Idea for a lance

Pages: 1
Karagin
07/26/19 03:43 PM
72.176.171.47

Edit Reply Quote Quick Reply
Okay so I am toying around with this idea for a 3025 Striker Lance:

Wolverine
Griffin
Rifleman
Marauder

Thoughts?
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
ghostrider
07/26/19 05:06 PM
66.74.60.165

Edit Reply Quote Quick Reply
I would think all jumpers or no jumpers.
Speed differences may be an issue as well.

The Rifleman seems the weakest point here. But then, playing it right is the key.
Are you stuck with 60 tons? Or can you add/subtract some weight?
If weight isn't an issue, I would think a Catapult, Phoenix Hawk, or possibly Vindicator to replace Rifleman.
My guess would be someone wants a Thunderbolt instead, but I am not fond of them for some reason.
Though an 8Q Awesome can never be wrong.
Karagin
07/26/19 07:40 PM
72.176.171.47

Edit Reply Quote Quick Reply
Quote:
I would think all jumpers or no jumpers.
Speed differences may be an issue as well.




Would think a good player would use that to keep the other side on the guessing game, and use it to cover the range issues.

Quote:

The Rifleman seems the weakest point here. But then, playing it right is the key.




How is the Rifleman the weak point? Are you taking about it's weapons or the range? Or the armor? None of these mechs are one shot one kill systems, even the Marauder would need a head hit for that.


Quote:

Are you stuck with 60 tons? Or can you add/subtract some weight?
If weight isn't an issue, I would think a Catapult, Phoenix Hawk, or possibly Vindicator to replace Rifleman.
My guess would be someone wants a Thunderbolt instead, but I am not fond of them for some reason.
Though an 8Q Awesome can never be wrong.



Not stuck on anyone mech, just had the idea while painting up some mechs last night.
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
ghostrider
07/26/19 11:44 PM
66.74.60.165

Edit Reply Quote Quick Reply
Rifleman's overheating when firing more then one large laser comes to mind.
Armor isn't that bad, as the one shot kill isn't there for any of them really.
I like the Rifleman's look, but it needs far more heat sinks to be very useful.
Requiem
07/27/19 01:58 AM
1.158.206.105

Edit Reply Quote Quick Reply
3025 Technical Readout

Possible Fire Support Units

First

Blackjack…………………….. (Davion Variant – Replace A/Cs with Lg Lasers)
Phoenix Hawk…………...…..(Davion Variant – Replace MGs with Heat Sinks)
Dervish………………………..(Variant – Replace SRMs with 4 Sm Lasers + 2 Heat Sinks)

Either
Two Blackjacks and Two Dervishes
One BlackJack, Two Phoenix Haws, One Dervish
One Phoenix Hawk, Two Blackjacks, One Dervish

Second

Catapult……………………..(Variant – Standard)
Catapult…………………….(Kurita Variant – Replacing LRM with PPC etc.)
Crusader……………………(Mercenary Variant – 2 LRM 10, Lg Laser, 2 Md Laser, + 2 Heat Sinks, + armour, Jump (4))
JagerMech……………….....(Davion Variant – 2 LRM 15, 2 Lg Laser, + 2 Heat Sinks, + Armour)
Thunderbolt…………….....(ELH Mercenary Variant – Remove SRM & MG, with Jump (4))
Archer………………………(Variant – Standard)
Warhammer …………...…(Davion Variant – Replacing MG with 2 Heat Sinks)
Marauder ……………...….(Davion Variant – Replacing AC with Lg Laser, + 2 Heat Sinks, + armour)

Either
Two Catapult (standard), Two Catapult (Kurita)
Warhammer, Two JagerMech, Archer
Warhammer, Two Thunderbolt, Crusader
Two Warhammer, Two JagerMech
Two Marauder, Two Catapult (Standard)
Get thee to Coventry … Now is the winter of our discontent, made glorious by this daughter of Tharkad … Our army shall march through. Well to New Avalon tonight.
csadn
07/27/19 04:55 AM
50.53.22.4

Edit Reply Quote Quick Reply
Quote:
Okay so I am toying around with this idea for a 3025 Striker Lance:

Wolverine
Griffin
Rifleman
Marauder

Thoughts?



This isn't a Striker Lance -- two of them are slow, and have no Jump capability; and three of them fail miserably the "overheat test" (if it performs a Walk, and fires its two biggest guns in the same turn, does it start taking heat-related effects?). Strikers need to be quick, and they can't do that if they're losing MP to overheating; they also need to be accurate, and they can't do that either if overheating.

Really, what you have here is a Fire Support Lance -- pick positions distant from the foe, park there, and start sniping.

