Talk:Victor Steiner-Davion

Succession

I have question on succession of his "title" of Paladin of The Republic of the Sphere. I realize Gareth Sinclair took his place AS A Paladin for the Republic. However, I'm not sure if he could be seen as his successor since it not specific title. Such as Paladin no. 9 or something. I was under the impression that you take his spot or seat your get the Rank of Paladin, not actually inheriting the position. Since there no source information to support "theory". I don't think it should mentioned as one of frame titles at the end of the article. Any opinions? -- Wrangler 01:26, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

The succession boxes just show the character's placement in some sort of order. They do not imply inheritance. Gareth Sinclair taking his place is enough to justify the frame title. At least that's my thinking. --Ebakunin ^{(talk|contribs)} 04:34, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

Hm. I understand where you are coming from, but it is still a title. I think it's worth keeping. --Scaletail 23:01, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

Question : I am 99.9% certain that Victor saved Hohiro from the Nova Cats, not the Jaguars. I just don't have an adequate citation. I made the change, but I'll change it back if someone can prove me wrong. ClanWolverine101

I think not, he was captured by the Jaguars. Citations find you in the Novells.Doneve 00:29, 20 February 2010 (UTC)

In Lethal Heritage, he was captured by the Jaguars. Shin Yodama rescued him. In Lost Destiny, he was cornered by the Nova Cats, and Victor showed up with the Revanants. ClanWolverine101

Precentor-Martial

Unrelated : Was the position of Precentor-Martial dissolved after the Republic of the Sphere was founded? ClanWolverine101

Tactics : Something new

Something new I wanted to try with major military and political figures was a "Tactics" section that described some of the methods they used in their struggles. I started one here for Victor with a common theme I noticed in the novels; obviously we can add others. If this is successful, and people feel it is both relevant and follows the mission of this site, I would propose applying the same sections to other key figures. By no means am I proposing it becomes standard. The vast majority of characters in Battletech - even ones in power - never received the kind of coverage that would allow for it. Victor, however, was featured in over a dozen novels. SO - What do people think? ClanWolverine101 05:18, 3 April 2010 (UTC)

My perspective is that if there exists pertinent information regarding a subject, it holds relevance for the article. I'd prefer it be wedged into a pre-existing category (if a quick start template exists, as it does for bios) as a sub-section, but if no such section exists, then a Level 2 heading seems fine.--Revanche ^{(talk|contribs)} 14:35, 3 April 2010 (UTC)

Well, I suppose it COULD be added to "Personality/Motivations/Traits" sections that we've seen on various bios. Something to think about. ClanWolverine101 15:40, 3 April 2010 (UTC)

I think it needs to be verifiable. Here's why: I disagree. Katherine seized power and Victor could not stop her. He was far too unpopular in the Lyran half of the FC to reclaim the LA; Katherine's support from the Estates General seems to prove that. Besides, once she received their blessing, Victor was no longer legally Archon. He didn't contest her leadership of the FC because he didn't want to fight a civil war, though he ended up having to do it anyway. I think, with regards to Katherine, he always hoped that evidence of her involvement in their mother's assassination would come to light and she could be put on trial, allowing him to retake his throne(s) peacefully.

IIRC, he let Dow be PM because he knew 1) Dow was competent enough not to mess things up 2) Dow didn't want to be PM, so Victor would be able to come back to it. He also seemed to be trying to build bridges with Dow.

Sun-tzu as First Lord was Victor's play to keep Katherine from the position. He didn't want Liao to be FL either, but he thought Liao was better than his sister.

I understand what you are trying to, and I applaud it, but I don't think it's a good idea. --Scaletail 20:55, 3 April 2010 (UTC)

I agree with Scaletail, you know my enlish. , there must some split off of sections, and that bring some confusinality (uh i ceate a new word ;)) in the wike, we must some figuring out and want a talk to the community.Doneve 21:02, 3 April 2010 (UTC)

Scaletail - In and of themselves in a vacuum, each of your points is true enough. I'm looking at them all together. SunTzu, Katherine, Dow - each of them achieved power on Victor's watch. Each case came back to bite Victor. (Though in Katherine's case, I argue she sowed the seeds for her own downfall.) Each time, Victor justified the decisions because of the greater good. (Skye Rebellion, keeping Katherine out of First Lordship, etc.) Nevertheless, you are quite correct that this is subjective. I am willing to edit or delete the material. ClanWolverine101 22:06, 3 April 2010 (UTC)

Exactly. Where you see a pattern, I see none. If you can rework the passage to make it cite-able and unambiguous, that would be great, but all the info here should be encyclopedic. --Scaletail 23:04, 3 April 2010 (UTC)

CW, I hate to appear to be changing my opinion or gang-jumping you, but my responses were solely limited to your statement about adding a new section. Re-reading the actual section you added, it does appear to be subjective. In articles, each factoid should be something stated by an official source, rather than arrived upon through original research. What it boils down to: would the vast majority of readers agree that this was stated. If not, then it is likely opinion or otherwise subjective.

BTW does allow for subjective writing, through essays.--Revanche ^{(talk|contribs)} 23:41, 3 April 2010 (UTC)

No need to apologize - I've removed the section. ClanWolverine101 16:31, 4 April 2010 (UTC)

Age

I noticed that the wiki page list Victor's age as 104, but in Chapter 11 on page 103 of Sword of Sedition it states "... What was left was a well-preserved man of one hundred and eight, ..." Can anyone explain this discrepancy? To "officially" cite my source I again cite Sword of Sedition, Chapter 11, Page 103. Tara Campbell is viewing Victor Steiner-Davion lying in state right before David McKinnon asks for Tara's help on behalf of Exarch Levin. MirageES 14:59, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

Well, his birth year is 3030 as parked in page 204 in Masters and Minions sourcebook. The sourcebook is newer and trumps anything in previous books. The novel is simply wrong. -- Wrangler 17:49, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

Victor's birthdate in 3030 is supported by many, many works. ClanWolverine101 14:58, 30 September 2010 (UTC)

References

Wow. Too many citations have multiple items in them or grocery lists of pages. Definitely a job for someone other than me to fix this mess. Madness Divine (talk) 13:15, 13 July 2022 (EDT)