Requiem
06/18/20 10:28 AM
101.185.79.245
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Please follow the simple rule
Start with a Title
Put in the Sarna Web Page / Book and Page number – source material so that others know where it comes from;
Then put in a copy of the quote from the source material; and lastly ..
Put in an explanation what you have liked the tech be incorporated into / as to where this tech should be considered.
Example:
Hi-Scout
Source: https://www.sarna.net/wiki/Hi-Scout
Quote: “is a reconnaissance combat vehicle produced by ScolTek Associates since 3000.” and
“The vehicle's sensor suite includes infrared, seismic, sound, motion, radio, radar and hyperpulse to detect any unit within 60 kilometers. It also comes with a 15-ton drone hangar capable of housing 3 NapFind hover Drones and 3 PathTrack tracked drones. The StealthMat-Q Communications with MultiTrack Coordination system is able to transmit and monitor over 500 channels simultaneously, and allows each Hi-Scout to control its fleet of drones. The drones act in coordination with each other and their mother vehicle to create a "sensor chain", increasing the vehicle's detection range by over one hundred percent.”
Technology Transfer: Therefore since the year 300 this technological marvel should have been able to be transferred to all Battlemech systems.
Star League Defense Force – Uniforms and Uniforms of the SLDF
Source: https://www.sarna.net/wiki/Star_League_Defense_Force and https://www.sarna.net/wiki/Uniforms_of_the_SLDF
Quote: “There famous stories of soldiers going to great lengths to protect their portable clothes-care machines to ensure their uniforms would not stay dirty”
Technology Transfer: Any military service branch would be interested in such a machine - portable clothes-care machines in the future whilst on an op.
Uniforms of the SLDF – Duty Uniforms
Source: https://www.sarna.net/wiki/Uniforms_of_the_SLDF
Quote: MechWarrior -
“Over a synthetic, heat-resistant tan shirt and shorts was a cooling jumpsuit which used a synthetic coolant three times as effective as water in removing heat. The jumpsuit was normally plugged into the 'Mech but also included an emergency pump and heat exchanger on the belt. Tubing in the MechWarrior's shirt connected to hookups in his cuffs which could connect to gloves and keep his hands cool. The jumpsuit also prevented "Hotfoot" by extending down the front and back of the legs and around the feet.[1] Properly worn, the uniform was airtight with its own air supply” and
“The neurohelmet was also smaller and lighter than 31st century models and could perform many more functions, thanks to a biofeedback neural apparatus that was much more sensitive and did not require contact with the wearer's scalp. Such was the sensitivity of the helmet that many warriors chose to fight with their visor and windows blackened, relying totally on the sensor information fed directly into their brain.”
Technology Transfer: First, why didn’t the Clan have this? Second the neurohelmet sensor information is something every mechwarrior would want.
Quote: Fighter Pilots –
“AeroSpace Fighter pilots wore a unique flight suit, combining the functions of a coolant suit and G-suit, which was built with a semi-exoskeleton design. The exoskeleton, made of a now-forgotten plastic-steel alloy, protected the pilot's chest, back, arms and legs by absorbing the shock of a blast without inhibiting her movements. Small motors in the exoskeleton also gave the pilot extra strength when needed in order to perform high-speed maneuvers.[3] The pilot's gloves took the place of conventional controls which, along with a specialized neurohelmet, allowed slight movements, gestures and even neural impulses to control the craft.[4]
The neurohelmet, while being large and cumbersome, also allowed the pilot to fight in Complete Tactical Neuro Presentation mode. CTNA mode, using sensors embedded in the fuselage of SLDF fighters, replaced the pilot's cockpit with a virtual reality view that gave the sensation of flying without a fighter. The pilot had an unobstructed view in all directions and could look through several visual spectrums including infrared and ultraviolet.”
Technology Transfer: again why don’t the Clan have this? Second the embedded sensors etc is something that every fighter needs”
Quote Armor Crews:
“Helmets worn by armor crews performed almost all of the same functions as that of 31st century neurohelmets, connecting to cameras and sensors located on the vehicle's chassis to help with navigation and location of enemy targets. The helmets also contained a communication system for use in the heat of battle”
Technology Transfer: All armor units
Quote Infantry:
“The Infantryman's helmet was far above and beyond those worn by troopers of the 31st century. Fully enclosed, it provided an excellent field of vision which, through voice commands, could switch between several vision modes, including infrared and Electronic Emission (EE). The three panes of the helmet's visor were made of a clear, bulletproof polymer that polarized to a silver tone to protect against lasers. The helmet also linked with the soldier's weapon to project an accurate sight onto his visor”
Technology Transfer: Question do Clan Elementals have this technology? Plus Grey Death Armor do they have this technology for the future IS infantry?
