Karagin
08/03/02 11:26 PM
65.132.126.242
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Right now the BT community is split about 50/50 on MWDA or it seems that way.
As for hearing good things about it, it depends on who talk to.
As far as it effecting BT that depends...if it flopps then that may be the end of both, if it does okay then it's around and we have to live with it. If it does really well, then we are stuck with it and may have to fear it...
The choice as to if it's for you or not is up to you.
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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rock
08/04/02 01:28 PM
152.163.195.192
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My biggest fear is that DarkAge will "flash quickly" and then die. If that happens then 'Classic' Battletech (CBT) may die with it.
I am hoping that DarkAge will be as reasonably successful as the previous "Collectible Click-type" product lines. That will give us "CBTers" the opportunity and time to support Fan Pro by buying their Battletech products.
Then when the "Collectible Click-type" games go by the way-side as it seems all "collectibles" go that way; we "CBTers" will have proven there is still a small but profitable market for CBT and thus WizKids will then allow Fan Pro to continue to produce CBT product.
What we need to do as 'CBTers' is support Fan Pro and prove there is still a market for Classic Battletech.
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Chas
08/04/02 04:43 PM
66.187.4.132
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I don't know if click-base games are going to go by the wayside anytime soon. People thought the same thing about CCGs, and look today. Magic: Crack For Gamers is still going quite strong.
But you have a point. While MW:DA is gaining ground, we (the fanbase of CBT) need to push CBT forward into people's sphere of awareness. And try to help increase and strengthen the fan-base. That way if MW:DA eventually dies, CBT will STILL be the stronger for it's having come on the scene.
And remember, wether someone comes to the BattleTech Universe through CBT, MechWarrior RPG, BattleSpace, AeroTech, CityTech, BattleTroops, Solaris7, MechWarrior Computer Games, Virtual World BT, BT CCG, or MW:DA, they are STILL all part of the same BT Universe fanbase.
Treat them as equals. Educate them in the possibilities available within the Universe, and remember to stow the "I started with "REAL" BT" snobbery in your foot locker.
Do this, and we can't help but benefit from this.
---
"High necked fashions just became the IN thing here on Tharkad."
-- Morgan Kell
-- Grave Covenant
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Karagin
08/04/02 05:55 PM
65.129.167.252
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Maybe your line of think should be applied to the current fan base as well...
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Moraelin
08/05/02 10:43 AM
194.114.62.34
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Well, that's not really abnormal, since different people like different things. E.g., at one extreme I know a lot of people couldn't care less about anything but getting into battle with whatever mechs are at hand. In fact, I know one who actually likes playing with a random mix of mechs, just for the challenge. At the other extreme I also know people who wouldn't play with a standard non-customized mech even if their life depended on it. (In fact, I'm one of the later.) Basically some are strategists, while some of us would probably be more happy in the BT universe as engineers in a mech factory than as lance commanders on the battlefield. The first group will cheer at the click bases, while the second group will be annoyed no end that they can't replace that LRM with a SRM on their mech.
Plus a lot of shades of gray in between the two extremes.
And that's just one of the split opinions.
In the end, all that's just normal. As I always say, life would be terminally boring if we all liked the exact same things.
---
Moraelin - The proud member of the Idiots' Guild
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Greyslayer
08/05/02 10:53 AM
216.14.192.226
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I'd say you would need to revise your theory on what groups represent what. I fit into the former yet I am a seriously against MW:DA.
Greyslayer
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KamikazeJohnson
08/05/02 11:01 AM
142.161.40.95
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Ahhh...but does that make you the rule...or the exception...
Peace is that glorious moment in history when everyone stands around reloading.
--Thomas Jefferson
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Greyslayer
08/05/02 11:31 AM
216.14.192.226
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it makes me exceptional ....  ...... NOT. I would say there are a big % of people who are in a similar grouping.
Though I would hope the group is not made up of lemmings.
Greyslayer
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Moraelin
08/05/02 11:36 AM
194.114.62.66
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Just for the fun of quoting myself, I did say "And that's just one of the split opinions." I.e., there are other debated issues as well. Several of them, in fact. E.g., as an extreme example, some people seem to strongly oppose the idea of having figurines made of plastic instead of metal.
Basically: I'm guessing you dislike some other of the changes in MW:DA?
Either way, the main idea was: I still think it's normal. Any time you do some major changes to an established game, there has to be a group of people who liked the old way more than the new way. There's nothing abnormal about that. Noone is so indiscriminate as to swallow everything equally happily. Everyone has something they like and something they dislike.
From a pragmatic point of view, of course the question still remains whether you gained enough new players with that change, to offset ticking off your old loyal fans. But that's something WizKids will have to find out for themselves.
---
Moraelin - The proud member of the Idiots' Guild
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Karagin
08/05/02 11:50 AM
65.129.166.27
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Are there any cliffs near by?
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Greyslayer
08/05/02 11:54 AM
216.14.192.226
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'some people seem to strongly oppose the idea of having figurines made of plastic instead of metal.'
Plastic, metal, wood or chocolate I don't really care as long as the quality is good and the model remains 'true' to the design. The scale is important as well.
'Basically: I'm guessing you dislike some other of the changes in MW:DA?'
Most aspects of change. Examples:
- aforementioned scale.
- poor quality of figure production
- the apparent 'new' storyline
- the idea of damage instead of 'fatigue' to units that are pushed for multiple turns.
