Akirapryde2006
10/13/15 04:04 PM
71.100.132.249
|
I have run in to a problem with my math and need help from the powers to be.
I don't own the Strategic Operations Source Book so I am forced to use the Battlespace rules.
On page 73 "Determine Propulsion" I am trying to work on my two warships designs.
I want to refine my Aegis II Class Fast Attack Cruiser and I am working on my new Darkwing Class surveillance warship (a Bugeye Replacement).
So here is my problem, because there is not formula listed, I am finding that I am only getting the same answers half the time. So I am hoping that I can get some help with the formula to determine size of my engine based on desired speed and size of the ship.
Next issue is the Sub-Compact K-F Drive
So in the Battlespace book, the Sub-Compact K-F Drive is not listed.
So should I build my Darkwing using the Sub-Compact Drive or should I use the rules within the Battlespace system?
Here is some background on the Darkwing. The project began in the early 3050's with the prototype making its first test in early 3055.
Cray, you seem to be the go to man on this. Could you please led your experience on this.
|
Cray
10/13/15 05:58 PM
72.189.109.30
|
Quote:
Akirapryde2006 writes:
I want to refine my Aegis II Class Fast Attack Cruiser and I am working on my new Darkwing Class surveillance warship (a Bugeye Replacement).
So here is my problem, because there is not formula listed, I am finding that I am only getting the same answers half the time. So I am hoping that I can get some help with the formula to determine size of my engine based on desired speed and size of the ship.
Nitpick: thrust, not speed. Spacecraft don't move like ground units.
For WarShips, the engine is 6% of ship's mass per thrust point. This also applies to conventional JumpShips and space stations, but they're limited to 0.2 thrust points.
DropShips and small craft use 6.5% (Inner Sphere) and 6.1% (Clan).
WarShip compact KF cores are 45.25% of the ship's mass, incidentally, while standard cores are 95%.
Quote:
Next issue is the Sub-Compact K-F Drive
So in the Battlespace book, the Sub-Compact K-F Drive is not listed.
It wasn't published until TacOps. It's exactly 50% of the ship's mass and can't mount docking collars. Tonnage range for such a subcompact core ship is 5,000 to 25,000 tons.
Quote:
So should I build my Darkwing using the Sub-Compact Drive or should I use the rules within the Battlespace system?
BattleSpace is about 15 years gone, but it's close enough to AT2-Revised and StratOps that adaptations aren't hard. I'd use the subcompact core.
Quote:
Here is some background on the Darkwing. The project began in the early 3050's with the prototype making its first test in early 3055.
If you're sticking rigidly to canon, the subcompact core is a late 3060s item for the Inner Sphere that required input from Clan scientists. The Clans could build them at any time, but didn't bother - they didn't have much interest in BugEye-type units.
Mike Miller, Materials Engineer
Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
|
Akirapryde2006
10/13/15 06:27 PM
71.100.132.249
|
Quote:
Cray writes:
Nitpick: thrust, not speed. Spacecraft don't move like ground units.
For WarShips, the engine is 6% of ship's mass per thrust point. This also applies to conventional JumpShips and space stations, but they're limited to 0.2 thrust points.
DropShips and small craft use 6.5% (Inner Sphere) and 6.1% (Clan).
WarShip compact KF cores are 45.25% of the ship's mass, incidentally, while standard cores are 95%.
Cray thank you for answering my call for help.
So let me make sure I get this straight. My Aegis II (tonnage = 865,000) has a safe thrust of 4.
So the formula is (6% * 4)ships mass?
So this would be .06 * 4 = .24 of my ship's mass or 207,600 Tons.
Is this correct?
|
Cray
10/14/15 06:53 PM
72.189.109.30
|
Quote:
Akirapryde2006 writes:
So this would be .06 * 4 = .24 of my ship's mass or 207,600 Tons.
Is this correct?
Yep.
Mike Miller, Materials Engineer
Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
|
Akirapryde2006
10/16/15 08:07 PM
71.100.132.249
|
Okay, Cray I did it.
Even though I hate....(and I mean it, hate) the story arc of the Jihad and the Dark Ages, I went out and bought the Battletech Strategic Operation PDF at DriveThruRPG.com.
So I spent most of my day reading over the construction rules. I already see where I need to make some changes. But I wanted to ask, did you have your hand in this creation? The reason why I am asking is cause I think I can see your writing style within the description of warships, roles of warships and why states build them.
Now that I have this book, I can no longer claim ignorance. So I have a few new (revised) rules that I have to look at before posting again. Like armor and the free armor added for SI.
But my first impression is, the book looks good. I love the formulas and detailed examples and explanations that you guys added. Thanks for the time you have taken to help me understand. I look forward to having my ship ready to meet the revised standards of Strategic Operations.
Akira
Edited by Akirapryde2006 (10/16/15 09:12 PM)
|
Akirapryde2006
10/16/15 09:58 PM
71.100.132.249
|
Okay Cray, I need some help on this whole Fire Control Tonnage.
