Hellbringer
02/13/02 11:26 PM
192.195.234.26
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Not nose...anus
"But it SHOULD be a spectacle! It should be grand and exciting to us all! I'd hate to think that we've become so jaded that we find even our greatest tiumph, resurrecting the Star League, simply one more obligation."
-General Victor Steiner-Davion (First Prince and Archon in exile) 3064
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KamikazeJohnson
02/13/02 11:33 PM
209.202.47.12
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I suppose...more effective, but harder to reach when everyone's sitting...
Peace is that glorious moment in history when everyone stands around reloading.
--Thomas Jefferson
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Karagin
02/14/02 11:42 AM
63.173.170.206
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Once again, to clear something up, I didn't acusse him of anything until seeing what he did and HOW he acted.
IF it was a mistake, then why did he leave?
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Karagin
02/14/02 11:43 AM
63.173.170.206
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Sure if you say so...it was clear to me what Bob said.
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Karagin
02/14/02 11:44 AM
63.173.170.206
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I see, thank you for telling me that.
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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BA_Evans
02/14/02 12:31 PM
65.194.182.3
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There's no reason to bring a real weapon into the game.
BA Evans
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Cray
02/14/02 12:51 PM
204.245.128.3
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>IF it was a mistake, then why did he leave?
Because of the arguing and blunt accusations, probably.
Mike Miller, Materials Engineer
Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
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Cray
02/14/02 12:58 PM
204.245.128.3
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Feh. Does no one here recognize a joke when they see it?
And yes, there is a reason to bring a weapon to the game: to clean it and talk about a planned excursion to the gun range the day after the gaming session. Oddly, the GM seemed inclined to give out more karma and nuyen to our host, who was polishing that Winchester.
Now that I start to think about this, there seem to be a lot of good reasons to bring a weapon into the game. For example:
To intimidate any Afghani terrorists lurking outside - let them know you are one group of BT players who are not to be trifled with.
Guns are also good for procuring beer, chips and salsa from the convenience store if you're tight on cash. Though, wait, that's not necessarily taking the weapon into the game, more like using it on the food break.
They sceer off the lynch mobs of Bible thumpers with the nooses and torches real well, too. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'll stop sacrificing your pets to Demogorgon when I'm good and ready.
I'm sure you can think of a few good reasons, too.
Mike Miller, Materials Engineer
Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
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Karagin
02/14/02 01:14 PM
63.173.170.181
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Maybe, but seeing how he was sitting there claiming he didnt make a mistake, or do anything wrong was not helping the things any either.
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Greyslayer
02/14/02 01:51 PM
137.172.211.9
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Or just maybe he was sick and tired of how much Karagin kept going on and on and on and on ....ZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz ....  .
Greyslayer
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Cray
02/14/02 01:51 PM
204.245.128.3
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No it wasn't. That's where "being the better man" comes into play. You put with the fact he's lying to your face in order to preserve the game, correct the mistake, and get back to having fun.
Mike Miller, Materials Engineer
Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
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Bob_Richter
02/14/02 07:20 PM
134.121.247.162
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Weapons certainly have no place at a LARP.
But other forms of RPG are safe with weapons around.
-Bob (The Magnificent) Richter
Assertions made in this post are the humble opinion of Bob.
They are not necessarily statements of fact or decrees from God Himself, unless explicitly and seriously stated to be so.
:)
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Bob_Richter
02/14/02 07:21 PM
134.121.247.162
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What game?
Asking an offending person to leave your house is not a game.
Besides, cheap Pakistani swords aren't *real* weapons. 
-Bob (The Magnificent) Richter
Assertions made in this post are the humble opinion of Bob.
They are not necessarily statements of fact or decrees from God Himself, unless explicitly and seriously stated to be so.
:)
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Bob_Richter
02/14/02 07:24 PM
134.121.247.162
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It is clear from your response that it was not. I appreciate Bansee's clarification, as should you.
-Bob (The Magnificent) Richter
Assertions made in this post are the humble opinion of Bob.
They are not necessarily statements of fact or decrees from God Himself, unless explicitly and seriously stated to be so.
:)
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Bob_Richter
02/14/02 07:26 PM
134.121.247.162
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My thumb points out into space, as a general rule.