Quote Navy Officer / Enlisted: “On the left wrist was worn a Communications Device, which allowed the user to communicated with other members of the ship's crew;” and “he device also collected medical information from sensors woven into the jumpsuit and could transmit this information to a medic's computer during emergencies. Additional functions included the storage and playback of audio programs, such as step-by-step instructions for performing a complex task.”
Technology Transfer: would be nice to have this for your Navy in the future and then expanded to everyone in combat – plus it would assist MASH recovery teams no end and thus reduce the number of deaths on the battlefield if they can get to the wounded quick enough ….
Quote Engineer:
“Navy Engineers wore a uniform that also doubled as a spacesuit, made of several layers of insulating fabric and fluid-carrying tubing to keep them warm, though it weighed only a few kilograms more than normal uniforms. The uniform's high collar hid the helmet ring, which would connect to a helmet equipped with lights and a camera. The belt included a portable air supply and hook-ups to connect to a maneuvering unit, which held a larger air supply and allowed for more mobility when operating outside the ship.”
Technology Transfer: again, would be nice to have this for your Navy (Drop-ship and Jump-ship) in the future.
Get thee to Coventry … Now is the winter of our discontent, made glorious by this daughter of Tharkad … Our army shall march through. Well to New Avalon tonight.
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ghostrider
07/09/20 02:15 PM
66.74.60.165
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Might want to check out the Steiner Stadium entry. The detonation field in there was put in by Nashan Diversified.
Looking into the entry for Nashan, they were formed in 2795. So the grid was put in AFTER the fall of the SL.
This opens up a lot of issues as this is the only written example of this tech, yet it was developed in the SL. There is NO WAY this tech would not have been more widely used as this would be part of the first succession war time. At least Nashan would have used it to help defend their facilities, yet nothing.
The Steiner government KNEW of the technology after it was put in. So where did it go?
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Requiem
07/09/20 07:16 PM
1.158.192.25
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Steiner Stadium Grid:
R&D: <some time prior to or during the fall of the SL.>
Re-discovered within a SL R&D Facility: <By Nashan Diversified some time prior to or during the fall of the SL and put into storage.>
Building of Steiner Stadium: 2795
Why it was never considered for additional R&D via the Steiner Government:-
1. Steiner Military R&D as well as civilian R&D teams were unable to determine a viable use for the grid’s technology, given their current level of technology?
2. R&D teams believed the technology had no discernible military or civilian use and ignored it (considered it to be an expensive toy) due to the level of energy required to operate it?
3. Government money – Politicians as well as Military believed that the money that could be used to research the Grid could be better used elsewhere … project shelved and never reconsidered … considered to be a boondoggle.
4. No one thought through the ramifications of putting it into the game and was just ignored. Just like many other great technological items (Black Boxes comes to mind here)?
There are probably more points that could be considered, such as R&D time though-out the game is unrealistically long – as well as the cost per unit decreases over time (especially since the introduction of production line manufacturing as well as robotics manufacturing have reduced employee wages to the organization (as this used to be a major cost to production etc.).
Thus over time what was once a very expensive piece of material its cost should decrease over time to reflect this – and yet somehow we are expected to believe that costs are static over incredibly long periods of time …..
Get thee to Coventry … Now is the winter of our discontent, made glorious by this daughter of Tharkad … Our army shall march through. Well to New Avalon tonight.
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Requiem
07/09/20 07:16 PM
1.158.192.25
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Chameleon Light Polarization Shield
Source: https://www.sarna.net/wiki/Chameleon_Light_Polarization_Shield
“Developed by the Terran Hegemony in 2630 alongside the Null Signature System.”
“The Chameleon system was designed to make a 'Mech invisible to the naked eye. By using a primitive mimetic system, the outline of the 'Mech carrying it was broken up, blending into the surrounding terrain. The Chameleon was very effective because unlike the Null Signature System it worked against sensor systems and visual observation.”
