Karagin
07/27/02 12:41 PM
63.173.170.111
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Okay this is an older warship that I had ideas on paper as to what it would have and do...it may be munchy or it may not be. The concept probially doesn't fit BT's universe but what the hay it was fun to make. 
code:
Class/Model/Name: Dreadnaught A Goliath
Tech: Inner Sphere / 3100
Vessel Type: WarShip
Rules: Level 2, Standard design
Mass: 2,500,000 tons
Power Plant: Standard
Safe Thrust: 6
Maximum Thrust: 9
Armor Type: Lamellor Ferro-carbide
Armament:
2 Heavy N-Gauss
6 AR10 Launcher
60 Killer Whale Missiles
60 White Shark Missiles
60 Barracuda Missiles
8 Medium NPPC
8 Light NPPC
24 NL45
12 NAC/25
4 Medium N-Gauss
8 NL35
4 NAC/20
2 White Shark
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Class/Model/Name: Dreadnaught A Goliath
Mass: 2,500,000 tons
Equipment: Mass
Power Plant, Drive & Control: 900,000.00
Thrust: Safe Thrust: 6
Maximum Thrust: 9
Kearny-Fuchida Hyperdrive: Compact (Integrity = 47) 1,131,250.00
Lithium Fusion Battery 25,000.00
Jump Sail: (Integrity = 9) 155.00
Structural Integrity: 81 202,500.00
Total Heat Sinks: 2,765 Double 1,379.00
Fuel & Fuel Pumps: 26,686.00
Bridge, Controls, Computer & Attitude Thrusters: 6,250.00
Fire Control Computers: .00
Food & Water: (367 days supply) 5,494.00
Hyperpulse Generator: 50.00
Armor Type: Lamellor Ferro-carbide (2,046 total armor pts) 1,998.00
Capital Scale Armor Pts
Location: L / R
Fore: 341
Fore-Left/Right: 341/341
Aft-Left/Right: 341/341
Aft: 341
Cargo:
Bay 1: Fighters (12) with 2 doors 1,800.00
Small Craft (8) with 4 doors 1,600.00
Heavy Vehicles (51-100T) (16) with 4 doors 1,600.00
Battle Armor Points/Squads (36) with 6 doors 360.00
Infantry (foot) Platoons (36) with 6 doors 180.00
Infantry (jump) Platoons (36) with 6 doors 216.00
Bay 2: Cargo (1) with 1 door 4,705.00
DropShip Capacity: 10 Docking Hardpoints 10,000.00
Grav Decks #1 - 2: (95-meter diameter) 100.00
Grav Decks #3 - 4: (250-meter diameter) 200.00
Grav Decks #5 - 6: (250-meter diameter) 200.00
Life Boats: 15 (7 tons each) 105.00
Escape Pods: 10 (7 tons each) 70.00
Crew and Passengers:
125 Officers (107 minimum) 1,250.00
420 Crew (420 minimum) 2,940.00
78 Gunners (78 minimum) 546.00
200 Marines 1,000.00
2,172 Bay Personnel .00
Weapons and Equipment Loc SRV MRV LRV ERV Heat Mass
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1 Heavy N-Gauss (30 rounds)Nose 30 30 30 30 18 7,015.00
1 Heavy N-Gauss (30 rounds)Nose 30 30 30 30 18 7,015.00
2 AR10 (20 KW, 20 WS, 20 B)Nose * * * * 40 2,900.00
2 Medium NPPC FL/R 32 32 32 18 540 7,200.00
2 Light NPPC 420 5,600.00
2 AR10 (20 KW, 20 WS, 20 B)FL/R * * * * 80 5,800.00
2 NL45 FL/R 9 9 9 9 280 3,600.00
2 NAC/25 (100 rounds) FL/R 50 50 50 -- 340 12,120.00
6 NL45 L/RBS 27 27 27 27 840 10,800.00
2 Medium N-Gauss (60 roundsL/RBS 50 50 50 50 60 22,048.00
2 Light NPPC L/RBS 14 14 14 -- 420 5,600.00
2 Medium NPPC L/RBS 18 18 18 18 540 7,200.00
4 NL45 AL/R 25 25 25 18 560 7,200.00
2 NL35 208 2,800.00
2 NAC/25 (40 rounds) AL/R 50 50 50 -- 340 12,048.00
2 NAC/25 (40 rounds) AL/R 50 50 50 -- 340 12,048.00
4 NL35 Aft 14 14 14 -- 208 2,800.00
2 NAC/20 (40 rounds) Aft 40 40 40 -- 120 5,016.00
2 White Shark (20 msls) Aft 6 6 6 6 30 1,040.00
2 NAC/20 (40 rounds) Aft 40 40 40 -- 120 5,016.00
1 Lot Spare Parts (1.10%) 27,500.00
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
TOTALS: Heat: 5,522 2,500,000.00
Tons Left: .00
Calculated Factors:
Total Cost: 33,876,164,096 C-Bills
Battle Value: 278,124
Cost per BV: 121,802.38
Weapon Value: 188,342 (Ratio = .68)
Damage Factors: SRV = 7,645; MRV = 7,645; LRV = 6,023; ERV = 2,359
BattleForce2: Not applicable
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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NathanKell
07/28/02 12:18 PM
24.44.238.62
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Heh, on the first read-through I missed the thrust values. 