On the other hand, I don't point much, so this could just be ineptitude.
-Bob (The Magnificent) Richter
Assertions made in this post are the humble opinion of Bob.
They are not necessarily statements of fact or decrees from God Himself, unless explicitly and seriously stated to be so.
:)
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Karagin
02/19/02 12:31 AM
63.173.170.79
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Sorry I will not play a game with some one who cheats. A mistake is something that is made out of lack of knowing the rules, or confusion during the excitement of the event.
What this person did was flat out cheating, not a mistake.
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Cray
02/22/02 03:03 PM
204.245.128.3
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>Sorry I will not play a game with some one who cheats. A mistake is something that is made out of lack of knowing the rules, or confusion during the excitement of the event
Feh. Silly reason to not play with someone. Let bygones be bygones and watch the guy like a hawk next time. T
Mike Miller, Materials Engineer
Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
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Nightward
02/24/02 09:11 PM
132.234.1.13
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Well, this sort of thing happens regularly at tournaments. Everyone willo, at least once during the competion, mark of damage to the wrong 'Mech or location or whatever else. Generally, the player who made the mistake will be gracious enough to correct it. If they don't...well, talk to the ref (if there is one). Otherwise, agree to roll dice; the highest roll wins and is considered correct. Fate favours the righteous 99.99999% of the time.
If they are not amenable to either option, there's not a lot you can do except argue. And that won't get you anywhere, so why bother?
Yea, verily. Let it be known far and wide that Nightward loathes MW: DA. Indeed, it is with the BURNING ANIMUS OF A THOUSAND SUNS that he doth rage against it with.
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Karagin
02/25/02 08:29 AM
63.173.170.137
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Why waste my time or anyone elses with watching someone like a hawk when the rest of us can have fun WITHOUT the bother of having to babysit a cheater?
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Cray
02/25/02 08:56 AM
204.245.128.3
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I'm not sure I see the point of that objection. The entire game is set up for cross-checking. You're supposedly allowed to look at anyone's record sheet at anytime, and I figured people do so frequently. I mean, in my games, people on all sides of the fight help out with calculations, dice rolls and whatnot. "Babysitting" is unavoidable.
It just seems you're handling this in a very immature fashion.
Mike Miller, Materials Engineer
Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
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Karagin
02/25/02 09:28 AM
63.173.170.137
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Imature? I see so playing with some one who cheats is better then not playing the game with them, yes I follow this logic.
Sorry but I think it is you who are missing the point, the chance was there for the person to fix the mistake, he CLAIMED he didn't make any mistake with the damage, the math shows other wise.
As for babysitting, no one in the group I play with does that during a game, we turst each other enough to not have to do that, and we give the benifit of the doubt to those that join us from outside, UNTIL they do something to cause that benifit to go away as this guy did. Cross-checking to tell someone your side is now taking damage is more of curisity then babysitting, I don't have to walk folks through die rolls or each time they go to move explain all their options to them. Nope sorry given the experience of all the players that night, babysitting shouldn't have been an issue. If someone was a new player sure then it MIGHT be an issue, BUT not for the whole group.
If he had taken the out his teammates were giving him, and corrected the damage then it wouldn't have been a problem, but given that he stated loudly that no damage was tranfered in side when the armor on the Victor's torso was down to a mere one or two points from other two hits, it is very clear that he cheated for the simple reason he wanted to.
And yet you are telling me that you would not have cared? No matter what he said or did you still would have wanted to play with this guy in the game KNOWING that he is cheating?
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Cray
02/25/02 11:33 AM
204.245.128.3
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>Imature? I see so playing with some one who cheats is better then not playing the game with them
I can pretty much rest my case here.
>And yet you are telling me that you would not have cared?
No. You're beginning to misinterpret someone else's words again. Be careful.
>No matter what he said or did you still would have wanted to play with this guy in the game KNOWING that he is cheating?
No matter what he did? There's limits, of course, but for someone to fudge some armor loss and then deny cheating when confronted is well under those limits, so long as he fixes the error. Both were human reactions. Not good ones, but forgivable.
Mike Miller, Materials Engineer
Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
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Karagin
02/25/02 12:59 PM
63.173.170.92
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SO you would play with a person who openly cheats, well I am glad to hear that you would do this. Most won't.