For a decent Striker Lance; Get another _Wolverine_, then add a couple _Shadow Hawk_s.
CF

Oregon: The "Outworlds Alliance" of the United States of America
ghostrider
07/27/19 01:12 PM
66.74.60.165

Edit Reply Quote Quick Reply
Shadow Hawks main variant has only 3 jump. It is better then none, but not really the striker material suggested, csadn.
I am not really fond of Wolverines, as they are an ammo dependent unit, and lacks a decent main punch. The ac 5 isn't that impressive, while the srm 6 does do damage, it is spread. The ML being the solid secondary weapon, but really doesn't seem like enough to do much.

The suggestions done at first was to avoid specific models, and try to have a model that is open to the general public.
I using specific ones, then there are more then a few that would work. The PPC armed Cicada being one. Spot for other mechs with speed and range. Heavy terrain would slow it down.
A panther with lrms instead of srms would work. Though it and the Cicada are a bit light for this sort of work.
The F variant of the Jenner would be another fast unit with decent punch. But again. A bit light.
The Valkyrie is light as well.

As for the heavy units in the lance, I want to say Karagin was looking for a lighter version, as the heavies tend to be over used.
Not saying the original idea of the lance won't work. It could well be a good set up, especially if the enemy has any fighters that can intervein. Even without that, it is decent.
csadn
07/27/19 07:45 PM
50.53.22.4

Edit Reply Quote Quick Reply
Quote:
Shadow Hawks main variant has only 3 jump. It is better then none, but not really the striker material suggested, csadn.
I am not really fond of Wolverines, as they are an ammo dependent unit, and lacks a decent main punch. The ac 5 isn't that impressive, while the srm 6 does do damage, it is spread. The ML being the solid secondary weapon, but really doesn't seem like enough to do much.



Fact is: There aren't that many good Strikers in the Originals; best I can think of is the Steiner-model _Griffin_, and the Kurita-model _Shadow Hawk_, and they're not huge improvements. I had to build my own set of designs to fill the Striker role; my go-to is a _Shadow Hawk_ with two additional Jump Jets, a PPC, and a Med. Laser, with enough heat sinks to use all of them at once (use the PPC while closing to 3-4 hexes, then use both guns). It's maneuverable enough to avoid getting hit, and isn't ammo-dependent.
CF

Oregon: The "Outworlds Alliance" of the United States of America
Requiem
07/29/19 03:35 AM
1.158.206.105

Edit Reply Quote Quick Reply
How about if we go back to the Technical Readout: Succession Wars & 3025

Thus ….. the possible striker ‘Mechs could include?

Non- Jump
Night Hawk – 35tons - 6/9 – 2 Lg Laser ,2 Md Laser
Talon – 35tons – 8/12 – PPC, 2 Md Laser
Wolfhound – 35tons – 6/9 – Lg Laser, 4 Md Laser
Kyudo – 45tons – 5/8 – Lg Laser, LRM 20, Sm Laser, + 1 Heat Sink
Crab – 50tons – 5/8 – 2 Lg Laser, Md Laser, Sm Laser
Lancelot – 60tons – 6/9 – PPC, 2 Lg Laser, Md Laser
Bombardier – 65tons – 5/8 – 2 LRM 20, SRM 4, Sm Laser, + 1 Heat Sink
Flashman – 75tons – 5/8 – 3 Lg Laser, 5 Md Laser, Sm Laser, + 2 Heat Sink

So how about

Crab
Lancelot
Bombadier
Flashman


Jump
Spector – 35tons – 7/11/7 – Lg Laser, 2 Md Laser, 2 Sm Laser, +1 Heat Sink
Phoenix Hawk – 45tons – 6/9/6 – Lg Laser, 2 Md Laser, + 2 Heat Sink
Chameleon – 50tons – 6/9/6 – Lg Laser, 2 Md Laser, 3 Sm Laser, 2 MG
Phoenix – 50tons – 5/8/5 – PPC, 2 SRM 2
Dervish – 55tons – 5/8/5 – 2 LRM 10, 2 Md Laser, 2 SRM 2
Gladiator – 55tons - 5/8/5 – PPC, SRM 6, 2 Md Laser
Griffin – 55tons – 5/8/5 – PPC, LRM 10

So How about ….

