Cray
01/22/02 06:43 AM
204.245.128.3
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Well, at first glance, the Black Lion has slightly heavier armor and somewhat more guns. A more detailed examination of critical aspects:
ARMOR Comparison:
Cameron: 118-128
Black Lion: 151-168
MANEUVERABILITY comparison:
Cameron: 2/3
Black Lion: 3/5
WEAPON comparison:
Cameron -
16 NAC-25s
10 NL-55s
12 Heavy NPPCs
8 Maelstrom AR-10 Missle Launchers
Black Lion-
32 NAC-20s
18 NAC-30s
8 White Shark Missle Launchers
6 Barracuda Missle Launchers
SECONDARY UNIT comparison:
Cameron: 20 fighters, 2 dropships
Black Lion: 20 fighters, 4 dropships
RESULTS:
1) The Black Lion is more heavily armored
2) The Black Lion is faster and more agile
3) The Black Lion is more heavily armed
4) Importantly, most of the Black Lion's guns exceed the armor threshold of the Cameron (see AT2 rules) while many of the Cameron's guns (especially the missiles, lasers, and PPCs) stay below that threshold of the Black Lion
5) They are matched for organic fighter complement, but the Black Lion has twice the dropship capacity of the Cameron - load both warships with Vengeance-class fighter carriers and you'll see how this matters
CONCLUSION:
As both ships lack anti-fighter secondary weapons, the Black Lion's ability to field twice as many fighters as the Cameron can be a battle-winning advantage. Ignoring complications like fighters and dropships carried, the Black Lion remains faster, tougher, and better armed than a Cameron. There isn't much comparison here. The heavier Cameron would be a Black Lion's lap toy.
Mike Miller, Materials Engineer
Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
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Bob_Richter
01/22/02 07:08 AM
134.121.157.14
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The Black Lion also carries the deadly Barracuda Missile Launcher. You laugh, but that -2 modifier makes it the single most useful naval weapon for engagements beyond long range.
Pretty much the only competition a Cameron could win would be one involving cargo space in some way.
-Bob (The Magnificent) Richter
Assertions made in this post are the humble opinion of Bob.
They are not necessarily statements of fact or decrees from God Himself, unless explicitly and seriously stated to be so.
:)
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Cray
01/22/02 08:18 AM
204.245.128.3
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Is that bonus from the missile or the launcher? The Cameron has AR-10s that can fire Barracudas, too.
Mike Miller, Materials Engineer
Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
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Bob_Richter
01/22/02 05:14 PM
134.121.247.162
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For the missile, I believe.
Does the Cameron carry Bcudas?
I know AR-10s can fire them, but most ships with AR-10s don't seem to carry them.
-Bob (The Magnificent) Richter
Assertions made in this post are the humble opinion of Bob.
They are not necessarily statements of fact or decrees from God Himself, unless explicitly and seriously stated to be so.
:)
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Nightmare
02/10/02 09:56 AM
194.251.240.107
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The listing in the BattleSpace book doesn`t specify missile
type(s) carried. It`s probably safe to assign those according
to the scenario or campaign situation.
Advice for Evil Overlords:
My legions of terror will be trained in basic marksmanship. Any who cannot learn to hit a man-sized target at 10 meters will be used for target practice.
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Bob_Richter
02/10/02 01:16 PM
134.121.157.14
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The listing in TRO3057 does, as (IIRC) does the listing in TR2750.
-Bob (The Magnificent) Richter
Assertions made in this post are the humble opinion of Bob.
They are not necessarily statements of fact or decrees from God Himself, unless explicitly and seriously stated to be so.
:)
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Cray
03/22/02 06:34 AM
204.245.128.3
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Bob DID say, "Pretty much the only competition a Cameron could win would be one involving cargo space in some way."
Everyone's in agreement on this thread: the Cameron is just target practice for the Black Lion.
Mike Miller, Materials Engineer
Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
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Hurlbut
03/22/02 11:18 AM
204.48.169.252
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One could assume that Camereon would have the edge in the extreme range battles as noted by Camereon's direct-fire weapon loadouts. But as you said load both up with carrier dropships, drop both ships at opposite ends of a system. Black Lion would shred Camereon to pieces.... BTW isn't Camereon a cruiser where as the Black Lion is a battlecruiser?
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Cray
03/22/02 11:36 AM
204.245.128.3
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Both are battlecruisers, and the Cameron is the larger of the two by 50,000 tons.
Mike Miller, Materials Engineer
Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
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Hurlbut
03/22/02 02:23 PM
204.48.169.252
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Ick, Camereon is heavier, yet Black Lion out gun and out perfom it not to mention having the thicker armor of the two ships. Who actualy came up with the stats for Camereon?
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Cray
03/22/02 02:29 PM
204.245.128.3
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I don't know, though the Cameron was meant as sort of a failure, one of those ships built to great hopes but prove to suck...
www.mgonetwork.com/~btarchive/clanwarships/cameron.html
Not a happy ship, though its armor and weapons are supposedly "excellent."
Mike Miller, Materials Engineer
Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
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Hellbringer
04/03/02 01:31 AM
192.195.234.26
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So maybe the Camereon does not quite match up, but Task Force Serpent made dang good use of the last one in the Inner Sphere.
"But it SHOULD be a spectacle! It should be grand and exciting to us all! I'd hate to think that we've become so jaded that we find even our greatest tiumph, resurrecting the Star League, simply one more obligation."
-General Victor Steiner-Davion (First Prince and Archon in exile) 3064
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