User talk:Mbear/archived



Hy Mbear, I would to say you makes a great job on the Wikipage. Have you any ideas about the yearlist's there is a mess so many addings without references ...I added in last time some stuff and references on it and I hope to bring structure on it. I know my english is not very good but I learn. Greetings Doneve 16:44, 20 November 2009 (UTC)

Tormano Liao[edit]

Hello Mbear. I'm not sure if you understand what you've done. You took a article and turned into a REDIRECT that loops back into itself. I suggest have page completed deleted, so either yourself or someone can make new article. -- Wrangler 20:23, 20 November 2009 (UTC)

Whoops! I was trying to get it to redirect to something else. I'll delete it.
Don't delete. I put that redirect there for a purpose: Tormana Liao is frequently spelled Tormano in canonical sources (like Shrapnel). The main article does not exist yet, so the redirect links to a redlink. But that does not invalidate the redirect. Frabby 20:47, 20 November 2009 (UTC)
Um, checking the articles again, it seems that Tormano should be the article, and Tormana is the frequent misspelling that should be redirected. Either way, one needs to be expanded into a full article and the other needs to be a redirect. Sorry for the confusion. Frabby 20:50, 20 November 2009 (UTC)
Actually I hit the page and started to edit without realizing I didn't have all my references to hand. So I'm going to hold off until later.Mbear 21:30, 20 November 2009 (UTC)
OK. The Tormana Liao article has some stuff in it now. Of course it needs more to cover the 3040-3070 time frame, but I don't have that handy so I'll leave it for someone else. Hopefully it'll get the ball rolling.Mbear 16:45, 25 November 2009 (UTC)
Hello Mbear. I left a comment about a problem in Tormana's bio. Since its your article, i've decline to mess with it. But the problem lies in the After his deather part, because you name Kia Liao as his heir to Free Capellan. Which isn't correct. It goes into detail on discuss part of the article. -- Wrangler 16:31, 1 December 2009 (UTC)
Wrangler, I have no ego when it comes to these pages. Feel free to make any changes you like to them. (Especially since I can't find any more information about Tormana.)--Mbear 18:26, 1 December 2009 (UTC)

MWDA dossiers[edit]

Hi Mbear, I heard you maybe able divide up the MWDA dossiers from other website. That would be great if you could do it. There number of articles citing individual dossiers when they were still on wizkid's website. Do you think you seperate the dossiers and up load them? As long I know where to find them. I can re attach the dossiers to the article that were citing them. -- Wrangler 00:18, 26 November 2009 (UTC)

Wrangler, it looks like the MWDA dossiers are in PDF files that Photoshop can get to. So I might be able to separate them out into individual pages. It may not look great, but it's a place to start. As soon as I finish up the Kurita ranks I'm doing I'll start on the dossiers.Mbear 12:20, 26 November 2009 (UTC)
Cool, let me know when there ready and i'll start get cracking at doing re-attaching. -- Wrangler 12:22, 27 November 2009 (UTC)
Downloading the PDF's now. I'm going start by breaking the multipage PDF's into single page PDF's, and then I'll separate them out by content. (So instead of having Janella Lakewood and Tundra Wolf in same page, we have Janella Lakewood on one page and Tundra Wolf on another.) I'll also put a table showing progress on my userpage. Mbear 16:54, 27 November 2009 (UTC)
Hi Mbear, thanks for give me those links. I'm started the process of re-connecting/relinking the articles. Thanks alot! -- Wrangler 16:31, 1 December 2009 (UTC)
You're welcome! --Mbear 20:40, 1 December 2009 (UTC)

All Caps Titles[edit]

I saw you created a number of redirects from subject titles written all in capital letters (like COMSTAR, HOUSE LIAO, etc.). May I ask why? Frabby 20:12, 1 December 2009 (UTC)

For the Table of contents in the Intelligence Operations Handbook. When I tried using HOUSE DAVION as a link, nothing came up. Rather than recreate the pages I thought it would be better to just redirect to the existing file. --Mbear 20:15, 1 December 2009 (UTC)
Ah, I see. You don't have to create redirects though; just use piped links. The format is thus: [[Link|Whatever you want to call it or refer to]]
Using this system, when you write [[BattleTech|Look here!]], this is what appears in the text: Look here!
Frabby 23:04, 1 December 2009 (UTC)
Jeez. I've been doing that for a while. I must've had a huge brainfart to not think of it. I'll modify the page. Thanks!--Mbear 14:20, 2 December 2009 (UTC)

WarShip Weapons[edit]

I saw on the Wanted Page that there were a lot of links pointing to various warship weapon types, so I created stub articles for them. Please add data as you find it. I did get the Naval Autocannon types linked up, but the Naval Particle Projection Cannon and Naval Laser pages could use the production table. Thanks! (It's pretty cool knowing that 17-20 red links for each weapon are now blue because I did that.) There's also a couple categories that I thought were appropriate for WarShip weapons: Capital Weapons and WarShip Weapons (the latter includes subcapital weapons, which I have no reference for).--Mbear 18:36, 14 December 2009 (UTC)

Hi Mbear. Don't you have the Tactical Operations? It lists all the information (including the Sub-Cap stats) you were looking for. -- Wrangler 19:17, 16 December 2009 (UTC)
No, I don't have Tactical Operations. Good to know that's where it is, but I need to put my money towards other things right now. Maybe someone who has TacOps will fill it in for me.--Mbear 21:02, 16 December 2009 (UTC)
I have PDF and book, but i'm not that good translating rules into text. I'll try. -- Wrangler 21:16, 16 December 2009 (UTC)
I know what you mean. The various NAC, NL, and NPPC pages (like Light NPPC)are a little sparse just because I couldn't think of how to write what I wanted. I'd be happy to help you but I don't have the pages. Undecided.gif --Mbear 21:22, 16 December 2009 (UTC)
Did you download the free Tables for Stragetic Operations? If you look here (free download from Classic Battletech site. PDF for Records sheets and Tables for Strategic Ops. You'll find on page 31 the elusive tables information you need for your articles. -- Wrangler 12:30, 17 December 2009 (UTC)
Thanks! I'll get to work on putting that information in place.--Mbear 15:04, 17 December 2009 (UTC)


Hy Mbear, really good work about the Rank's and Insignias. Allways forward. Sorry my english is not perfect. Good Luck --Doneve 18:08, 16 December 2009 (UTC)

