User talk:Xoid/arc/2007/November

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Xoid-ified templates

Hey, if I try and create a Xoid-ified template based on the documentation you provided, do I need to go back and do anything to the articles created with the previous version of the template? I'm thinking of building some book article stubs, but want to be sure to treat the previous articles kindly. Thanks. --Revanche (admin) 10:36, 14 January 2007 (CST)

They should be fine. --Xoid 00:58, 24 January 2007 (CST)

I've been making my bones on Wikipedia a lot recently (joined the CVU) and am getting much more comfortable with transclusion. I may be coming back here in force soon, with this confidence. — The preceding unsigned comment was posted by Revanche (talk • contribs) .

Still need to work on signing properly 'eh? :P (Consequently, I have no idea what the CVU is.) --Xoid 14:15, 27 January 2007 (CST)

Somewhat. Overzealous in my attempts to get things 'done' before heading off to bed. CVU: Counter-Vandalism Unit. I figured work there would show me all the creative ways things have to be repaired.--Revanche (admin) 09:12, 28 January 2007 (CST)

Template:Cite

Xoid, ma-man: can you help me understand why this isn't working? Is it that ref code you've asked Nic for? --Revanche (admin) 00:25, 28 January 2007 (CST)

What seems to be the problem? It looks okay, but without seeing where it's not working… --Xoid 01:49, 28 January 2007 (CST)

Federated Suns. Page-find 'Amanda.' Background is I had her name confirmed by Roosterboy (at CBT) and wanted to cite the reference. I brought this template over from wikipedia & modified it for 'our' books. But its either not working because of my mod or because it doesn't have the support loaded here. I didn't make the change last night because it didn't work, but I am adding it in now for your review. --Revanche (admin) 09:04, 28 January 2007 (CST)

Second review makes me think I'm just not sure how to properly employ it. It 'fails' the same where here as at Wikipedia. Any guidance would be appreciated. --Revanche (admin) 09:11, 28 January 2007 (CST)

Ah. The problem is that you don't have all the variables filled. Empty parameters show up as {{{par name}}}. If you want to fix that, ensure that parameters are in the form of {{{var name|default}}}; where default is what will show up if you don't assign anything to it.

Please note that without the actual cite extension, that the text will show up wherever you call the template, and that the tags <ref>, </ref> and </references> are useless until then. --Xoid 00:24, 29 January 2007 (CST)

Okay, I'm unclear as to how I missed this entry when I reviewed Recent Changes, but I see it now. It definitely would have been helpful in my attempts to use Template:Cite. One good thing, though, in my trials with Cite is that it has proven to be more work than it needs to be. As you'll see on my talk page, I suggest using the ref codes. I assume your comments about it (ref code) being useless above is 'old news.' --Revanche (admin) 00:51, 30 January 2007 (CST)

Yup. Definitely old news. Nic works fast. :-) --Xoid 18:10, 3 February 2007 (CST)

the 'new' templates

Xoid, which templates did CJKeys and you work on? I know you upgraded some about a month or so ago, but I wasn't following along at the time. I'm hoping to identify them for the Help pages and to finish the work with the other ones. Thanks. --Revanche (admin) 23:23, 28 January 2007 (CST)

To be honest? No idea. It'd probably be easier for me to just go through the list and check which have documentation that is way off base. --Xoid 21:33, 29 January 2007 (CST)

Whom...that's both good & bad news. I assumed that it was just canon Mechs and that all the others would have to be done (I've changed the help page for canon 'Mechs to match what you provided). If you've done more than that, then i really need to get those identified and update the help pages accordingly. I'll start poking around the relevant templates and working on them in an organized fashion. How should we coordinate our related efforts? --Revanche (admin) 00:54, 30 January 2007 (CST)

We can use this opportunity to fix these will-eventually-be high-use templates before it becomes as much of a burden as the changes to {{InfoBoxBattleMech}} were.

Divide and conquer. Special:Allpages, choose one end of the list, and I'll take the other. Work our way towards the middle. Once either of us starts to get to that point, we inform the other and split up tasks further if necessary. If there are any special changes required that you are unsure how to make; for an infobox for example, we stop, collaborate on that one, then go back to where we were. Repeat as necessary. --Xoid 03:25, 2 February 2007 (CST)

Roger. I'll start at the bottom and work backwards (i.e., I'm taking the right column). I had been assuming that we'd be working just on infoboxes, so I'm not truly aware of what I should be looking for. For example: Template:Wikipedia. I'm looking at its history and I can see you went to town on it on the 17th of December, so I'd presume that one was complete. However, it would be a good example for me to follow, thru the history, of what you actually did. Please provide me steps/wickets/checklist that must be checked and/or accomplished for each unaltered template. --Revanche (admin) 11:08, 3 February 2007 (CST)

Read the code; if it doesn't do what the docs say, fix the docs. If you aren't sure what the template does, take a look at what the doc's say. Try using the template somewhere. If you can't get it working, that's a sure sign the docs are screwy (or too difficult to comprehend — not always a problem… some templates simply cannot be simplified any further). If the template's got ParserFunctions and other junk in it and you have absolutely no idea what it does, just say the word. The {{Check talk}} template is a good example of scary stuff for beginners.

Now, as to how to do the docs. Um… *scratches head* basically? Just in that format. Take a look at the /doc pages for {{WikiProject BattleMechs}} and {{TOCleft}}; just make sure that they are in that 'form' and we'll have consistent looking documentation. (Just FYI: I chose violet and orange to help out those with red/green colour-blindness, the bolding should help somewhat, too.) --Xoid 18:07, 3 February 2007 (CST)

I had followed the link you provided (in each mod you had already completed) for BTW:TDP and that was a goldmine. Having something as easy as cut & paste -as simplistic as it sounds- builds my confidence immensely, in regards to helping out on a project of this sort. What I'd like you to do is follow my progress on Template:Unsigned and let me know if I've screwed anything up. I think the heavy-thinkin' has been done with that cut&paste code and now I just have to be careful with the language of the documentation. --Revanche 18:27, 3 February 2007 (CST)

Seems pretty good. Only thing I can think of is that I might make it clearer that you use either one or the other, though that may be babying it a bit much. --Xoid 19:28, 3 February 2007 (CST)

Aha! I just realized you either bamboozled or drafted my ass! Reading back thru these, I remember now my intent was on providing updated help space pages for the infobox-centered articles ('Mechs, vehicles, books, etc.) to meet the changes I knew you had made to the actual templates for those infoboxes. In my attempt to understand what you were suggesting for a course of action, however, I learned how to provide transcluded documents in order to provide up-to-date help functions on the actual template pages themselves. Not at all my intent! You swindler! --Revanche 19:25, 3 February 2007 (CST)

*raspberry* --Xoid 19:28, 3 February 2007 (CST)

[wiping face] --Revanche 20:20, 3 February 2007 (CST)

Default Sort

As I was working on the ComStar (sourcebook) article, and all its tangents, I questioned how we can properly categorize people by last name. I see that on Wikipedia, the magic word {{DEFAULTSORT:<sort key>}} may have a role in conducting that behavior. Can you confirm my assumption and determine how we can get it to behave similarly here? --Revanche 01:36, 4 February 2007 (CST)

Requires MediaWiki 1.10, which isn't out yet. We could ask Nic to grab this from the CVS and try putting it in himself, but I'd prefer to wait until 1.10 is released before adopting it. God only knows why they allow unstable releases of MediaWiki on Wikipedia, but they do. --Xoid 02:57, 4 February 2007 (CST)