Phoenix
Dervish
Gladiator
Griffin

and then
Night Hawk
Talon
Spector
Chameleon / Phoenix Hawk
Get thee to Coventry … Now is the winter of our discontent, made glorious by this daughter of Tharkad … Our army shall march through. Well to New Avalon tonight.
ghostrider
07/29/19 12:13 PM
66.74.60.165

Edit Reply Quote Quick Reply
Issue with the mechs listed there Requiem.
Despite being made in the Star League, more then a few of them didn't survive, but were rebuild in the 3050 and beyond time line.
A few of them use upgraded components so they could not exist in 3025 without being salvaged from League depots.
The Gladiator being the only one that doesn't seem to have an xl engine, or FCS out of the newer units put out saying they were League designs.

But the list does cause some issues with the adding in mechs for that era, yet didn't come out until a whiles after the game was going. So retro fitted in for some.
Karagin
07/29/19 03:07 PM
72.176.171.47

Edit Reply Quote Quick Reply
Let's stick to 3025 tech...
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
Requiem
07/29/19 10:42 PM
1.158.206.105

Edit Reply Quote Quick Reply
If Limited to 3025 only

Two Phoenix Hawks and Two Griffins

Otherwise – The Davion ‘Experimental’ Lance of six

Two Wasp, Two Stinger and Two Valkyrie
Get thee to Coventry … Now is the winter of our discontent, made glorious by this daughter of Tharkad … Our army shall march through. Well to New Avalon tonight.
Karagin
07/29/19 10:46 PM
72.176.171.47

Edit Reply Quote Quick Reply
Again 3025 tech striker lance was the idea.
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
Requiem
07/30/19 06:40 AM
1.158.206.105

Edit Reply Quote Quick Reply
What is your definition for a Striker Lance? what makes it different from a Fire Support Lance?

With regards to the Succession Wars Technical Readout - what if I am deploying as ComStar - deploying a ComGuard Force - can I use them then when I consider making my Striker unit in 3025?
Get thee to Coventry … Now is the winter of our discontent, made glorious by this daughter of Tharkad … Our army shall march through. Well to New Avalon tonight.
Karagin
07/30/19 10:40 AM
72.176.171.47

Edit Reply Quote Quick Reply
Requiem, 3025 tech, that's it. aka TRO 3025
Karagin

Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
ghostrider
07/30/19 12:40 PM
66.74.60.165

Edit Reply Quote Quick Reply
Damned new mouse. Too many buttons. Clicked a side one and put me back to forums list, killing post. Well....

I am shocked the Warhammer wasn't said.
But a mech that might be considered is an Assassin. Good speed, with a decent weapon.

But I do agree that the stock 3025 units are hard to make a striker unit out of. Variants of them would help, but that is something that would have to be said. Removing the ml's on the Rifleman for a pair of heatsinks would make it a better choice, but lose the firepower at shorter ranges.

As a side note. This thread is not make your own personal uber striker unit.
It is Karagin asking if the original lance would be a good one.

Funny. But this kind of shows who actually played during the initial release of the game. 3025 did not list the League mechs when it came out. The others were shoved into the era. I half figured the original 12 with Citytech for this thread. Which the Wolfhound and a few others didn't exist.

Thought of another pretty popular mech that hasn't been offered. The enforcer.


Edited by ghostrider (07/30/19 12:41 PM)
Requiem
07/30/19 05:51 PM
1.158.206.105

Edit Reply Quote Quick Reply
Definition of a Striker Unit – shock and Awe – The ability to move fast over any terrain and hit their target even harder. Following the mission, they would also be able to retreat in good order at an above average speed over any terrain.

Thus for 3025 – 4 x Phoenix Hawk LAMs
Get thee to Coventry … Now is the winter of our discontent, made glorious by this daughter of Tharkad … Our army shall march through. Well to New Avalon tonight.
ghostrider
07/31/19 07:32 PM
66.74.60.165

Edit Reply Quote Quick Reply
Given the stock mechs, there could not be anything like a striker unit. The closest thing might be Jenners.
Well without filling hover craft with bombs...
Requiem
08/02/19 03:18 AM
1.158.206.105

Edit Reply Quote Quick Reply
Jenner like the Cicada – unless it is re-equipped with a Lg Laser and Jump Capability I would not consider these ‘Mechs for my Striker.

Consider a mix of –

Jump
Phoenix Hawk; Griffin; Shadow Hawk (Kurita Variant);

Non-Jump
Ostroc
Get thee to Coventry … Now is the winter of our discontent, made glorious by this daughter of Tharkad … Our army shall march through. Well to New Avalon tonight.
Pages: 1
Extra information
1 registered and 62 anonymous users are browsing this forum.

Moderator:  Nic Jansma, Cray, Frabby, BobTheZombie 

Print Topic

Forum Permissions
      You cannot start new topics
      You cannot reply to topics
      HTML is enabled
      UBBCode is enabled

Topic views: 3496


Contact Admins Sarna.net