Thanks! I was wondering if people would like them, so it's good to hear you do! --Mbear 18:24, 16 December 2009 (UTC)
Thanks for your answer.Why you are wondering, its a really good work. One question...i woud to update the timeline structure...have you any ideas...i write in the last time to other user's, but i become no feedback or answers about it. --Doneve 19:02, 16 December 2009 (UTC)
I can't think of anything at the moment. Let me take some time and ponder the issue and if I think of anything I'll let you know. --Mbear 19:03, 16 December 2009 (UTC)
Sorry Mbear I mean the yearlist structure and then the timeline, my fingers type to fast ;) --Doneve 19:17, 16 December 2009 (UTC)
I'd like to jump on this bandwagon, too. I really do appreciate the details and consistency your articles are showing. Good job! --Revanche (talk|contribs) 17:40, 29 December 2009 (UTC)
Thanks! It's good to know someone appreciates me!--Mbear 14:44, 30 December 2009 (UTC)


Mbear, I took the liberty of installing an awards board on your main page. Please place it where it best fits your design. Happy New Year! --Revanche (talk|contribs) 05:21, 1 January 2010 (UTC)

Thanks! It's in place now. I thought the "I love me" section was most appropriate. Happy New Year to you as well!--Mbear 17:22, 4 January 2010 (UTC)

Sub-Capital Weaponry naming[edit]

Hi Mbear. Great job working on the Sub-Capital weapons. Questions, why you leaving out the "-" between the names? Sub-Capital how its actually spelled. -- Wrangler 16:30, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

I just forgot it. I'll add it now. Thanks for catching this. --Mbear 16:31, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

All Purpose Award[edit]

Hey, Mbear, in lieu of the not-yet-existant Admin Community Service Award, I'd like to grant you your first Editor's All Purpose Award, for improving the design and functionality of all weapons articles thru the modification of the InfoBoxWeapon template:

All Purpose Award, 1st ribbon

Appreciate the effort to improve upon the site. --Revanche (talk|contribs) 19:35, 26 January 2010 (UTC)

Founder's Honorable Mention Award[edit]

Wow, you've made a ton of great contributions to the site over the last year. It's great to have you be a part of our community~ Nicjansma 06:49, 8 February 2010 (UTC)

Thanks! Great to be here.--Mbear 13:26, 8 February 2010 (UTC)

Random Act of Appreciation Award[edit]

Mbear, for jumping on the Phoenix Hawk LAM page and cleaning it up, I award you the Random Act of Appreciation Award, 1st ribbon. That was nice work! ClanWolverine101

Thanks. I don't know that I did a whole lot, but I appreciate the award.--Mbear 14:11, 24 February 2010 (UTC)
Well, at the very least, you beat me to the edits. ;)ClanWolverine101

Infantry Weapon Box Help Request[edit]

MBear, i an trying to address both infantry Weapons and use the fluff from various TROs to do RPG data pages for Brand Named Weapons (IOW the GM Whirlwind AC/5 that fires 3 shot bursts would be different from a standard/generic 10 Shot burst AC/5). I seam to have O'er reached my self as usual. could you take a look at Help:CreateInfantryWeaponArticle and Template:InfoBoxInfantryWeapon, and let me know if there are easier ways to do things? --Cameron 18:59, 26 February 2010 (UTC)

Well, one thing that I notice right away is that there's a lot of duplication in the categories you've created. I understand why it's there, but that looks overwhelming. Is there any way to combine some of them? For example could you eliminate the "Both" lines and put the Clan/IS stuff on the same line, possibly separated by pipe symbols or slashes or something? That would make the template a lot shorter and less intimidating.
Is that the kind of feedback you're looking for? --Mbear 14:00, 1 March 2010 (UTC)

All Purpose Award[edit]

In lieu of the not-yet existent Community Service Admin's Award, I'd like to present you the All Purpose ribbon with 1 bronze oak leaf (to represent your 2nd receipt of the award):

All Purpose Award, 2nd ribbon

...for the service of developing & creating the ProtoMech infobox template and supporting it on the Help & How-to page. Thanks for serving the BTW community. --Revanche (talk|contribs) 19:51, 2 March 2010 (UTC)

Thanks! It was my pleasure. --Mbear 19:52, 2 March 2010 (UTC)

Image Import award[edit]

Mbear, I really wish I could space these two awards out, but I've waited weeks for the Image Import award to go 'live' so that I could grant it to you. In fact, it was because of your extensive work developing the rank graphics that I kicked my awards program into shape. So, in recognition of your work developing and uploading the various and numerous ranks graphics and improving articles, such as Lieutenant, I present you BTW's first Image Import award:


Seriously, good work. And keep it up. (Just don't expect any more awards from me for a few weeks!) --Revanche (talk|contribs) 22:06, 2 March 2010 (UTC)

Thanks! Just trying to help.--Mbear 00:09, 3 March 2010 (UTC)

Image Question[edit]

Hy Mbear, superb work about the rank insigias. Can you tell me what you use to create your Images? I think Photoshop, but i'm new in this spart, i want to start with the Inner Sphere Units insigias (emblems) I know my english ;). Can you give me a little instruction, how to build I.GreetingsDoneve 18:30, 3 March 2010 (UTC)

I use PhotoShop to build my images, but if you don't want to spend ~$700 (~DM1000) you can try The GIMP, GimpShop or Paint.NET, all of which are free.
As for building the images, I usually try to see the simplest shapes in the rank insignia and create the image from there. The best advice I can give you is to experiment with whatever program you decide to use. It's like playing BattleTech, every time you do it you get better. --Mbear 18:38, 3 March 2010 (UTC)
Thanks a lot, i give you in the next time a example of my creation.Doneve 18:44, 3 March 2010 (UTC)
I'm looking forward to seeing it! I also forgot to mention that there are a lot of good tutorials online. PSDTuts is one of my favorites. You can find a lot by searching for "Photoshop tutorial". I also use books from my local library. --Mbear 18:48, 3 March 2010 (UTC)

SLDF Royal Links[edit]

Hey Mbear - I noticed you've been adding the SLDF Royal links to all the relevant mech pages. I was wondering what TRO or other sourcebook those were from? I ask because I'd like to make the article all of those are linking to. ClanWolverine101

