own transport, giving it the higher movement rate, but the exact equipment isn't specified. These are intended as a substantial upgrade to that, for not a lot more cost.

BTW - If you do make a duplicate account and have conversations with yourself, at least they'd be reasonably rational, unlike some others.
His_Most_Royal_Highass_Donkey
01/06/09 02:35 PM
24.5.142.150

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Kovax about your compliant about people liking "uberMechs". When it comes to the financial cost, "Cbills", of military hardware in BT, light Mechs cant hold a candle to light to medium tanks. A Locust runs well over one million Cbills. Where you can buy a really good tank, that will walk all over that Locust, for that one million Cbills. Its only when you get into the heavy and assault weight classes where mechs out class tanks.

Now what your opinion of vehicles verses Mechs are depends what you do playing BT. If you play Tournaments or a RPG campaign. I would not be surprised at all if vehicles are band from tournament play, with Mechs the only thing that is allowed. If your in a RPG campaign where your character is worried about paying the bills and needs to keep a fighting force going. You might just see a great deal of vehicles and a lot less mechs. The later is where I am when I play Battletech. You can defeat a foe in the pocket book where you can't defeat them on the battle field.
Why argue if the glass is half full or half empty, when you know someone is going to knock it over and spill it anyways.

I was a Major *pain* before
But I got a promotion.
I am now a General *pain*
Yay for promotions!!!
Prince_of_Darkness
01/09/09 10:42 PM
205.202.120.139

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Quote:

Its only when you get into the heavy and assault weight classes where mechs out class tanks.





LOL WUT?

It seems like you haven;t played very often with lights. If you are quick/maneuverable enough, pack some inferno SRM's, and think tactically, a light can easily pummel the heaviest of tanks.

I believe what you are thinking about is something along the lines of swarming an opponent- while fun to do with vehicles with insane speeds (like the Savannah Master) but that can leave you severely lacking in versatility. What if your foe leapt into some heavy woods, or some mountains? Especially if the 'mech used was a light Ostscout with TAG- your loved heavies could not keep up.
Prince_of_Darkness
01/12/09 12:55 PM
205.202.120.139

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Here is the light, from the Chaos Forge:

CF-3500

Internal Structure: Standard 3.50
Cockpit : Standard 3.00
Engine : Standard 245 (1 HS RT) 12.00
Gyroscope : Standard 3.00
Armor : Standard (119 pts.) 7.50
Jump Jets : Standard 0.00

Walking Speed: 7
Running Speed: 11
Jumping Speed: 0

Internal Structure/Armor:

Head: 3 - 9
Center Torso: 11 - 17/5
Left/Right Torso: 8 - 12/4
Left/Right Arm: 6 - 12
Left/Right Leg: 8 - 16

Weapons:

Name-Loc-Crit-heat-tonnage

LRM 5 HD 1 2 2.00
Ammo(LRM 5- 24) RT 1 - 1.00
Medium Laser LT 1 3 1.00
Medium Laser LA 1 3 1.00
Medium Laser RA 1 3 1.00
Prince_of_Darkness
01/12/09 01:28 PM
205.202.120.139

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From the Chaos Forge, comes the two "workhorse" mediums, both effectively named:

CF-5000

Internals: Standard 5.00
Cockpit: Standard 3.00
Engine: Standard 250 12.50
Gyroscope: Standard 3.00
Armor: Standard (160 pts.) 10.00
Jump Jets: Standard 1.50

Walking Speed: 5
Running Speed: 8
Jumping Speed: 3

Internal Structure/Armor:

Head: 3 - 9
Center Torso: 16 - 24/7
Left/Right Torso: 12 - 18/5
Left/Right Arm: 8 - 15
Left/Right Leg: 12 - 22

Weapons:

Name-Loc-Crit-heat-Tonnage
PPC - RA - 3 - 10 - 7.00
SRM 4 - LA - 1 - 3 - 2.00
SRM 4 - LT - 1 - 3 - 2.00
Medium Laser - CT - 1 - 3 - 1.00
Ammo (SRM 4) - LT - 1 - 0 - 1.00
Heat Sink - LL - 1 - 0 - 1.00
Heat Sink - RL - 1 - 0 - 1.00

