Requiem
08/01/18 06:12 AM
58.175.193.140
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In December 3080 with the defeat of the Word of Blake negotiations between the leaders of the major powers from the Inner Sphere and Periphery (with the exception of the Capellan Confederation and the Magistracy of Canopus) gathered on Terra to discuss the formation of a new buffer state between the various Inner Sphere powers and the remains of the protectorate. There they reached a basic agreement that ceded the remains of the Word of Blake Protectorate into a new realm, the Republic of the Sphere, under Devlin Stone.
However, the period of conflict of WOB Jihad War was from 3067-80/1. Thirteen years, thereabout, so why would the major powers allow the creation of The Republic of the Inner Sphere?
Had these worlds people become so militant to returning to their former House State that it was decided it would be more prudent to just “cut them adrift” under the banner of a new state?
Or was it something else?
For, as we discover half a century later, the old loyalties to their former House Lords never died – they were just buried for a time – with the Fall of the HPG in 3132 we see these factions once more returning to the fore and a desire by some of the people to return to their former states.
Can we thus say that for a border world and that of the people on that world that the annexation of their world by another Great House was seen as an almost normal occurrence, thus when they are reconquered these people ‘just took it all in their stride’ as it were?
But when ceded to a newly created power they took this an affront to their dignity – thus the first chance they received to return to their former Great House, did many willingly conspired to ensure this would take occur?
Thus cold it be said that the great experiment of the Republic of the Sphere could be said to contain many fractures that run deeply throughout its society?
So with this new realm that contains citizens from all the great houses, will they go along the same route as the Clans Pentagon Worlds and fracture back into their previous allegiances and also self- disintegrate into an orgy of wanton destruction that is a Civil War?
So will ‘fortress Republic’ just be delaying the inevitable?
Get thee to Coventry … Now is the winter of our discontent, made glorious by this daughter of Tharkad … Our army shall march through. Well to New Avalon tonight.
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ghostrider
08/01/18 04:37 PM
66.74.61.223
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Don't ask questions you don't really want the answer to.
This is not about alt history, so saying it won't be that way, will not be accepted.
With that said, the entire game is set up to have a continuous war going on. This was the way to break down the larger houses and start fighting to bring the others back into the houses. Which means more war.
Those worlds given over to the Republic may well have wanted to have peace on their worlds. With a new 'house', they may well get it. This is along the same lines as the clans move.
As you pointed out thirteen years of war may well be enough to get those worlds and their populations to want to join a new nation that can stop them from being ground zero.
And the question in the topic statement.
That is true for all of the plot lines.
Again. No war means not books being sold.
So the developers do as they feel to keep the money rolling in.
If someone doesn't like it, then they stop buying the books.
But for the masses, it really isn't important on how or why. They just want new things to take out and blow up.
I do share the annoyance on how some things just magically pop out the behind. And using the faulty logic to prevent some things, is used to defend the stupid things that do come out.
But then the only people that will change this are on the official board. And I doubt many will give someone the time of day if they say their plots are full of holes.
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Cray
08/01/18 05:53 PM
97.101.136.19
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Quote:
Had these worlds people become so militant to returning to their former House State that it was decided it would be more prudent to just “cut them adrift” under the banner of a new state?
Basically. The Inner Sphere had trashed its core in about 6 major wars in a 300-year period. That core had been the all-powerful metropole of the Inner Sphere, the Terran Hegemony, and it was crushed, looted, and ravaged by the Inner Sphere time and again. Many worlds joined the Blake Protectorate not because they were excited Blakists' tales of worshipping toasters, but because they liked the words of Terran merchants and diplomats about recreating a new Hegemony. One Jihad later, and they were more determined than ever to be rid of the Houses.
JHS:Terra's "Touring Terra" chapter goes into depth on why the Protectorate's "liberators" were not terribly welcome after they got done liberating the **** out of those core worlds.
Quote:
For, as we discover half a century later, the old loyalties to their former House Lords never died – they were just buried for a time – with the Fall of the HPG in 3132 we see these factions once more returning to the fore and a desire by some of the people to return to their former states.
Whoa, that's way too general. There are some key factors met by most Republic planets interested in returning to a House in the 3130s:
1) It had to be one of the border worlds of the Hegemony that had received substantial House immigration during the Succession Wars, and
2) It had to be subject to the Republic's population resettlements that created large political monocultures
Even when these conditions were met, the charges to join a House tended to be led by small political groups who had the most 'Mechs.
And the Hegemony core still wanted nothing to do with the Houses in the 3130s. They retreated into the Fortress Republic.
Mike Miller, Materials Engineer
Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
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Karagin
08/01/18 07:36 PM
72.176.187.91
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The part that I think was the doom to failure was the silliness about mechs to plowshares idea. And the setup seems to be well, less then particular to being a self supporting system, hey you have XYZ number of worlds, oh crap things went south let's cut our loses and abandon Pro-Terran worlds and just give away territory, yeah uhmm it doesn't work like that, but again that comes down to lazy writing to borrow a phrase from a certain movie.