Another piece of technology that defies understanding as to why it was never manufactured en mass for objective raider units – the delta units of the Inner Sphere?
The initial cost may be high as well as the taking up to 6 critical slots – however over time shouldn’t this have been decreased to 3 by 3050 and with a massively reduced cost?
Get thee to Coventry … Now is the winter of our discontent, made glorious by this daughter of Tharkad … Our army shall march through. Well to New Avalon tonight.
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ghostrider
07/09/20 11:32 PM
66.74.60.165
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The Detonation tech wasn't even new when it went it. It suggests it was some tech that got pushed to the side before Nashan used it.
And as stated, it wasn't used to protect the information systems Nashan had at that time? The 1st war would have had people scrambling to secure their tech as worlds were nuked or bombed into oblivion.
Or maybe it was, and the developers will come out with a vault that it was used to protect, as a means to increase or release new tech that was made in the SL times. Might even be a way to reintroduce someone of the Cameron line, IE they were secured in a bunker until they were no longer being looked for. Strang got away from Terra, or at least someone related to him. The clans hunted his line down when they were invading the IS.
The chameleon light shield was probably used by the SL. The spec ops units that were 'ghosts'. But it is very odd that this tech was released suggesting it was Clan tech, as it was not in the original 2750 or 3050 books. I have an issue with this, as it is basically a cloaking shield. Given the fact that you should be able to combine the detonation shielding with this to create an nearly indestructible unit that can sneak up behind you comes to mind.
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Wick
07/10/20 01:14 PM
173.247.25.195
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Quote:
Steiner Stadium Grid
Direct quote from Solaris 7 Box Set Player's Rulebook, page 58:
"Steiner Stadium's detonator grid remains on of the most fascinating pieces of technology in the Inner Sphere. It has yet to be duplicated, for the technology is part of Star League era lostech. Power records for the stadium indicate that the grid consumes massive amounts of energy, suggesting that the grid, despite its success, would be impractical for any other application, i.e., adapted for BattleMechs, making them virtually invincible.
Facts about the grid's true composition are sparse. Recently, the Blackwell Corporation, headquartered on Outreach, has begun to experiment with a similar system as a means of containing the plasma in a fusion engine. Their intent is apparently to produce an engine using XL technology, but without the excessive volume that XL engines currently require. Blackwell has also developed electromagnetic armor-enhancement that reduces the effectiveness of some energy weapons in a manner similar to that of Nashan's detonator grid.
No one knows exactly how Blackwell developed these items, but their similarity to Nashan's grid system, coupled with Blackwell's well-known ties to Wolf's Dragoons, have fueld considerable speculation."
Note this was published before the reveal of Wolf Dragoon's formally being of Clan Wolf origin, describing how more advanced engines and reflective armor came into play in the universe, through knowledge retained by the Clans but lost by the successor houses.
The key point is that the grid needs a major input of energy. Solaris City is one of the few cities in the Inner Sphere with a surplus of power. Maybe only major cities of Terra and house or regional capitals compare. And while it might be feasible to protect a mech factory using this technology, the power demands would be so huge as to provide a strategic weakpoint. Like the power generators at Hoth in Empires Strikes Back - base is secure while power is running, but once Empire takes them out, its time for the rebels to get out of Dodge. Battletech (especially video games) have similarly long established that to weaken a fortified position's defenses, take out the power supply. If we assume that the power station needed to generate such a forcefield is larger than the forcefield could protect, then there's no way to safeguard the generator inside the field and thus its just not practical in a military capacity.
I'm sure additional R&D was done, until the lostech became too obscure to really comprehend, but no one could see much of a viable location to duplicate it. Solaris City, at least from mid-First War until the Jihad, is fairly neutral ground that no House would really desire to directly assault, so you could build big power stations there without worrying as much about destruction or being a strategic weakpoint.
Its very possible that the grid was a Nashan secret, and the disruption of the First Succession War may have caused those many of those secrets to be lost. ROM's Operation Holy Shroud would have certainly tied up any loose ends to how the system worked. (I do question the Lyran's thoughts on placing a state secret on a border world you only recently took from the other side in the middle of a war though. Seems like they should have waited until Solaris VII was more secure before building the grid, but clearly they were more interested in one-upping The Jungle in any and all ways possible, regardless of the risk of the technology falling into enemy hands.)