Here is what I am looking at.
Nose Arc:
Total Weapon Tonnage: 10,395 (4 Capital weapons @ 10,200 Total, 40 Non-Capital weapons @ 195)
44 Total Weapons 44 / 20 = 2.2 (Round Down to 2)
Formula: 1039.5 (.1 of 10,395) * 2 = 2,079
Fire Control Weight: 2,079 Tons
This doesn't make any sense to me. It is my Anti-Fighter Bays that is driving up the number past the limits. But I am being made to pay for this in my Capital Bays as well. This is just one of my firing arcs and already that counts as a major chunk of weight.
Can you please explain the logic behind this rule. Or does this rule only apply to weapons that exceed the limit. Meaning 24 of my Non-Capital Weapons?
Here is the rule from the Strategic Operations Source Book, Page 155
"Fire Control Systems: Advanced aerospace units have the option of exceeding their listed maximum of weapons per arc, at the designer’s option, but if they do so, additional fi re control systems and power distribution systems will need to be installed. To determine the weight of these systems, divide the number of weapons mounted in any firing arc that exceeds its weapon limits (12 for JumpShips, 20 for Space Stations and WarShips) by the limit value, and round the result down to the nearest whole number. Multiply this result by 0.1 times the total weight of all weapons mounted in that arc (discounting ammunition), and round the final result up to the nearest half. This is the final weight of any expanded fire control and power systems the unit requires for such weaponry."
Akira
|
Cray
10/16/15 11:01 PM
72.189.109.30
|
Quote:
Akirapryde2006 writes:
But I wanted to ask, did you have your hand in this creation? The reason why I am asking is cause I think I can see your writing style within the description of warships, roles of warships and why states build them.
For Strategic Operations, I wrote the fluff chapters "Aerospace Technologies" (pp. 122 - 141) and "Aerospace Operations" (pp. 244 - 258). I had a lot to contribute in the "High Speed Closing Engagements," which might simplify your aerospace invasion of a planet. Other than that, I was mostly a reviewer and nitpicker.
The aerospace operations chapter had originally been slated for fluff in the Tactical Operations book (see the opening lines on p. 122 about "second half of the lecture"), but TacOps ran a wee bit over word count and big chunks of the book got shoved over to Strategic Operations. About half that chapter was left in TacOps, where I covered support vehicles.
Quote:
But my first impression is, the book looks good. I love the formulas and detailed examples and explanations that you guys added.
The writers for the new core books also spent a lot of time answering player questions on the official BT forums. Examples were deemed critical to all design sections.
Note that if you don't have them already, you might find yourself needing Tech Manual and (less important) Tactical Operations for some of the gear used by WarShips, like their weapons. However, BattleSpace's weapon charts should plug a lot of the blanks. Actually, Battlespace and other, older publications will probably fill any questions that StratOps doesn't cover.
Before designing your ship, you might want to look into StratOps' advanced aerospace combat chapter for:
1) Anti-aerospace capital laser targeting mode
2) Bracketing fire mode
3) Capital missile bearings-only and preprogrammed waypoint launches
They give some new life to small capital weapons.
Mike Miller, Materials Engineer
Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
|
Akirapryde2006
10/17/15 09:50 AM
71.100.132.249
|
Quote:
Cray writes:
For Strategic Operations, I wrote the fluff chapters "Aerospace Technologies" (pp. 122 - 141) and "Aerospace Operations" (pp. 244 - 258). I had a lot to contribute in the "High Speed Closing Engagements," which might simplify your aerospace invasion of a planet. Other than that, I was mostly a reviewer and nitpicker.
The aerospace operations chapter had originally been slated for fluff in the Tactical Operations book (see the opening lines on p. 122 about "second half of the lecture"), but TacOps ran a wee bit over word count and big chunks of the book got shoved over to Strategic Operations. About half that chapter was left in TacOps, where I covered support vehicles.
Yeah I thought so. As I was reading "BATTLESHIPS, HEAVY CRUISERS AND CORVETTES, OH MY" on page 128, I just felt like it was your writing style. I could be wrong, but I really thought it was you.
Quote:
Cray writes:
Note that if you don't have them already, you might find yourself needing Tech Manual and (less important) Tactical Operations for some of the gear used by WarShips, like their weapons.
Yeah I am starting to see that. It sucks that you have to buy multiple books to get what you want done, but it is the way of the industry right now.
Still, there are rules that I just don't understand (like the Additional Fire Control Over 20 Rule). Nonetheless I would still recommend it.
Akira
|
|
|
Extra information
|
0 registered and 38 anonymous users are browsing this forum.
Moderator: Nic Jansma, Cray, Frabby, BobTheZombie
Print Topic
|
Forum Permissions
You cannot start new topics
You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled
UBBCode is enabled
|
Topic views: 5296
|
|
|
|
|
|
|