I found a lot of them in Technical Readout: 3075. I can't recall the exact page number, but I think it was the third or fourth page into the "Age of War" section.--Mbear 11:58, 15 March 2010 (UTC)
Also The Star League sourcebook, pages 41, 61, 85, 105, and 110 talks about recruiting and policies for the SLDF Royal divisions.--Mbear 12:05, 15 March 2010 (UTC)

Year page discussion[edit]

Mbear, would you take another look at the consensus wrapup and renumber your point issue? I think you were targeting in on the changes between the initial 3053 and my testbed, and really mean #3 from the wrap-up. I've changed the changes to a bulleted list, so that there is less confusion. (I didn't want to change your statement, but I'm certain you meant #3.)--Revanche (talk|contribs) 16:26, 19 March 2010 (UTC)

You're right. I realized that after I hit "submit". It should be good now though.
I do have a couple other questions about the year pages though.--Mbear 16:29, 19 March 2010 (UTC)
Feel free to bring them up there. I do want to respond to your initial statement. --Revanche (talk|contribs) 16:31, 19 March 2010 (UTC)

For your Hard Work on the Rank Project[edit]

I am taken back hard your working on the ranking project of yours. I wouldn't have been able to produce creative & original amount of work you have done for So I am taking the liberty to giving you the All Purpose Award, 3rd Ribbon. All Purpose Award, 3rd ribbon. Awesome job Mbear! -- Wrangler 17:26, 22 March 2010 (UTC)

Thanks! It's nice to have it finally complete. I hope someone finds it useful. (Maybe even the powers that be over at CGL. It'd be cool to see my work in a sourcebook.)--Mbear 17:47, 22 March 2010 (UTC)
Properly won't happen. Anything that already out in public is for all purposes not allowed in canon sadly. -- Wrangler 18:11, 22 March 2010 (UTC)
Hey! Congrats on the completion. If you were describing your project to someone, how would summarize it? (The more material you provide me, the better.) --Revanche (talk|contribs) 21:58, 22 March 2010 (UTC)
I'd describe it to someone as "Identifying the military ranks used by faction's military forces, how they relate to each other (equivalence of ranks across factions), and creating images of the rank insignias used by each faction." Does that sound good?--Mbear 22:03, 22 March 2010 (UTC)

Gallery Template[edit]

Hy Mbear i give you this award for helping out, about the Gallery Template.Helping Hand Award, 1st ribbon.GreetingsDoneve 19:04, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

Thanks! be sure to look at the Policy_Talk:Images discussion. --Mbear 20:05, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

Solaris Stables[edit]

Hi Mbear, thanks again for your help. Can you move or link the template to category: I'm not sure how were support to set up, but thats where should be linking too! Thanks! -- Wrangler 16:12, 29 March 2010 (UTC)

Do you mean you want it to link to: Help:CreateSolarisStableArticle? The template already has Category:Solaris Stables in it.--Mbear 16:14, 29 March 2010 (UTC)

Solaris stables template[edit]

Forgive me if I'm jumping the gun, especially if it's still being undertaken, but I'm responding to your request for feedback. I'd ask that the code that you included on Help:CreateSolarisStableArticle be added to the doc for the template. That's so people who find their way thru an autopsy of a pre-existing article and don't find the QuickStart help page can easily create their own article, as well. (I believe each of the templates for the other article types also do the same thing.) --Revanche (talk|contribs) 16:59, 29 March 2010 (UTC)

OK. I've done that. Let me know if you need me to do anything else.--Mbear 17:01, 29 March 2010 (UTC)
Thanks, Mbear. Quality work. Seriously.--Revanche (talk|contribs) 17:26, 29 March 2010 (UTC)

Problem Solver Award[edit]

Mbear, to acknowledge your volunteer involvement in developing a new series of articles (i.e. Solaris stables) by creating the template and associated Help pages, I'd like to grant you this Admin award, the Problem Solver ribbon:

Problem Solver Award, 1st ribbon

Good work and keep thinking of ways to improve the site. --Revanche (talk|contribs) 17:30, 29 March 2010 (UTC)

Wow! Thanks.--Mbear 17:45, 29 March 2010 (UTC)

Arcadia DropShip[edit]

I Mbear please can you take a look, on my uploaded Arcadia image, i can't find the error, i think i have tomatos on my eyes, thanks.Doneve 20:09, 29 March 2010 (UTC)

They must've been big tomatoes! The problem was you forgot to include the file extension (jpg). So the wiki couldn't find the image. Adding the JPG extension solved the problem.--Mbear 23:34, 29 March 2010 (UTC)
Oh yeah there big, thanks for fixing ;).Doneve 23:36, 29 March 2010 (UTC)

Sub-Capital Missile Category[edit]

Hi, Mbear. I know this maybe something of nickpicking. But your category should be Sub-Capital Missiles verses the singlar name. All the other categories have "s" in them. -- Wrangler 17:50, 30 March 2010 (UTC)

Thanks. Fixed it.--Mbear 18:11, 30 March 2010 (UTC)

Editor Userbar[edit]

Hey, I made this pitch to Ebakunin a few days ago, but thought (after seeing your newest images) maybe you'd like to take a crack at making something similar to these for all Editors. Interested? --Revanche (talk|contribs) 14:43, 30 March 2010 (UTC)

Maybe. What are you looking for? Just something in the same dimensions that says BTW Editors?--Mbear 16:08, 30 March 2010 (UTC)
Exactly. With some flair on it, like the other examples. --Revanche (talk|contribs) 16:39, 30 March 2010 (UTC)
What the hell. I'll take a stab at it. Are there any files I should use (templates, BTW logo, etc.) already made up or do I get to start from scratch?--Mbear 16:46, 30 March 2010 (UTC)
You get to start from scratch! Yay, you! Cheesy.gif--Revanche (talk|contribs) 17:33, 30 March 2010 (UTC)
Oh year, please make beautiful userbars for the community, please can you make a user bar for Manufacturing Centers, it's my litte baby, thanks for your great work.--Doneve 18:31, 1 April 2010 (UTC)

Image policy[edit]

Mbear, are you at all interested in writing the policy for images?--Revanche (talk|contribs) 18:59, 30 March 2010 (UTC)

I actually tried to bring the information together on the policy talk page under the Possible Image Policy Page heading. If you copy everything between that heading and the Consensus Review heading, you'll have everything I wanted to say.--Mbear 19:07, 30 March 2010 (UTC)
Okay. When you have time, please move the relevant data over to the policy page and put a {{construction}} temmplate on top. I'll get 'in-character/mindset' and start prepping it for policy release.--Revanche (talk|contribs) 19:11, 30 March 2010 (UTC)
Done!--Mbear 19:13, 30 March 2010 (UTC)

Image Import award[edit]

Mbear, for uploading what will probably be the most linked images on BTW for a while (i.e. the six Editor Userbars), I award you your second Image Import:


Thanks for running with my idea and bringing it into the light so quickly, with so much vividness and so many options. --Revanche (talk|contribs) 19:31, 2 April 2010 (UTC)

Hey, thanks! I still have some more ideas for new bars. Once they're completed can I just put them on the Userbar gallery page or do I need to ask you to do it?--Mbear 14:19, 5 April 2010 (UTC)


First for your support. Second that you hear my opinion and to respect my work (you adopeted my layout chances from Davion Guards :) ) Thir your cooperation in the past and (I hope) in the future.