Personally, I think the grid is one of those things FASA published and later regretted. The whole principle of "magic forcefields" opens up a box of potentially game-breaking technology that I think they preferred to do without. They let the engine enhancements and reflective armor come along later, suggesting they were playtesting those ideas by this time, but never quite replicated forcefields.
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ghostrider
07/10/20 01:45 PM
66.74.60.165
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The system should have been used to protect certain locations, such as the throne rooms of house lords, or say the storage vaults for tech documents and such. Even just being used at Nashan as a proof of concept would be something.
But nothing. Only the stadium uses the tech. And the tech was already researched before the SL was even formed.
The system doesn't need to work every second of the day. An automatic turn on when hostiles are in the area, or an enemy warship/fleet is in the general area. The Stadium doesn't have it running all the time, as the waste of power would dictate it would be shut off when not in use.
With the large consumption of power, it was also made BEFORE the wars really destroyed much of the infrastructure, so the lack of power wouldn't have had that big of an impact on the use. This was made before the 1st war had destroyed so much.
And I do agree that the placement of such tech on Solaris would have been unthinkable given the first war was going on. At the least, a few more important areas should have had the tech long before the arena. It really doesn't make sense to have mech combats on Solaris when the destructive succession war was raging.
I would think the SL would have had some systems set up in the most secretive and secured places for preserving something like a computer system housing intel or tech manuals.
And I agree that this is just one of more then a few things FASA and later owners put up, then regretted it.
Not sure if you read some of the tech questions from much earlier posts, but there are more then a few questions that come up and no one seems to want to answer them, or maybe they can't.
The ban of double sinks in vehicles is partially understandable, but why is it you can't install a double sink fusion engine in one, as all the sinks are supposed to be in the engine itself? No extra ones could be added and work, but the initial 10 should.
Endosteel being used in units that have a lot of moving parts, yet can't be installed as a solid frame in vehicles.
The sensor baffling material used in the MAC adventure pack disappeared after the book came out.
The stealth skill Morgan Kell got, and then the DC commander that fought him got. They brought that skill up in the books when Morgan was sent to save Luthien. No one else ever had that before, and I have yet to hear of any more having it since.
One really annoying thing is the BS of the IS not making clan tech. Too expensive if the main argument, but that is crap. The XXXL engine in the experimental Zeus far out costs the clan tech, yet it was done. The mass production of clan tech especially missile launchers, would drop dramatically as they get more and more produced. I think the reason they don't want it, is because this would prevent future threats from being a lot smaller, but that is the price you pay for bringing out the advanced tech that people can get ahold of. I use the Missile launchers because it is something that would send more then a few tanks beyond mech capabilities. The SRM/LRM tanks comes to mind here. Double the launchers on them, or add more armor. Half weight for Clan launchers.
Another issue is the compact K-F drive. If it saves on materials, why isn't it being put on regular jumpships? Also, why does a smaller drive move something that large to begin with?
Then the Argo and it's ability to have another dropship dock with it while it is docked to a jumpship. Not legal by the developers own rules, yet becoming canon. The KF boom is supposed to encase the ships to jump, yet the Behemoth dropship is so much larger then say a 3 stack of Leopards stacked on one another, or say just cargo containers that can be picked up and dropped off at jumppoints. A simple tug can connect or disconnect the containers are jump points.
There is far more things, but as said before. The nasty weapons will eventually reach the 'good guys'. For some reason, they seem to never be able to make them due to some stupid thing, or they don't work right.
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Requiem
07/11/20 05:51 AM
1.158.192.25
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https://www.sarna.net/wiki/Simon_Cameron
2751
The First Lord made an unscheduled visit to the New Silesia asteroid, where he socialised with the local miners and toured the facility before asking if he might try piloting one of the LARGE REMOTE-CONTROLLED ROBOTS USED FOR MINING OPERATIONS.
If there are remote controlled robots in 2751 where did this technology disappear to?
Get thee to Coventry … Now is the winter of our discontent, made glorious by this daughter of Tharkad … Our army shall march through. Well to New Avalon tonight.
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Wick
07/13/20 02:30 PM
173.247.25.195
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Double Heat Sinks: Game explains that singular and double are incompatible, yet there's a few contradictory examples during War of 3039 of mechs using single based tech but with a few double prototypes (but not in the engine core.) Solaris VII box set introduced Coolant Injectors as a compromise technology, but those are only used on a few designs because its generally better to just use double tech. I think this is something FASA did in making up the TRO:2750 to streamline the rules - keeping track of how many of both types you had was too complicated I guess.