Stone wasn't the messiah he was painted as, and in fact the ROTS (nice name, kind of like some one really like to play on the Star Wars movie names) kind of tells you all you need to know...Republic of the Sphere...
I do believe back oh back in 2004 or 2005 we had this similar chat about the ROTS and the impractical nature of it's existence and why it would not work. Guess it's not me this time beating a dead horse to death...
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Requiem
08/01/18 08:24 PM
58.175.193.140
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Can I then ask - In the future will there be more Katana Tormarks - she refused her knighthood formed the Dragon’s Fury and went about attempting to returning traditionally Drconinian worlds to the Combine.
Could we see even more Lyrans, Mariks, Davions and Liaoists attempting the same thing to the point they (the Republic) cannot stand or do you think that will Clan Wolf smell weakness and attack?
Get thee to Coventry … Now is the winter of our discontent, made glorious by this daughter of Tharkad … Our army shall march through. Well to New Avalon tonight.
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Karagin
08/01/18 10:01 PM
72.176.187.91
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That is stuff the current novels should be either explaining or the Shattered Fortress or the ilClan sourcebooks should be giving us that info. However, if things run the way they do we won't get straight answers, since doing that would be like saying the whole Jihad was not the plot line/story line they thought it would be and split the fandom, but again the future is not set in stone (no pun) maybe this time they will give us answers verses silly drawn out teasing.
I would say that more fighting is what makes the game fun, and if they combine a good story line with a damn good marketing push, then we might see the game back in stores and books on shelves at the local hobby stores and folks actually playing the game which in turn would generate more interest which means more income and thus more product, but we need a good storyline that sells, not repeats the same old same old. So no I don't see another Star League or similar, I think we will see powers die off and be removed for good.
And for some that will a hard thing to handle, but at the same time it could be a good thing, since it would make logical sense even for the Battletech Universe. So my theory, one house dies fighting to stop a major push by the Clans, and another fragments into five or so smaller powers, with one remaining whole but unable to do anything about changes and one being able to take some advantages but off set by major internal issues that won't allow them to be the power house that they want to be.
Also I predict we will mercenary units making a larger come back, thus allowing for things like a reborn Dragoons, smaller and leaner but back to their pre-Clan Invasion setting of trying to play kingmaker. I also think we will see things push toward better tech but not on the scale of everything goes, but more focused on things like better interstellar communication and better jumpships and the new enemy will not be just an old one, but a mix of old and new, with the same goal one House in control of the know Sphere but also with something more then that tired and over used trope.
Then again anything could happen, but the ROTS will more then likely be one of the dead states when all is said and done.
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Requiem
08/02/18 02:44 AM
58.175.193.140
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Interesting prediction,
As for my prediction, a short term war ….
For me the lynch-pin is Alaric, Khan of Clan Wolf – child of Katherine Steiner-Davion.
In being rejected as Archon I would assume he would want to vent a little and expandhis little empire ….given their proximity …
Target 1: The Republic; or
Target 2: The Free Wolds League;
And in all fairness I think he will invade ‘The Fortress Republic”
Given that the Draconis Combine and the Federated Suns are otherwise engaged at this time they will be unable to assist the Repubulic.
So that leaves the Lyrans, Free Worlds League and the Capellan Confederation at the wild Cards.
The Capellens – they would use the war as an excuse to reclaim lost worlds that are traditionally Cappelan in their ancestry.
The Free Wolds League – during the reunification of the FWL the Lyran Commonwealth successfully conquered a large portion of the League’s coreward border – time to get it back whilst everyone is distracted?
And the Lyrans – why would they help the Republic? Though killing off a possible claimant to throne might be the only reason you need and to extinguish he Wolf’s empire once and for all – so coming in on the Republics side might not be a stretch of the imagination.
Get thee to Coventry … Now is the winter of our discontent, made glorious by this daughter of Tharkad … Our army shall march through. Well to New Avalon tonight.
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ghostrider
08/02/18 04:43 PM
66.74.61.223
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I would think that idea is a bit faulty.
Being rejected for Archon, he would attack the FWL or Republic?
How about attacking the Lyran Alliance, and pay back those that denied him is 'birth right'?
Take it by force. Or did something else happen to human nature?
Being brought up as a crusader wolf, he would have the concept of being able to wipe out all opposition to his claim. Thus the same arrogance the crusaders had when the entered the IS in the first place.
Then add Katherine's ego, that she should have ruled the FC until she died of old age, should play a part in this decision. Not that he might care for her, but it is his destiny.