Have you ideas for me what can I do next. My to do list shortened extremly because my slowy work... Every day a sentence, in one week a word and in one month a letter. Neuling 12:51, 6 April 2010 (UTC)

What do do next?
  • There are a lot of empty entries in the AFFS unit infoboxes (Nickname, Year formed, etc.) that could be filled.
  • The units also need information in the History section.
  • The 33rd and 34th Avalon Hussars pages need insignia.
Does this give you some ideas? If you don't want to do these tasks, you can always look at the wiki's "To Do" list for something.--Mbear 13:07, 6 April 2010 (UTC)

AFFS Commands[edit]

Love your work on breaking these up on the main article - I am hoping this becomes the new template on all the Successor State military commands. Have a Random Act of Appreciation Award, 2nd ribbon. Good work and good effort.
- ClanWolverine101 14:32, 6 April 2010 (UTC)

Thanks!--Mbear 14:33, 6 April 2010 (UTC)

Inner Sphere military structure[edit]

Hi Mbear, i noticed great job your doing with military structures for the Inner Sphere. There is a missing formation your article is does not include. Army size formation, ComGuard (Level V) and old Star League use that size forces in their make up. Your article does mention it. -- Wrangler 12:01, 13 April 2010 (UTC)

Added Corps and Army to the page. Thanks!--Mbear 12:34, 13 April 2010 (UTC)


Hy Mber congratulation for your new Admin status, i hope your work hold this level, but it is better when you push it up to a higher higher higher Wink.gif.Greetings--Doneve 13:02, 13 April 2010 (UTC)

Thanks!--Mbear 13:05, 13 April 2010 (UTC)
Congrats ;-) --Dmon 13:08, 13 April 2010 (UTC)
Congratulations for your promotion and "burden" on your shoulder. I have an idea. Is it useful when I added informationen in the parent articles about the destruction of a unit with time (year) and planet. And I thought about it to expanded the seperation of the articles to all militias (clan => single galaxies, comstar => armies, periphery states => corps + brigades) Neuling 13:17, 13 April 2010 (UTC)
Wait, what? He's an Admin? I didn't see this news release! Someone's slacking.--Revanche (talk|contribs) 14:45, 13 April 2010 (UTC)
Cut me a little slack. It's my first day.--Mbear 14:50, 13 April 2010 (UTC)
...and you defend showing up late? And have no coffee skills?--Revanche (talk|contribs) 15:18, 13 April 2010 (UTC)
Wait a second. I have to write my own announcement that I've been made an admin? Sheesh. Next you'll want me to pay for my own celebratory beer too! ;)--Mbear 19:10, 13 April 2010 (UTC)
" pay for my own celebratory beer too!" It's worse than you think: you have to pay for our's too. In the Navy, we call it a wetting down. The key is: the amount of a month's pay increase is what you spend on the party. Do the math. --Revanche (talk|contribs) 21:16, 13 April 2010 (UTC)
Sorry to pop in late, way to go! -- Wrangler 22:52, 13 April 2010 (UTC)

Neuling's Idea[edit]

Is it useful when I added informationen in the parent articles about the destruction of a unit with time (year) and planet. And I thought about it to expanded the seperation of the articles to all militias (clan => single galaxies, comstar => armies, periphery states => corps + brigades) Neuling 13:17, 13 April 2010 (UTC)

Neuling, please add any information you find useful. If you want to know when (year) and where (planet) a unit was destroyed, someone else probably does as well. The only possible problem is when you have units that were destroyed, rebuilt, and destroyed again (like the Lyran Regulars). In that case, you may want to put the detailed information about unit destruction in the unit's individual article.
As to the second part of your question (Expanding clan listings to single galaxies, comstar to armies, etc.), if you want to do so, go right ahead. Again, I'm sure someone will find the information useful. However, you may want to consider adding more detailed info to each unit rather than just creating the page. The list of units is useful, and the brief overview is as well, but having some more depth in the article is best. (For an example of what I'm trying to say, compare the 2nd Donegal Guards and 3rd Donegal Guards articles. Both have the basic info, but the 2nd DG page has a lot more information.)
But just doing the expansions you mentioned would be good.--Mbear 13:43, 13 April 2010 (UTC)
I put this forward about a year ago and got a no based on the fact that units can be re-raised multiple times. --Dmon 15:02, 13 April 2010 (UTC)
Dmon, can you provide a link to that discussion? I'm unsure of how Mbear's answer is invalidated by a unit's multiple destruction & re-creation, unless they were all being tracked on the parent unit's page. What others said would be useful to me.--Revanche (talk|contribs) 15:23, 13 April 2010 (UTC)
Sorry I should of been more clear in that I was answering the first part of the idea about unit destruction dates. I have no idea where the discussion might be sadly. Re-reading the question.. to be honest I should just go back to sleep.. I thought he was asking something else anyway :-( --Dmon 15:40, 13 April 2010 (UTC)
Well, that's good news in my book!--Revanche (talk|contribs) 16:02, 13 April 2010 (UTC)
Lmao, I assume you mean it is good that I am saying the idea has already been discussed rather than me making an ass of myself yet again ;-) --Dmon 16:07, 13 April 2010 (UTC)
One means less 'work' and one amuses me. Win-win (for me)!--Revanche (talk|contribs) 16:30, 13 April 2010 (UTC)

Creative Commons Share Alike license[edit]

