Talk:Götterdämmerung (system)

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Wrong location

Sorry to point it out, but the wiki has seriously misplaced this system. It is placed at coordinates -180 / +260 (approximately) whereas it should really be far further "north", almost exactly halfway between Erewhon and Botany Bay. The correct coordinates are -180.47 / +468.20 according ty my Atlas der Inneren Sphäre. All auto-generated crosslinks to nearby systems are wrong. :( Frabby 18:08, 14 May 2008 (CDT)

You are correct. Interestingly, the "Owner History" section is right. --Scaletail 18:22, 14 May 2008 (CDT)

Also, your estimate of the Gotterdammerung's incorrect coordinates are spot on. It is listed at -180.47 / 260.80. Amazing or scary? I'm not sure which. I updated the coordinates on the file I'm editing for Nic. --Scaletail 18:26, 14 May 2008 (CDT)

Source of Planet

Is there book where this planet is mentioned? It should be added to article, since owner history is bit odd. -- Wrangler 00:57, 21 March 2010 (UTC)

Hy I correct the Y coordinate by Chris Wheelers Is Atlas.Doneve 01:02, 21 March 2010 (UTC)

I'm sure he means an official source, Doneve. The IS Atlas is not allowed as an official, canon source. What book was this planet first in?--Revanche ^{(talk|contribs)} 01:57, 21 March 2010 (UTC)

I search, and give you the result tomorrow.Doneve 02:02, 21 March 2010 (UTC)

Reunification War Garrison

I checked the presence of the 5th Amaris Legionnaires on Gotterdammerung during the Reunification War in the Ask the Writers forum on the CGL website due to inconsistencies between the deployment tables and text. This was the exchange, clarifying the situation: BrokenMnemonic (talk) 12:06, 19 June 2013 (PDT)

“	The Rim Worlds Republic Front deployment tables on pages 154-155 of Historical: Reunification War have the 5th Amaris Legionnaires down as being deployed on Gotterdammerung from 2581 through to 2592, at which point they are listed as having been destroyed. This is contradicted elsewhere in Historical: Reunification War, though; on page 136 in the section headed "Barcelona (April-September 2591)" the Fifth Amaris Legionnaires are described as being on Barcelona and led by Colonel Franchetta Wong, detailing Wong's attempt to use her family connections to portray herself as a representative of the ruling family and the subsequent campaign against the Lyran Auxiliary Corps and 2nd Marik Auxiliary Corps when Archon Viola Steiner-Dinesen rejected her offer. Which of the two is correct?	”
	— BrokenMnemonic, 18 June 2013

“	I don't have my files to hand but I believe Barcelona is correct. Chris	”
	— Chris Hartford, 19 June 2013

Name spelling

Most canonical sources seem to spell this system without the umlaut trema, i.e. "Gotterdammerung". Even the article text spells it thus. While false under present-day German (neither "Gotter" nor "Dammerung" is a German word), this wouldn't be the first or only case where a misspelling was canonized. So what is the correct canon spelling? Do we have any canon source actually spelling it out as Götterdämmerung? Frabby (talk) 03:01, 29 September 2020 (EDT)

I admit that I do not know even though it was me who changed it. I have found that the wiki tends to simply ignore Diacritic marks so when I saw that we had "Götterdämmerung", "Götterdammerung" and "Gotterdammerung" I assumed that the umlaut trema was correct.--Dmon (talk) 05:10, 29 September 2020 (EDT)

When you say the wiki tends to ignore it, do you mean the wiki software or the users? Frabby (talk) 05:43, 29 September 2020 (EDT)

Users.--Dmon (talk) 08:36, 29 September 2020 (EDT)

I always presumed the planet was named after the Wagner opera... BrokenMnemonic (talk) 16:35, 30 September 2020 (EDT)

I've checked some books in the bibliography section (those that I have as searchable PDFs). And... it's a mess. HB:MPS alone has three spellings: "Gotterdammerung" on maps, "Götterdammerung" in most instances in the text and "Götterdämmerung" in at least one instance (on p. 50). Liberation of Terra I spells it correctly throughout the text save for the timeline (no trema), LoT II only mentions the world one, also spelled correctly. H:Liberation of Terra spells it correctly in the text but wrong on the map and in the deployment tables. ER:3052, JS:Blake Documents, Interstellar Expeditions, 20 Year Update, 1st and 2nd Ed. Periphery sourcebook and all maps in other products that don't otherwise mention the system (e.g. Shattered Sphere, OTP:Red Corsair, ER:3062, or Second Succession War), only ever spell it without any trema ("Gotterdammerung").

What's particularly bothersome are Handbook: House Steiner and War of 3039, where the system (only ever mentioned on a map, p. 25 for the former and p. 133 for the latter) is spelled Gotterdammerung but the military operation carried out by the LC is consistently spelled Götterdämmerung within the books. And even here Wo3039 dropped the ball in the index where the operation is spelled without trema (and the system is not mentioned). Similarly, FM:3145 misspells the system on maps (and doesn't otherwise mention it) but correctly spells the GTD Götterdämmerung series BattleMech.

Based on how it's consistently (mis-)spelled without trema on maps, a case could be made for that to be the official, canonical name of the system that we should use for Sarna. Then again, it probably boils down to a single database from which all maps derive. Ultimately, my takeaway is that anything goes because there is a precedent in canon for almost every thinkable spelling. In which case I advocate going for the correct spelling. I'll add a note to the article shortly. Frabby (talk) 05:05, 1 October 2020 (EDT)

I would suggest having the correct german spelling and then redirect articles for all the possible incorrect spellings seen for this planet.--Pserratv (talk) 05:49, 1 October 2020 (EDT)

Done. :) Frabby (talk) 07:14, 2 October 2020 (EDT)