Now to address your other points:
No misinterpation, you made it clear, YOU will play with some who cheats just as long as they correct the cheating and called it a mistake. Yes that is very clear to me.
The last part, HE would not admit to double marking the damage, nor would he take the out given by his teammates and redo the damage and he made it very clear to all that there was no internal damage when the facts said other wise. So have I made it clear enough for you to see the problem?
Yes or No? If not let me try again:
He would not change the damage from the way he marked it, NOR, would he admit he cheated. When asked by his teammates to fix the mistake as they were calling it he said No.
Now if I follow your thinking here we should have gone ahead and let him keep playing know that he was cheating...some how I don't see how that helps things or even corrects the problem.
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Bob_Richter
02/25/02 01:01 PM
134.121.247.162
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>>>He would not change the damage from the way he marked it, NOR, would he admit he cheated. When asked by his teammates to fix the mistake as they were calling it he said No. <<<
You're just laying it on thicker and heavier as you go, aren't you?
You never said this before, and it's kind of important, though I rather suspect now that you're making the whole thing up for some bizarre reason.
-Bob (The Magnificent) Richter
Assertions made in this post are the humble opinion of Bob.
They are not necessarily statements of fact or decrees from God Himself, unless explicitly and seriously stated to be so.
:)
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Karagin
02/25/02 01:44 PM
63.173.170.78
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You know if you would read the other posting to this topic you would see I did post it, and have stated it before. And if you would note I have posted this same topic on FOUR other boards, two of which you visit and I stated the same there as I have here.
So would you kindly read all the posting before commenting, I know what I have said on this and I would kind thank you not to try to tell me what I have or have not said on this when I know what I have posted.
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Cray
02/25/02 01:48 PM
204.245.128.3
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>SO you would play with a person who openly cheats, well I am glad to hear that you would do this. Most won't
I disagree. I'm willing to bet every RPG and wargame player has cheated at some point, and been caught, if just fudging die rolls or being a little loose with marking off hit points. Since most people keep playing, most people are able to play with cheaters.
>No misinterpation, you made it clear, YOU will play with some who cheats
You're changing the topic - that I would play with a cheater has nothing to do with the question "And yet you are telling me that you would not have cared?" and my response that you were starting to misinterpret me.
>some how I don't see how that helps things or even corrects the problem.
I thought I said the case was rested, but you just keep getting worse.
Mike Miller, Materials Engineer
Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
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Cray
02/25/02 01:49 PM
204.245.128.3
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He did explain it at some other point in the thread.
Mike Miller, Materials Engineer
Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
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Karagin
02/25/02 01:52 PM
63.173.170.78
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I disagree with your point about every RPG/Wargammer player having cheated at some point, can you prove it?
No changing of the topic, you told us all that you would allow the cheater to "fix" the so called cheat and keep playing, what more do you need to say for the conclusion to be drawn that you would play with some one who openly cheats? And yes the question I ask does fall back on your comment about allowing the cheater to remain and play. Do you or don't you care about player interegite?
What case did you rest?
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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Cray
02/25/02 02:05 PM
204.245.128.3
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>I disagree with your point about every RPG/Wargammer player having cheated at some point, can you prove it?
Yes: every gamer I have met is certifiably human. Therefore, at some point, they have fudged a die roll or not been perfectly honest about the equipment on their character sheet or simply forgotten a rule. Thus, everyone has cheated at some point.
>you told us all that you would allow the cheater to "fix" the so called cheat and keep playing, what more do you need to say for the conclusion to be drawn that you would play with some one who openly cheats
That I'd play with a cheater was not under discussion. It's a separate matter from caring whether or not they cheat.
>Do you or don't you care about player interegite?
Sure. I don't throw a temper tantrum over it, though. Roleplayers are people, so they'll be prone to cheating now and then. If I have fun gaming with them, I can FORGIVE a little cheating.
>What case did you rest?
You can go back and read the thread.
Mike Miller, Materials Engineer
Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.
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Karagin
02/25/02 02:10 PM
63.173.170.78
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Thank you for answering my question.
I am glad you can forgive a cheater.
Karagin
Given time and plenty of paper, a philosopher can prove anything.
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