Hi Mbear,

I noticed that you added the Creative Commons Share Alike v3.0 license to many of the images you've uploaded. I'm not sure whether that's the appropriate license. If you have simply redrawn an image without significantly modifying it, the image does not qualify as a "derivative work" and you must instead claim and justify fair use. Am I misunderstanding what you're doing? Thanks for the clarification. --Ebakunin (talk|contribs) 14:58, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

You're not misunderstanding me. I put the CCSA on there so others could use my work. But in light of what you just said, I'll pull the CCSA off teh images.--Mbear 15:02, 19 April 2010 (UTC)
I'm really sorry to rain on your parade like that. You must've put an awful lot of effort into the work. However, whenever possible we encourage using the original image as it is a better way to claim fair use. A user-modified version of a copyrighted image makes it much more complicated to establish ownership. Again, I'm sorry about this whole mess. --Ebakunin (talk|contribs) 15:21, 19 April 2010 (UTC)
No problem. I have an umbrella.--Mbear 15:23, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

Shadow Division Infobox update[edit]

Hi MBear, there no information on actual Shadow Division command. Thats why i was putting in Manei Domino for the as to whom the Shadow Divisions answer too, which is Precentor Apollyon. Since he Precentor Shadow Division, thus why i put Manei Domini instead of a non-existing Shadow Division High Command. I thought be odd putting Precetor Apollyon in as the Parent command. -- Wrangler 18:33, 23 April 2010 (UTC)

I know there's no listing for the Shadow Division as a whole, but I just put the finishing touches on it. It will hold information that affects all the Shadow Divisions, like their relationship to The Master, the infighting between St. Jamais & Apollyon, their equipment, and eventual destruction. Sort of like the Davion Brigade of Guards page. Also see the Word of Blake Protectorate for some info.--Mbear 18:37, 23 April 2010 (UTC)
Only thing is see as slight problem is duplication. Manei Domini IS the Shadow Divisions, there on in the same. I created the Manei Domini Article to hold the events and goings of Manei which included the Divisions. I can understand having the Division organized, having history entire Brigade, i think should be included with Manei Domini article. A section dedicated to the Division as a whole. Hopefully, future source books when they come out, will clear up what command structure is actually called. From everything I read, it points high command is Manei Domini, since they don't listen to Word of Blake High Command, which they apparenty do have, but nothing in detail. -- Wrangler 19:25, 23 April 2010 (UTC)
I see your point, particularly about duplication, but respectfully disagree with your conclusion. The Manei Domini article you've written is a great description of the individual soldiers who serve in the Shadow Divisions and the cybernetic equipment they use. The Shadow Division article covers the combat units the Manei Domini belonged to rather than the individual soldiers themselves. I'm trying to make it a bridge between your MD article and the individual shadow division pages.--Mbear 19:52, 23 April 2010 (UTC)

Manei Domini Article Questions[edit]

Hi Mbear, I have question regarding the tables i had put in there. I worked hard get that right and felt it made article look less amaturstic and easier to read. Why did you remove them for the vehicles/mechs/battlarmor? -- Wrangler 11:30, 26 April 2010 (UTC)

I replaced the tables with lists because I thought they were easier to read. I'll be happy to change them back if they bother you.--Mbear 11:56, 26 April 2010 (UTC)

Image summary[edit]

Hi Mbear,

Would you please take another stab at the {{image summary}} sourcing. Try to make it look more like this. I'm going to rewrite the template explanation now to hopefully make it easier to use. Thanks a lot! --Ebakunin (talk|contribs) 03:21, 27 April 2010 (UTC)

Territory Clan Wars[edit]

I read the Field Manuals Warden + Crusader clans again + the fm upadtes and wonder that their a lot of changes and feuds between each clans. My project for the weekend is to put this on a special site. Can you give me ideas for an layout? I can write about every planet with defenders and attackers or every clan with attacks and defense operation. And i don't know if the possession wars were from 3060 - 3067 or shorter give my a backup please. Neuling 17:31, 23 April 2010 (UTC)

"And i don't know if the possession wars were from 3060 - 3067 or shorter give my a backup please." I'm not sure what the Possession Wars are, but if I remember correctly the time period is basically during the Truce of Tukayyid. So there wasn't a lot of Clan adventurism except for the Coventry invasion. The fighting you're talking about took place in the Clan homeworlds, right?
For the organization/layout of these you may want to look at the Operation: Ice Storm page. It looks like you've done some work on it so you're already familiar with the page structure. It provides a quick overview of each clan involved (and what galaxies were used), then moves on to describe the individual conflicts by time period.
What I might do if I was writing this article is start by organizing the info by Clan, then by time. So you might see:

Factions involved[edit]

This was a time of great upset for the homeworld clans. Since they weren't a part of the Inner Sphere invasion they had to sit at home and knit booties for their cadets.

Clan Fluffy Bunny[edit]

Alpha Galaxy - On date attacked other clan force on planetname. The Fluffy Bunny Unit defeated other clan force, but lost three trinaries/clusters in the process.

Clan Pursuing Greyhound[edit]

Beta Galaxy - On date won Trial of Possession with Other Clan for Something Totally Awesome.

Inter-Clan Conflicts during Truce of Tukayyid[edit]


Clan Fluffy Bunny sent their Alpha Galaxy to PillowFactoryPlanet to take control of their long lost PillowFactory. The Clan Swimming Monkey force guarding the factory was defeated by the Fluffy Bunnies, but the Bunnies lost two trinaries of the 7th Snow Hare Cluster in the process. The Bunnies took seven bondsmen from the Swimming Monkeys during the trial, which brought the 7th Snow Hare Cluster back up to strength.

Clan Giant Dwarf staged a Trial of Refusal against Clan Micro Dinosaur for the Dwarf's famed cake recipe. The Dwarves were not successful, and soon the Micro Dinosaur Merchant Caste flooded the Homeworld markets with these tasty pastries, driving the Dwarf economy underground.


Something happened.

Something else happened.


Something happened.

Something else happened.

The Big Something that Happened in 3065[edit]

The Harvest Trials took place during this time. These trials allowed the Crusader clans to rebuild their forces quickly by capturing bondsmen, beans, and toothpaste from other clans.