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Requiem
08/03/18 03:35 AM
58.175.193.140
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However, 17 July 3143 Alaric’s forces engaged the LCAF within Tharkad City, including the Jade Falcons on other areas of of the planet, in which the then Archon Melissa Steiner was murdered by elementals. Rather than pursue his claim to the throne he returned to the Wolf Empire.
So why return for a second time?
No – like all wolves he would be seeking new kills
However the LCAF / Kell Hounds would want revenge would they not?
So I still predict Alaric invading the Republic with the LCAF / Kell Hounds hot on his heals.
Get thee to Coventry … Now is the winter of our discontent, made glorious by this daughter of Tharkad … Our army shall march through. Well to New Avalon tonight.
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Requiem
08/13/18 08:11 AM
58.175.193.140
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The Republic of the Sphere can be considered to be a failure due to good intentions and an incorrect establishment of how to govern.
First Good intention – The ending of factionalism – This Social Program was entitled the Resettlement Act of 3085. Its aim to mix the variety of cultures that existed within the Republic.
That is the Governments forced relocation of people from their home to another location in an effort to make the Republic a more “multicultural” State.
So how would anyone feel if they were told to leave their home of many years, leave their friends and everything they loved to go live some-where else with a bunch of complete strangers from different Houses?
However removing a person’s old allegiance to their former House to that of a new allegiance with the Republic takes multiple generations – three to four not the one we find by 3150 – thus we can assume many of the old allegiances are still there, even in the children who grew up within the Republic (due to either their Parents or Grand-Parents influence)
So, this can be seen only as the beginning of a dictatorial Government by some of the new Republicans.
Second Good Intention - The Military Material Redemption Program – decommissioning Battlemechs – and the retooling of the military industrial complex into commercial.
When families have served states for generations and there has been a family Battlemech that has been passed down through the generations that represents your families honour and is the families main financial investment (multi million investment) How would you take it when you are told to melt it down?
How would a family react when presented with such an edict? Go into exile with the Family ‘Mech? .....
Also when all the realms around you believe in ‘Peace through Military Dominance’ the removal of a large standing army can only be considered to be quite naive.
And again this can only be considered to be an edict by a dictatorial Government.
Then let us consider the Government itself,
The Republic is controlled by Exarch – who is voted in for a four year term from one of the 17 Paladins (who are mostly military personnel)
And to become a Paladin you must work your way through by ‘first becoming a Knight’ and working your way to becoming a Paladin, and again the majority of which are military personnel.
Then there is the Senate – The Republic is broken down into ten Prefectures – each prefecture is allowed either two or three Senators per Prefecture based upon each Prefectures size.
Thus we have a vast number of people and worlds controlled and Governed with a few number of people (giving these people tremendous amount of power within their Prefecture)
So we have the same problem as before in that of the feudal system - the military elite controlling everyone.
From here on the similarities between the Republic of the Sphere and that of the Roman Republic / Julius Caesar / Rome become eerily similar …
We have an Exarch – Military Commander over all (Caesar in all but Name)
His Paladins and Knights – (that should be renamed as the Praetorian Guard).
The Republic Senate is the Senate of Rome.
Caesar – Dictator for life and in control of the “Roman Republic”.
3134 The senate begins a long term plan to groom young warriors in effort to improve their chances of being chosen as a Knight of the Sphere, thus setting them on the path toward ‘Paladin-ship’ and eligibility to be elected as Exarch. Thus controlling the Exarch as their puppet.
Caesar – The Senate of Rome is used to having someone in the position of dictator as this is quite normal. However the “for life” part caused great dissention – to the point they dreamed of the Old Republic (A democracy controlled by the Elite Families of Rome) – Thus they hatched their plans to do away with Caesar and restore the Republic.
The Republic Senate want to exercise their control over the highest office in the land – thus it could be considered that their ultimate goal was that of a true democracy and doing away with having a military overlord.
However the senate’s plot is dissolved, they refuse to submit to an external review of its members. A battle ensures between Senate Backed –troops on Terra, in which the senate coalition forces are defeated by Republic Troops working with FS troops – Prompting a majority of the senators to flee.
Caesar – Julius is assassinated – Mark Antony inflames the mob – The Senators flee and civil war ensures.
At this time we also have both House Liao and House Kurita launching attacks to reclaim lost worlds
The Formation of the Fortress of the Republic is initiated within Prefecture X.
Thus again a realm is brought to its knees by internal strife caused by a lack of power sharing and a lack of advancement towards the top job because a few exclude the majority
(It could logically be described that a ‘military guild’ in all but name has control over executive branch of the government)
If it had only been established so that the senate was one world one senator and each senator had the chance of also becoming the Exarch as well as in addition to that of the Knights and Paladins this could well have been avoided.
But due to the exclusivity of appointing the Exarch from the Paladins the Republic of the Sphere could fall.
Get thee to Coventry … Now is the winter of our discontent, made glorious by this daughter of Tharkad … Our army shall march through. Well to New Avalon tonight.
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