User talk:One-EyedJack


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*******Be Bold*******


Welcome to BattleTechWiki. Glad to have another editor aboard. I see that a lot of your contribution have been to BattleMech articles; you may wish to consider signing up as a member of Project BattleMechs. In addition, I encourage you to write a little bit about yourself at the new user log and on your user page. --Scaletail 03:02, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

Notable Pilots[edit]

I wanted to notify you that I have removed your additions to the "Notable Pilots" section of Black Knight and Blackjack (BattleMech). As a policy, all such characters must be considered notable. As a baseline for determining notability, the characters must have articles written about them. Neither of the ones you added did, so they have been removed. I encourage you to write an article devoted to each character so that they may be added as notable pilots. --Scaletail 03:11, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

So I have to make a Pilot entry before I can note them as a pilot? Both are notable in TROs.(One-EyedJack 03:21, 13 June 2010 (UTC))
OneEye - For the record, I agree with you that the character you mentioned is certainly notable, at least from a Dark Ages perspective. While I disagree with the policy Scaletail mentioned, he is technically correct. For the record, though, most of the "notable" pilots from the TROs aren't really notable - they just have interesting/amusing fluff content the writers thought to give us. So as per a counter-argument, you might want to consider a different approach.
But you had a good idea with it, though. I admit I've been frustrated by this policy myself in the past, as there are many important characters without article entries yet. I encourage you to stick with it, maybe put a stub-article up for your guy, so you can add him back.
Aside from that... welcome to the wiki! ClanWolverine101 03:33, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

I'm really going to have to disagree that the Members of Devlin Stone's regiment are not notable. And this most certainly pertains to Battletech current events, not just to Dark Ages.
I am trying to 'be bold' and help add to the site and my contributions are being deleted before I can add the linked articles.(One-EyedJack 03:45, 13 June 2010 (UTC))
I agree with you on both counts. I think my point was that the character you mentioned is just one of Stone's officers in the Jihad era. By the Dark Age era, he is considered a legend. ClanWolverine101 03:56, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

My god they are listed as notable Pilots by the authors. How much clearer do they need to be? Sounds like an admin taking liberties with aspects of the fiction he does not like, IMO. I think my days of contributing and consulting this wiki are just about over before they began.(One-EyedJack 04:35, 13 June 2010 (UTC))

Although I hate to correct a fellow admin with Admin hat on, I think Scaletail got it wrong. Wether or not a given person has an entry here yet is not relevant for the question if he/she is a notable pilot; I am not aware of a policy here that says so. See also BattleTechWiki:Project BattleMechs#Guidelines where the defining aspect is "major character". You could say that any notable pilot absolutey deserves his own article here, though. As for what makes a notable pilot, afaik the defining thing was that the pilot and the 'Mech must be associated with each other to a significant degree (Natasha Kerensky --> Warhammer, Bounty Hunter --> Marauder, Morgan Kell --> Archer). Conversely, many people noted down as "notable pilots" in the TROs are in fact nobodies. As for the articles at hand, I had read the short story before so agree that Belle Lee might be notable for the Victor. Not so sure about the other pilots in Stone's Lament, but then again I never played Dark Age. Frabby 06:36, 13 June 2010 (UTC)
PS: Oh, and welcome aboard One-EyedJack! Frabby 06:36, 13 June 2010 (UTC)
Stone's Lament is Battle Tech, not Dark Ages. These are characters detailed in TRO:3050U, TRO:3075 and Masters and Minions. I'm really disheartened that Admins of a Battletech Wiki are not aware of this.(One-EyedJack 12:49, 13 June 2010 (UTC))
Myself, I'm actually primarily interested in the pre-Clan era and I don't claim to be all-knowing. Nor do I own any of the sources yet that you've mentioned. Which is why contributors such as yourself are welcome, and appreciated here. ;) I guess I made the Dark Age connection because Belle Lee and Stone's Lament is mentioned in that LinkNet story, But that's somewhat besides the point - what's important is that a "notable" character, for purposes of this wiki, should be included for a given 'Mech if he is a major character that the fanbase will generally associate with that particular type of 'Mech. In this, I agreed with you and disagreed with Scaletail. Frabby 14:54, 13 June 2010 (UTC)
Nobody is saying that the characters are not worthy of inclusion. The discussion I linked to clearly states that, in order to establish a baseline for determining whether or not a character is notable, that character must have an article written about them. According to the consensus policy, this conclusion is binding. If any editor disagrees with it, then the proper action is to start a new discussion about it in the proper place. It was my error in archiving the discussion before adding the conclusion to the guidelines. I will correct that.
'Mech articles are very purposely not a regurgitation of the material in a given TRO. Because of that, just being listed as a "notable pilot" in the TRO entry is not enough to be considered "notable" here. By contrast, there may be famous characters who famously pilot a certain 'Mech, but are not included in the TRO description as such.
I'm sorry that there is a such a bias against the material from the Dark Age era that you immediately assume that's where I'm coming from. It's not. You will find that I have written articles based in that era.
I originally proposed adding notable pilots to 'Mech articles, but not everybody liked the idea, so there were compromises. As such, I have taken it upon myself to ensure those compromises stay intact.
There are a lot of rules, guidelines, and policies here. I know there are times I have trouble keeping them all straight in my head and I need to be corrected from time to time. I'm sorry that your first contributions ran afoul of one of the more arcane of those guidelines. Please, stick around; keep contributing. There's plenty of material from the Dark Age era that BTW lacks, as you have found. --Scaletail 14:38, 13 June 2010 (UTC)