Notice how the years get more detailed information about each event while the Clan-level stuff is just an quick overview. I don't know if that will help you or not, but I hope so. --Mbear 20:39, 23 April 2010 (UTC)
I'm a little confused. In FM Crusader clans stood that the trials were held by Wolf and JAde Falcon during 3059 or was later did this kind or trial again... Neuling 19:54, 24 April 2010 (UTC)
I think the original Harvest Trials were held as you mention above. The example I provided was just that: An example. I needed something to fill the space. I'm sure there were other conflicts where one clan took another's forces in Trials of Possession.--Mbear 15:29, 26 April 2010 (UTC)
This is what I was thinking of! I knew the Jade Falcons and Vlad's Wolves used the Harvest Trials extensively after the Refusal War to rebuild. Vlad and Marthe Pryde were talking about it in Grave Covenant, and the Ice Hellion Khan was pissy because of how many people he lost. ClanWolverine101 15:36, 26 April 2010 (UTC)

My article : Battle of Mars[edit]

Hey - Could you be more specific on what i screwed up? ClanWolverine101 13:53, 4 May 2010 (UTC)

I don't think you screwed up anything. I just added links on the Dragoon's warships to point to their class names.
If you're referring to my comment about the preview button, that was for me. I forgot to put in a | character and the link looked stupid. So I embarrassed myself.--Mbear 16:29, 5 May 2010 (UTC)
AH. Okay. Yeah, the comment confused me, not so much the idea that I had missed something as not being told what it was. And yes, good call in referencing the named vessels.
Honest, I just put a lot into that article, and wanted to see what others thought of it. *struts like a peacock* ClanWolverine101 14:58, 6 May 2010 (UTC)

DropShip - WarShip etc...[edit]

Hy Mbear i see in the DropShip, WarShip infobox templates, there are not the Lifeboads and Escape Pods listed, i think it is usefull, what are you thinking...?Doneve 19:58, 4 May 2010 (UTC)

You know... I was thinking the same thing for Aerospace Fighter capacity... ClanWolverine101 01:57, 5 May 2010 (UTC)
The WarShip infobox does have a place for Lifeboats and Escape Pods: It's the fifth line up from the bottom.
The DropShip infobox lacks that information. Off the top of my head I can't recall seeing that data, but if you want it listed I'll see what I can do about adding it.
Rather than add an explicit "AeroSpace Fighter" capacity location, I'd add a "small craft" line instead. I'm thinking of ships like the Nekohono'o, which carry 6 fighters + 9 Battle Taxis. In theory they could carry 15 small craft.--Mbear 16:38, 5 May 2010 (UTC)
Hy, uups i over see it in the WarShip infobox, please can you list the data to the DropShip infobox, thanks a lot.--Doneve 08:07, 6 May 2010 (UTC)
The Small Craft/AeroSpace Fighter line has been added to both infoboxes. In the future, please do me a favor and put these requests on the Administrator page so any admin can work on it. (In case I'm out sick or something.) Thanks!--Mbear 13:35, 11 May 2010 (UTC)

Armor Question[edit]

Hi Mbear. I have Article Request, since i'm not that good witht them. Your recent Heavy Rifle article, mentions of the Industrial / BAR Rating armor. Is there possiblity to create a article(s) that would cover them? I have number of article that have dead-wiki links to BAR 5, BAR 6, etc. I'm not that good at writing up on technical side of things, was hoping you could or point to someone to request it to be made. -- Wrangler 20:08, 5 May 2010 (UTC)

I can do that. I'll get started tonight after work.--Mbear 20:12, 5 May 2010 (UTC)
Done. I've pointed your dead wikilinks to the generic Barrier Armor Rating page since the number just reflects the BAR value.--Mbear 21:53, 5 May 2010 (UTC)

Solaris VII stables[edit]

Hi Mbear, I'm interesting to get information about the stables of Solaris VII. Did you know, from were I can get the Information? and how can i write an articel about it? Neuling 21:08, 5 May 2010 (UTC) tnx Neuling 21:08, 5 May 2010 (UTC)

Sources to look for are: MechWarrior's Guide to Solaris VII, Solaris VII: The Game World, Solaris: The Reaches, and Unbound. There's also a little information in the opening fiction of MechWarrior, Third Edition, but I don't know how useful it'll be. I think there's some general info about Solaris in Warrior: En Garde and Assumption of Risk, but once again, how useful it will be is unknown.
As for writing the articles, there's a help page that will walk you through it. See the Solaris Stables category page for some examples.--Mbear 22:06, 5 May 2010 (UTC)
Just to Pipe in, the Latest information for the stables is also found in Mappack: Solaris VII and Jihad Hot Spots books, because the Blakist occupation of the Solaris. -- Wrangler 13:42, 6 May 2010 (UTC)

Piloting Skill not count?[edit]

Hey Mbear - I read this on your User page - can you please clarify your question, please? ClanWolverine101 19:58, 6 May 2010 (UTC)

The Battle Value computation for BattleMechs can be modified by the Piloting/Gunnery skill of the pilot (see this table). That's useful in games, but not useful here. So that's what I'm talking about in that statement. (I think the default BV computations include generic skill levels of 5 pilot/4 gunnery anyway, so it's probably moot.--Mbear 15:39, 7 May 2010 (UTC)
Interesting. Yes, I would agree. ClanWolverine101 00:38, 11 May 2010 (UTC)


Hoolla Mbear, i give you the All Purpose Award, 4th ribbon Award, for your great Space Defense System article.Greetings --Doneve 13:18, 12 May 2010 (UTC)

Hey thanks! I appreciate it.--Mbear 13:19, 12 May 2010 (UTC)

Unit Compositions[edit]

Hy again, i want to bring the composition section the unit articles to one standart like this Example , what you are thinking about this, when you have ideas please talk to me.--Doneve 14:17, 12 May 2010 (UTC)

I think it is not necessary to name every commander from smaller subcommands. It is important to know the commanding officer from brigades or import units.— The preceding unsigned comment was provided by Neuling (talkcontribs) .
I agree with Neuling that the most important aspect of what you are trying to do is the commanding officers.. and not to be rude.. but their is a section for that and your example article has a single line in it. Look at the officers in the 2nd Sword of Light for something that will a bit more useful to most players. At the same time though I am very much in favor of every smaller unit being listed. --Dmon 14:40, 12 May 2010 (UTC)
Doneve, I'm not sure what you're trying to do. Add the commanders of the regiments that make up an RCT? If you want to put that work in there, go ahead, I won't stop you. But before you spend a lot of time on that, I'd remind you that there are a lot of regiments listed in BTW already that may or may not have officer information. Even the publishers don't keep track of all the people who command RCT regiments (and smaller units like battalions, etc). So you may be taking on a huge task that might be of limited use. Maintaining it would also be a big challenge. At this time I don't see that it really adds any benefit, and you might get burned out part way through the task. (I should know, I reached a point on the Military Ranks project where I thought I'd go insane.)
But like I said earlier if you want to take on this task, I won't get in your way.--Mbear 16:15, 12 May 2010 (UTC)
Hy guys, i don't make the task in next time (i had a lot of work about the SLDF and Manufacturing Timeline), but nice to see the reactions, and ideas Greetings--Doneve 16:27, 12 May 2010 (UTC)