My comments on this are only general:
* Too little armor: always, always use max armor for the SI; and while 341/face is good for a cruiser--the Avalon, say--it's pretty thin for a battleship, let alone a DN. If you drop a couple thousand tons somewhere you can double your armor protection, which would give you about the right amount. Great job on maxing thresholds, though.
* Never ever use N-Gauss. They're worse than energy weapons; better to use twinned H-NPPCs to replace H-NGauss, if you want to maintain extreme range; otherwise go NAC. (NAC-30s are nice).
* Always use the largest weapons possible for each bay (there's no reason to use anything but NAC-30s, H-NPPCs, and NL/55s, except for the last weapon if you run out of mass). That will maximize what you can do under FCS limits.
* Steer clear of Capital Missiles; they're even worse than N-Gauss.
* This needs mucho AF weapons. You could easily double your firepower for a measly couple thousand tons, and you'd certainly need them for AF defense anyway.
Other than that, she looks nice indeed. A "Strike Dreadnaught", maybe. And the hilarity is that, without docking collars, she'll be incredibly cheap--probably only slightly more than a corvette with no collars!
-NathanKell, BT Space Wars
Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason, than that of blind-folded fear.
Thomas Jefferson |
Karagin
07/28/02 01:26 PM
65.129.167.4
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This may be better as it's own topic but why is everyone against the N-Gauss?
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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NathanKell
07/28/02 03:43 PM
24.44.238.62
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Here's why:
code:
Capital weapons table
Index no.Weapon Heat Fire factor Range Tons/shotTons Cost Ammo cost MPV FTR Dmg/Ton
1 NAC/10 30 100 16 0.2 2000 2000000 30000 2370 N 0.04956875
2 NAC/20 60 200 16 0.4 2500 5000000 60000 4740 N 0.07890169
3 NAC/25 85 250 14 0.6 3000 7500000 75000 6185 N 0.08197528
4 NAC/30 100 300 14 0.8 3500 10500000 90000 6200 N 0.08427913
5 NAC/35 120 350 12 1 4000 14000000 105000 6180 N 0.08595285
6 NAC/40 135 400 10 1.2 4500 18000000 120000 5885 N 0.08730003
7 NL/35 52 35 14 700 500000 583 N 0.04820937
8 NL/45 70 45 18 900 850000 1145 N 0.04812834
9 NL/55 85 55 20 1100 1250000 1565 N 0.04814004
10 Light NPPC 105 70 16 1400 20000 1675 N 0.04819277
11 Med NPPC 135 90 20 1800 3250000 2585 N 0.04819277
12 Hvy NPPC 225 150 20 3000 9050000 4275 N 0.04819277
13 Light N-Gauss 9 150 20 0.2 4500 20300000 45000 4041 N 0.03328230
14 Med N-Gauss 15 250 20 0.4 5500 30350000 75000 6735 N 0.04535312
15 Hvy N-Gauss 18 300 20 0.5 7000 50050000 90000 8085 N 0.04276550
16 Whale launcher 20 40 20 50 150 150000 400 1160 Y 0.05263158
17 Shark launcher 15 30 26 40 120 130000 350 1155 Y 0.04938272
18 B'cuda launcher 10 20 20 30 90 90000 267 690 Y 0.04395604
19 AR-10 15 30 40 250 250000 350 2360 Y 0.04067797
20 Whale missile 50 150000 0.00000000
21 Shark missile 40 130000 0.00000000
22 Barracuda missile 30 90000 0.00000000
23 Killer Whale-T 20 40 10 50 160 165000 340 1100 N 0.05194805
24 White Shark-T 15 30 10 40 140 145000 300 1050 N 0.04780876
25 Barracuda-T 10 20 10 30 100 100000 233 600 N 0.04301075
26 Kraken-T 50 100 10 100 220 500000 550 210 N 0.06920415
27 Screen launcher 2 2 50 1 10000 54000 31 Y 0.00000000
NB Range is given in Short Range (x2 for med, x3 for long).
D/T is figured as follows: damage / (tonnage + tonnage for 12 shots + heat/2)
-NathanKell, BT Space Wars
Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason, than that of blind-folded fear.
Thomas Jefferson |
NathanKell
07/28/02 03:55 PM
24.44.238.62
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So, going by that, it's better to have NPPCs that
1. Perform better
2. Require no ammo
3. Are cheaper
4. Require less maintenance
-NathanKell, BT Space Wars
Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason, than that of blind-folded fear.
Thomas Jefferson |
Cray
07/28/02 04:07 PM
12.91.115.99
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Good armor, great speed, lots of dropships, but with 1/3 the firepower of a Black Lion, you don't need to worry about a "munchy" label.