--------------------

CF-5001

Internals: Standard 5.00
Cockpit: Standard 3.00
Engine: Standard 200 (1 HS LT/RT) 8.50
Gyroscope: Standard 2.00
Armor: Standard (168 pts.) 10.50
Jump Jets: Standard 2.00

Walking Speed: 4
Running Speed: 6
Jumping Speed: 4

Internal Structure/Armor:

Head: 3 - 9
Center Torso: 16 - 24/7
Left/Right Torso: 12 - 18/6
Left/Right Arm: 8 - 16
Left/Right Leg: 12 - 24

Weapons:

Name-Loc-Crit-heat-Tonnage

Autocannon/10 - RA - 7 - 3 - 12.00
Ammo (AC/10 - 20) - RT - 2 - 0 - 2.00
Medium Laser x2 - LT - 2 - 6 - 2.00
Flamer - LA - 1 - 3 - 1.00
Heat Sink - LL - 1 - 0 - 1.00
Heat Sink - RL - 1 - 0 - 1-00
Fang
01/14/09 08:02 AM
12.54.128.7

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If need be, I can have Stonkin Mechs, Inc put in an entry for a booth as well.
One by one, the rabbits are stealing my sanity.....
KitK
01/14/09 10:40 AM
128.233.93.228

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Unseasonably torrential rains have caused a massive sewage back up, which flooded the Sarna.net Industrial Showcase Facility. As a result the Battlemech Trade and Armaments Show has had to find a new location.

I will be initiating this tread on the Classic Battletech Forums in a few days. I'll portage the existing submissions as well, and post a link to it here, once I've got it done.
MacLeod
01/14/09 06:27 PM
98.234.140.111

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You don't need to move mine over, I'll repost my own there just for the sake of having a little more activity on that account.
Drugs don't kill people, pancreatic cancer kills people.

... and whoever heard of a drug that causes pancreatic cancer?
KitK
01/15/09 08:49 PM
216.197.183.253

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I have moved this to CBT forums.

2009 Battlemech Trade and Armaments Show
His_Most_Royal_Highass_Donkey
01/16/09 09:57 AM
67.180.139.229

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What is CBT?
Why argue if the glass is half full or half empty, when you know someone is going to knock it over and spill it anyways.

I was a Major *pain* before
But I got a promotion.
I am now a General *pain*
Yay for promotions!!!
Lafeel
01/16/09 10:08 AM
157.157.28.195

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Quote:

What is CBT?



Catalyst Games's Battletech forum.
Fang
01/16/09 02:57 PM
75.181.132.17

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CBT is also short for Classic BattleTech.
One by one, the rabbits are stealing my sanity.....
KamikazeJohnson
04/01/09 06:18 PM
142.161.145.16

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Aww, man, did I come back from the dead only to miss a Design Challenge by a few weeks? *sigh* Well, I guess at least all involved were spared the strain on their sanity that would have been induced by the participation of Johnson 'Mechworks, Inc.
Peace is that glorious moment in history when everyone stands around reloading.
--Thomas Jefferson
Prince_of_Darkness
04/01/09 09:14 PM
205.202.120.216

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Quote:

Aww, man, did I come back from the dead only to miss a Design Challenge by a few weeks? *sigh* Well, I guess at least all involved were spared the strain on their sanity that would have been induced by the participation of Johnson 'Mechworks, Inc.




You'd be surprised at what I can think up...
KamikazeJohnson
04/02/09 04:55 PM
142.161.145.16

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At risk of your sanity,
http://www.sarna.net/forums/showthreaded.php/Cat/0/Number/22284/page/125/vc/1
or this...
http://www.sarna.net/forums/showthreaded.php/Cat/0/Number/24619/page/119/vc/1

Don't say I didn't warn you...
Peace is that glorious moment in history when everyone stands around reloading.
--Thomas Jefferson


Edited by KamikazeJohnson (04/02/09 05:09 PM)
Prince_of_Darkness
04/02/09 08:15 PM
205.202.120.216

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Quote:

At risk of your sanity,
http://www.sarna.net/forums/showthreaded.php/Cat/0/Number/22284/page/125/vc/1
or this...
http://www.sarna.net/forums/showthreaded.php/Cat/0/Number/24619/page/119/vc/1

Don't say I didn't warn you...




WIN
Lafeel
04/03/09 07:05 AM
157.157.126.53

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You really are something mate. Oh and don't worry about my sanity either, I lost that a long time ago. :P
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