Endo-steel is explained as being both very bulky and very expensive to manufacture (requiring zero-G environments.) Most vehicles are built to be inexpensive, and bulkness reduces interior space for components. Probably a rule to keep tanks inferior to mechs.
I/S not reverse engineering Clan tech is bogus. Maybe not right away, but by Jihad or Republic times it should have been commonplace, not still very rare. But probably introduced to keep the Clan tech superior. If I/S had the same capabilities, the Clans would be less of a threat (and as upcoming IlClan seems to indicate, they still are by mid-33rd century, 200 years after returning)
Compact KF drive is much more expensive. Commercial and transport jumpships operate on small margins, with limited engineering support so complexity, cost of material and personnel is major factor in design. Military warships have a different focus - they can afford expensive, complicated designs and support them with a crew of engineers. Compact KF drives can be installed on standard jumpships (I think WOB had several, and probably ComStar, too), but it makes little sense except for maybe emergency couriers or high risk applications. Smaller doesn't mean less powerful. Jet engines are roughly comparable in size to piston/propeller engines but far more powerful.
I think Argo is given a pass on being able to dock another ship because its truly gigantic, bigger than some jumpships. (Behemoth is slightly heavier, but more compact in shape and denser - Argo has larger volume but also more empty space within. Its size might allow a docking ring while Behemoth falls short.) Besides its own docking ring, perhaps we can assume it has some kind of tech to extend the KF boom's coverage. Why you don't have pirates, Houses, Comstar, or other interest parties constantly trying to hijack the Argo or the Jumpship its mounted to is a major plot hole. (It happens once or twice in the campaign, but should be every few weeks or months. A unique Star League-era dropship holding a precious Atlas II 'mech makes for an extremely high value target that would unquestionably dwarf anything else in the rimward periphery.)
Mining robots probably aren't similar enough to 'mechs. Mechs for example need a neurohelmet (until drones come along in the Jihad.) Remote controlled robot technology probably still exists, though likely more primitive in 3025 than it was in 2751, and just doesn't have any military value. I'd suggest things like the Hi-scout drone as nearest military application.
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ghostrider
07/14/20 11:35 AM
66.74.60.165
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Wick. The double sinks issue I was talking about is using the sinks that are the free ones in the engine itself. Not adding in others, but the hidden ones in the engine.
This isn't about mixing different sink types. It is asking why it is impossible for a vehicle to have a fusion engine with double sinks in it and use them to full efficiency.
The clan tech not being used has been discussed, and one of the main reasons given is the cost. As with anything, that might be the case with the first few runs. But as they start producing more and more, it would drop dramatically. Even with this, houses would definitely have made examples of it for their elite troops. The xxxl engine costs more then most mechs by itself. So this is counter to the claim of expense being a main factor.
Same thing as above with the expense of the compact drive. I would almost guarantee Steiner at least would buy such ships, as they can jump ships much larger then standard jump drives. I could see ships becoming much like the Potempkin without the weapons, able to jump with 25 dropships at a time. This would dramatically cut the number of jumpships needed for an invasion.
As a more necessary note, this would mean a dramatic improvement of carrying cargo in main shipping lines. Not to mention the using less materials to actually build it. It is suggested that the Germanium is hard to come by.
Ok the Argo is longer then the Behemoth, but not taller. The taller issue would affect the KF boom. And in the wiki, it does not say that only a Leopard can dock with it. I don't see a size limit to what can dock with the Argo.
Another issue is the Argo does not have the following statement for it.
When the Behemoth was introduced to the BattleTech universe, the construction/space travel rules postulated that a DropShip required two docking hardpoints for every 60,000 tons (or fraction thereof) of mass to dock with a JumpShip. Consequently the Behemoth, the only DropShip massing over 60,000 tons, was said to take up the space for two vessels when docked to a JumpShip.
As suggested, simple cargo containers that can be used for shipping, should be able to have the MDS the Argo does, to increase the amount of cargo that can be moved in a jump. Even just normal hook ups or locking mechanisms should work. The containers don't really need air and access to them like dropships have. The Drop shuttle is only 200 tons and can use a jumpship dock by itself.
Edited by ghostrider (07/14/20 11:47 AM)
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