Karagin
02/23/22 12:34 PM
70.118.172.64
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IF Apocryphal Content is not canon, why is it listed with the canon information? Efforts were taken to remove all fan stuff from the wiki and yet you leave in the information that is non-canon.
The video games and most of the computer games are not canon, so including their information adds more confusion for new players and does render some for those of us who have been at this game for a while.
IF the Apocryphal Content is so needed (which it's not) then how about a separate page or category for it all, then it's all there and not mixed in with the canon stuff. Again go look at Wookiepedia, they have two seconds for things, Canon and Legends (aka the Expanded Universe), that way all the extra things are collected to the right areas and doesn't cause any confusion to the reader.
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Frabby
03/01/22 03:43 PM
91.39.164.31
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What makes the apocryphal material special is that it was published in some official shape or form (sliding scale here from "as good as outright canon" to "outside claim to being an officially sanctioned publication"). That clearly sets it apart from mere fan fiction, to the point where you could say it is "canon unless and until contradicted by other canon material". In recent products, especially the ilClan Recognition Guides, there was a notable effort to canonize many obscure pieces of apocrypha.
So yes, it absolutely belongs with the canon information. And since it is clearly marked as apocryphal, I don't see how there can be any confusion.
About segregating apocryphal content: Not a viable approach. Oftentimes, apocrypha are mere tidbits of information pertaining to an otherwise canonical subject. Eg. the Kiudo as such is fully canon, but its exact layout is apocryphal.
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Karagin
03/01/22 10:26 PM
70.118.172.64
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It's not canon, thus it's not anywhere near being canon that needs to be right in the middle of the information. They are not important enough to make canon, thus need their own section. Having it in the middle or even listed makes things look mature compared to other wikias.
Having it in its own section allows it to be accessed and referenced without cluttering the main articles. As for the efforts to make something canon, once it's made canon then it's canon, then it should be added to the canon information listed, but until then it's NOT canon and should not even be there.
It is on the same level as fan-made stuff, it's not official, it's not found in a sourcebook or TRO and thus it's outside of the canon BT universe. Listing it with the canon material gives it more value than it needs.
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Karagin
03/01/22 11:34 PM
70.118.172.64
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Thanks for the discussion, and given that you don't want to consider the change then I am bowing out of the talk. later.
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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ghostrider
03/02/22 10:28 AM
45.51.181.83
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I would suspect the time and effort is the main reason why the change is being resisted.
With that said, the discussion of canon verses non canon has been discussed a little. The non canon stuff, should be in its own section, and marked as such.
Such things as mechs using jump jets can be as acrobatic as the best gymnist is against the entire concept of how the game portraited jets function. The idea that you can not launch them while laying down is scoffed, but yet it is more likely to be done then a somersault over a crowd of people, as in the Cabalaros novel.
Now unless the material is going to be made canon, suggesting the wiki is canon sources when it is not, is a problem. It makes the entire resource questionable when someone does find out the information is inaccurate.
Yes, fixing it would be a task no one wants to do, but unless you are going to modify all entries and mark all that are not canon, which is a poor way of fixing a canon resource, then a full purge is needed if the material isn't separated into its own section.
This is even more difficult if the items are mixed with each other. But I guess footnotes could solve most of it, if people actually look at them.
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Frabby
03/06/22 12:12 PM
91.39.164.31
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Quote:
It is on the same level as fan-made stuff, it's not official, it's not found in a sourcebook or TRO and thus it's outside of the canon BT universe. Listing it with the canon material gives it more value than it needs.
There seems to be some sort of misunderstanding here.
Apocryphal material absolutely is official. That is pretty much one of its two defining qualities. The other being that while being official, it still doesn’t meet the current criteria for canon. Those are different from just being "official".
Check out the official definition of Canon. Which incidentally also mentioned apocrypha as something of a third thing between canon and non-canon, though without naming it apocrypha.
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