Wanted Files[edit]

Hi, I posses many of the wanted files but I doesn't know exacly if they are needed. Please give me a response. Neuling 05:50, 17 May 2010 (UTC)

I'm not sure what you mean here. Which wanted files are you speaking of?--Mbear 12:12, 17 May 2010 (UTC)


My new task for the next weeks to come are to complete the industries section how far i can do. Where are the biggest problem tell me... Neuling 05:50, 17 May 2010 (UTC)

I really have no idea. Industries aren't one of my focus areas, really. Be bold and fix what you can.--Mbear 12:12, 17 May 2010 (UTC)

Pictures from Game Cards[edit]

For many variants of the mechs and vehicles are pictures on the card game. What are you thinking, can I integrate this pictures with the existing files like daishi a and so on.... Neuling 05:54, 17 May 2010 (UTC)

I don't know. The card game is different from the tabletop game so there may be some overlap. I think Wrangler or Doneve uploaded a lot of the card game images, so they might be better able to answer your question.--Mbear 12:12, 17 May 2010 (UTC)


Hy Mbear, please can you update the AeroSpace Fighter infobox with cost, i add the cost but i can't see it on the article, thanks.--Doneve 14:35, 25 May 2010 (UTC)

Doneve, I've added a Cost line to the AeroSpace Fighter infobox as you requested. You can see an example on the Stuka page.--Mbear 19:01, 25 May 2010 (UTC)
Ah Superb, thanks.--Doneve 19:21, 25 May 2010 (UTC)

Record Sheets 3039 BV[edit]

Holla again, can you help me about the BV (grml..a never ending story), you see i update the ASF section by the RS 3039, iam a little bit confused then on the ASF articles on the wike the BV (1.0) addings are right or wrong there is no citation, when it is ok, i add the RS BV (1.0) on the non citaion variants. I hope you understand my SPECIAL englischhhhh ;).Greeting --Doneve 18:24, 25 May 2010 (UTC)

If I understand you, there are several AeroSpace Fighters that have variants. You've been adding the battle value from Record Sheets: 3039 to the appropriate pages. There are many articles that provide a BV (1.0) value you can't verify because there isn't a reference/citation listing the source. Is that right?--Mbear 18:55, 25 May 2010 (UTC)
Absolutly, when no citation on the variant i add the RS 3039, it is better as nothing, and it is cannon.--Doneve 19:23, 25 May 2010 (UTC)
Well, if you have the BV (1.0) values and the article doesn't list them, by all means put them in place. Go forth! Edit! Be Bold!
If they're BV (2.0) values, that's fine too. Just mark them as BV (2.0) or BV (1.0) and put in the correct values. Go forth! Edit! Be Bold!--Mbear 20:03, 25 May 2010 (UTC)
Okidoky, ;), I BOLDED ;) the coffee machine is upgraded.--Doneve 20:17, 25 May 2010 (UTC)

Writing up a Mauser & Gray Firearms article[edit]

Hi Mbear, I recently noted the deletion of the Mauser & Gray article. I'm going write up one using the info from the information from the Handbook: House Steiner. Do you have any objectives about this since you deleted the old one? Hate see that logo goto waste. -- Wrangler 15:48, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

Not at all. The reason I deleted the old article was that it was a sub-stub that only had your logo on it. Make a good article and I'll be happy. Good luck!--Mbear 15:51, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

SLDF Military Regions[edit]

Hoolla, good work about the military regions :). I think a category link is helpfull. Hmm do you like Star League Military Regions...or a little bit specified (era, periode, date...)?.--17:14, 4 June 2010 (UTC)

Well thanks! I've added the category you suggested to each page. I didn't put the year/era info in the category because as far as I know the Military Region was restricted to the first SLDF. (The second SLDF didn't last long enough to require it.)--Mbear 17:22, 4 June 2010 (UTC)
Agree absolutly, good job.-- Doneve 17:29, 4 June 2010 (UTC)

Objectiv raids 3067[edit]

Hy Mbear, I find a pdf created from fans. This book contains all available information about parts and products for the entire is military. What are you thinking. Can i use this information for some projects in the future or not.
The link for this pdf is:,7014.msg159695.html#msg159695
and for the sub articles:
Neuling 20:26, 10 May 2010 (UTC)

Hy Mbear i removed the added links from Neuling, there not relevant.Doneve 20:56, 10 May 2010 (UTC)
Neuling the short answer is "No." Please see the Objective Raids: 3067 page. It describes the reason for not using the file.--Mbear 13:31, 11 May 2010 (UTC)

Cloud Nine & Ten[edit]

Hi Mbear, i just wrote up the Cloud Nine Carrier Airship article from the TRO: Vehicle Annex. I wrote it as a prelude to when Cloud Ten becames available to become a article. However, i wanted bounce idea to you that the Cloud Ten should be its own article instead of written up as a variant since it has considerable amount of text and features in comparison to Cloud Nine. -- Wrangler 19:03, 4 June 2010 (UTC)

I agree that the Cloud Ten should get it's own article. In fact, there's a link on the XTRO:Boondocks page expressly for the Cloud Ten. You could put a "related designs" header on the page (Like on the Duan Gung page).--Mbear 20:09, 4 June 2010 (UTC)

VAL-NT-JX "Hot Knife"[edit]

Hi Mbear, i just you post the variant for the Valiant. Question, what version of the Valiant is this variant suppose to be based on? Not sound picky, there least two base models being produced two seperate succession states. -- Wrangler 15:09, 7 June 2010 (UTC)

Based on the name (JX) I assume it's based on the J3 model. I've updated the page to reflect that.--Mbear 15:11, 7 June 2010 (UTC)

Slide In/Slide Out Equipment[edit]