- for some strange reason mercs totally unable to use formations in the game 
Is that a good enough list for starters?
'to offset ticking off your old loyal fans.'
Well as such the only fans Wiz Kidz would have in relation to battletech before the release of the MW:DA would be those that play and enjoy Mage Knight and Heroclick (or whatever) that have also an interest in battletech.
Greyslayer
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Moraelin
08/05/02 12:22 PM
194.114.62.33
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In reply to:
Plastic, metal, wood or chocolate I don't really care as long as the quality is good and the model remains 'true' to the design. The scale is important as well.
Didn't say YOU, but just as an extreme example of what issues can be raised. I'm not even making it up. I actually know someone who's royally ticked off that they're not going to be made of metal.
In reply to:
Is that a good enough list for starters?
It's as good a list as any. As I've said, there are enough issues debated to fill a dropship with. (And never implied that the "I want to customize my mechs" vs "I don't want to customize anything" was the only issue.)
In reply to:
Well as such the only fans Wiz Kidz would have in relation to battletech before the release of the MW:DA would be those that play and enjoy Mage Knight and Heroclick (or whatever) that have also an interest in battletech.
I'm guessing you do understand what I mean, though. Since they bought the rights from FASA, they could have just claimed the old FASA fan base for their own and kept making the classic BT line themselves. Or just made some conservative next edition of the classic BT.
Basically they ticked off the old game's fan base. (Which may not have been WizKids fans to start with, but could have been claimed in wholesale by WizKids nevertheless.) And it remains to be seen if they'll attract more people with the changes than they lose with them.
---
Moraelin - The proud member of the Idiots' Guild
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Bob_Richter
08/05/02 06:27 PM
4.35.174.250
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>>>I'm guessing you do understand what I mean, though. Since they bought the rights from FASA, they could have just claimed the old FASA fan base for their own and kept making the classic BT line themselves.<<<
That's more or less what they did, but since Books and Mapsheets aren't exactly their Thang, they leased it out to FanPro, as with Shadowrun, to keep it going under people with experience with such things.
They didn't have to buy it at all, you know. Didn't have to let FanPro continue the Classic Battletech line. Sometimes I wish they hadn't. *sigh*
But most people seem to think it's a good thing.
>>>Basically they ticked off the old game's fan base.<<<
Quite unitentionally. As with the earlier Battletech CCG someone said "hey, wouldn't it be cool if there were a ___" set in the Battletech Universe?
The big thing I think most of us are worried about is we think we're being sidelined in favor of the new product. Personally, I don't care. I know what I like and I'll continue to buy/play it.
In other words, WizKids's decision DOESN'T EFFECT ANY OF US! WE HAVE NO RIGHT TO BE ANGRY!
Get me?
-Bob (The Magnificent) Richter
Assertions made in this post are the humble opinion of Bob.
They are not necessarily statements of fact or decrees from God Himself, unless explicitly and seriously stated to be so.
:)
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MacLeod
08/05/02 10:36 PM
64.156.224.164
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Mmm... a chocolate Timber Wolf... the perfect thing for the Easter Bunny to hide for all us loyal BT players to find.
Drugs don't kill people, pancreatic cancer kills people.
... and whoever heard of a drug that causes pancreatic cancer?
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Khan_Robinette
08/06/02 09:20 AM
216.24.92.31
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"The big thing I think most of us are worried about is we think we're being sidelined in favor of the new product. Personally, I don't care. I know what I like and I'll continue to buy/play it.
In other words, WizKids's decision DOESN'T EFFECT ANY OF US! WE HAVE NO RIGHT TO BE ANGRY!"
Thank you Bob at least someone on here other than myself has mind enough to realize that we have a choice in what we play.
On another note to the simpletons.
This subject is getting old, play Battletech, play MW:DA...but just shut the .... up and quit whining like a bunch of menatally abused 12 year olds. You owul dthink someone had taken your lollipops form you all the way you ..... and moan.
"Teach me and I'll teach you
If you need a hand I'll give you two
Respect me and I'll respect you
Disrespect me and I will destroy you"
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Khan_Robinette
08/06/02 09:21 AM
216.24.92.31
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*Sloth from Goonies voice*
"choc-o-late?"
Hmm Cho-O-Late!
"Teach me and I'll teach you
If you need a hand I'll give you two
Respect me and I'll respect you
Disrespect me and I will destroy you"
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rock
08/07/02 02:34 PM
152.163.189.136
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In answer to your question; this is what I have observed as a father of three sons (ages 15, 12, & 9).
Mage Knight was wildly popular with both kids and adults (myself included). It is a good game and a quick playing game. Like Magic the Gathering, Mage Knight initially attracted a lot of 'collectors' versus 'players'. The 'collectors' have pretty much disappeared and the game is predominately supported now by 'players'. I think Mage Knight has established a sizable core of players now.
The follow-on Mage Knight Dungeon was not as popular and attracted predominately players only.
Marvel Hero-Click. (Soon to be released DC, Dark Horse, etc... versions) All I can say is collectors, collectors, collectors,...... I rarely see this game being played in the stores or at game conventions. It is still too early to tell if there will be a 'core' of players established after the 'collectors' leave.
Mage Knight and Hero-click have sold well in my area and seemed to have sold well in other areas that I have traveled to.
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