Mike Miller, Materials Engineer
Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
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Cray
07/28/02 04:12 PM
12.91.115.99
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The NGR sucks because of its awful damage-to-weight ratio.
Unlike mech-scale GRs, the heat aspect doesn't factor in. The heat sinks necessary to make any weapon "0 heat" is (at most) about 100 tons, which barely impacts the tonnage of naval weapons. HNPPCs are not mass efficient compared to NACs, but when you can get the same damage as a heavy NGR for less tonnage out of HNPPCs, you know the NGRs stink. Plus, NGRs (like NACs) have delays for their shots to arrive in orbital bombardment.
Mike Miller, Materials Engineer
Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
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Nightward
07/28/02 06:24 PM
132.234.251.211
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What's with all the AR-10s? I know you can spray out a heap of missiles, and different types of missiles, but no 'T'-Series missiles, which (at least to me) are the only worthwhile type of Naval Missiles available. Wouldn't you be better off with larger anti-fighter bays or more Capital Weapons?
Yea, verily. Let it be known far and wide that Nightward loathes MW: DA. Indeed, it is with the BURNING ANIMUS OF A THOUSAND SUNS that he doth rage against it with.
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Karagin
07/28/02 06:26 PM
65.129.166.65
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The AR10s give more bang for the buck...
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Nightward
07/28/02 06:29 PM
132.234.251.211
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*Shrug*
I guess everyone's got their own design philosophies.
Yea, verily. Let it be known far and wide that Nightward loathes MW: DA. Indeed, it is with the BURNING ANIMUS OF A THOUSAND SUNS that he doth rage against it with.
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Karagin
07/28/02 06:37 PM
65.129.166.65
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One launcher 3 types of ammo to me means more overall power projection then one single missile type wheaher or not one type is Guided...
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Nightward
07/28/02 06:45 PM
132.234.251.211
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I know. I just prefer T-Series because you get another go at hitting your target with them, so if I do mount Naval Missiles, I pick T-Series.
The other down side for the Naval Missiles is that they can be bought down by Point-Defence weapons. Granted, no ship would ever be able to swat down 60 missiles in one turn, but it is a serious concern for vessels that mount more sane numbers of Naval Missiles.
Personally, I prefer banks of anti-fighter weapons to Naval Missiles. I tend to focus on Naval PPCs and the larger-bore Naval Auto Cannon (-30s and -40s) when I buils my designs. But that's just me.
Yea, verily. Let it be known far and wide that Nightward loathes MW: DA. Indeed, it is with the BURNING ANIMUS OF A THOUSAND SUNS that he doth rage against it with.
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NathanKell
07/28/02 10:42 PM
24.44.238.62
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Actually, bringing down 60 missiles isn't *that* hard...add up all the Small Pulse, AMS, Small Lasers, MGs, Flamers, etc., divide by 2, subtract from the missiles' fire factors. So you'd need: 2400pts of damage to bring down 60 BCs, 3600pts for WSs, and 4800pts for KWs.
Well, OK, probably no book design could do that...
And regarding Teles: my main gripe--and this is what makes them IMO worthless except as hidden mines--is the absolutely crushing TN modifiers for thrust. Unless you plan to guess, a turn ahead, where the enemy will be to the very hex, or use them at really short range, they can't hit a McKenna-sized barn!
-NathanKell, BT Space Wars
Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason, than that of blind-folded fear.
Thomas Jefferson |
Nightward
07/29/02 12:53 AM
132.234.251.211
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Perhaps not, but seeing as there is no limit to the amount of Teleoperated missiles that can be controlled at once, a WarShip armed with banks of T-Series launchers would be a terror to face. Imagine...
"OK. This turn I move my 18 billion Kraken T's into the hex with your Unstoppable Warship of Ultimate Doom..."
(Three hours later...)
"And now, I roll to hit with my 18 billion Kraken-T's."
(At this point, the player's opponent breaks down, gibbering, and beats their opponent to death with a rolled-up copy of AT2.)
Yea, verily. Let it be known far and wide that Nightward loathes MW: DA. Indeed, it is with the BURNING ANIMUS OF A THOUSAND SUNS that he doth rage against it with.
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Karagin
07/29/02 04:32 PM
65.133.242.49
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Is this before or after your oppeant has rolled his point defense against missiles?
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Nightward
07/29/02 05:35 PM
132.234.251.211
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Unless your opponent has built a 2.5 million ton WarShip that goes 1/2 and is packed out with Clan ER Small Lasers, I think most of those missiles are going to get through 
Yea, verily. Let it be known far and wide that Nightward loathes MW: DA. Indeed, it is with the BURNING ANIMUS OF A THOUSAND SUNS that he doth rage against it with.
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Hurlbut
08/04/02 04:50 PM
198.68.152.174
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Could not the capital missiles or more specifically the Teloperated capital missiles could be target by bigger weapons than the small lasers and AMS?
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Karagin
10/29/05 11:19 PM
24.243.178.223
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Okay round two.
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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