Hi Mbear, i'm was looking to write up small article regarding this pre-OmniModule system that used in Support Vehicles called Slide In/Slide Out or SISO. I've Scanned/looked in TechManual and the didn't find any listing for the thing. Do you know where i would find actual listing on it? -- Wrangler 14:01, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

IIRC, the SISO was mentioned in Technical Readout: Vehicle Annex, not the TechManual. It was one of the research vehicles, but now I can't remember which one. Sorry!--Mbear 16:01, 8 June 2010 (UTC)
Its in two vehicles so far from what i've found. Cortez Exploration vehicle and the Mosquito radar plane. There no construction rules regarding them which is kind frustrating since these is a pre-quer to OmniMech/OmniVehicle designs. It IS a piece of equipment. It does not say how much equipment is suppose to be able to handle. TacOps, TechManual do not have anything on it. I'll keep looking. -- Wrangler 16:09, 8 June 2010 (UTC)
Another possibility is the Mercury battlemech. It was the precursor to the Omnimech, so maybe some of the same info applies to the SISO.--Mbear 16:12, 8 June 2010 (UTC)
So far from what i've looked into, its never been named having the SISO. It was a completely new thing. Thinking about it, the SOSI likely to be precursor to OmniVehicles instead. -- Wrangler 17:45, 8 June 2010 (UTC)
I've gotten word from the Battletech writer, Cray. He has said that the SISO is a fluff system has no solid mechanics in the game. There maybe rules for it StratOps, but SISO isn't mentioned in the book. Should we bother SISO and possibly other such fluff equipment in a list some where like the List of Minor Merc units? -- Wrangler 19:06, 9 June 2010 (UTC)
I wouldn't bother. I see the SISO system as being similar to the Mercury 'Mech's "modular repair system": It's a neat bit of fluff and really handy for the Techs fixing things, but it doesn't affect game play or require any rules.--Mbear 19:58, 9 June 2010 (UTC)

Jade Falcon Incursion and Dominion Wars[edit]

Hi Mbear, I have two little project: First the JFI which is in progress and Second the DW. What are you thinking about it and give me advice when needed. Neuling 18:38, 9 June 2010 (UTC)

You've got some good stuff on the Jade Falcon Incursion. I've only two suggestions:
  1. Cite your sources/Add references that others can use.
  2. Add links to the planets, units, etc. in the article (but you're probably doing this already)
Other than that, good work.--Mbear 18:46, 9 June 2010 (UTC)

Spam link[edit]

Hy Mbear, can you look at user he add a spam link to the Sandbox, i deleted the link.--Doneve 12:05, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Faction 3067[edit]

Hy Mbear, what are you thinking about my latest work about the Dominion Wars and the work about an update to all know factions inclusive mercs. Neuling 21:42, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Neuling, you've got a lot of info about 3067 deployments on the DCMS page. I don't think that's the right place for them. I'd put them instead on the unit pages.
The problem with putting the 3067 deployment on the main DCMS page is simple: Pretty soon you'd have to add information for the Age of War, First Succession War, etc., which is going to create a massive page. Instead I'd put the information you have here on the specific page for the unit, year, or event. (If we're missing an event, go ahead and add it.) That way we can keep the page size manageable.
Another problem with putting stuff on the main DCMS page is that it will quickly get lost (people will have a hard time finding it). This is good info, and if you put it on the unit/event/year page it won't get lost in a big page.--Mbear 12:37, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

For at least trying to resolve the Notable Pilots mess[edit]

Mbear - I don't know if we'll adopt your proposal, but I respect you made a strong attempt at setting up a compromise. As I don't have the authority to grant you a more prestigious award, I offer you the : Assistance Appreciated Award, 1st ribbon Thanks! ClanWolverine101 15:02, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Thanks!--Mbear 15:17, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Satellite Support Vehicles[edit]

Hi Mbear, i recently added first satellite support vehicle article. When i went to use the template for Support Vehicles, i found it inproperate for use for such a space bound vehicle. I used the infobox from the small craft instead. I'm not sure, if that or the space station infobox should be used. I did notice though through my number of support vehicle articles, that we need new template for the Support Vehicles. Can you look into this? I noticed one thing, that speed of vehicle comes up twice in article for some reason. I noticed in yours and Rev templates, that you can code the template to make certain selection in the info box to disappear from view so a empty slot doesn't show. Can this be done? Should I ask Rev about it? Thanks -- Wrangler 14:01, 15 June 2010 (UTC)

The short answer is I can look into it (speed appearing twice), but I probably won't be able to get to it until later today (about 6 or 7 PM EST). If you provide me an example I can look at I'll be happy to see if I can figure out why this is happening.
For the second part of your comment it sounds like you're asking for:
  1. A new template page for support vehicles, which should have a new infobox as well.
  2. A new infobox for satellite support vehicles.
Is that correct?--Mbear 19:10, 15 June 2010 (UTC)


Sorry, but i must laugh for the deletion tag of the Tai-shu, (you spend so much energy in the military ranks, and you forgot it ;), i must bring a little bit humor on the talk page, then in last time the "HEAT" discussion of the Notable or able or or was very impressive.) Thanks for your cool coment when you add the data (Added a lot of informations.) You have earnded a hot strong coffee from me. --Doneve 16:07, 16 June 2010 (UTC)

Yeah, when I saw that Tai-shu deletion tag I felt pretty foolish. Of course there are 182 military ranks listed in the wiki now, so maybe I can be forgiven for missing one of them. Wink.gif
Thanks for the coffee, but my doctor says I have to avoid dark fluids. Could I get a Sprite instead?--Mbear 16:18, 16 June 2010 (UTC)
Absolutly, i am the cooffee master, (please look on my Doneve page), then you understand, a little coffee picture by myself.--Doneve 16:27, 16 June 2010 (UTC)


Hy Mbear, Record Sheets: 3058 Unabridged (Clan & Star League) falls under the moratorium, take a look on RS page.Greetings--Doneve 14:35, 23 June 2010 (UTC)

D'oh! Totally forgot about the Moratorium. Thanks for stopping me in time!--Mbear 14:37, 23 June 2010 (UTC)
Sorry about forgetting to put the Moratorium both pages. -- Wrangler 16:48, 23 June 2010 (UTC)
No problem. I wasn't confused: I was testing you. Tongue.gif Yeah! That's it! I was testing you. You passed! Congratulations! --Mbear 16:57, 23 June 2010 (UTC)
Smiley.gif--Doneve 18:06, 23 June 2010 (UTC)