About the Marauder
There are actually two distinct definitions of "Reseen":
Some now use the term to describe images that used to be unseen, but are not unseen anymore. I think this only applies to the Ost-Mechs at this time. Even those 'Mechs that may legally be shown again and some that were never illegal to show in the first place remain unseen because TPTB have decided to take no chances with out-of-house works and IPs anymore.
When the term "Reseen" was originally coined, it referred to new images depicting units whose older art was unseen - namely the Technical Readout: Project Phoenix designs. This is what the Marauder article refers to, as there is at least one (albeit apocryphal) novel cover that anachronistically depicts a 3067-era Project Phoenix Marauder on the cover of a 3025-era novel where the unseen shape was relevant as the Marauder's canonical shape.
This article does need cleanup because it fails to cover these two distinct definitions. Then again, I think it is somewhat superflous should be merged into an appropriate subsection of the article about the Unseen anyways. Redirect to Unseen#Reseen. Frabby (talk) 04:54, 3 September 2013 (PDT)
- All of the 'mechs listed here are listed as part of Project Phoenix. You haven't clearly explained what the problem is. IMO the second definition is the only one that really matters for an article, but as GOLFisNOTaSPORT mentioned on the category discussion page, if you feel the need, you can go into detail regarding the two definitions rather than delete the article. I feel that having this list is important. I also think that any 'mech page that states that the 'mech is Unseen, that is listed in Project Phoenix, should also state that it is one of the Reseen. Otherwise we have lots of people (including game developers) who think the 'mech is not available for use in games simply based on that Unseen label. Mechwarrior Online added their Phoenix 'mechs based on the list of Reseen. --Trifler (talk) 06:08, 18 August 2014 (PDT)
- I guess the main thing is I want people to be able to continue using Reseen as a link. If you combine it with the Unseen article, then people have to and an anchor link. I think it's better to just add a link to the Unseen article to this article, and vice versa. --Trifler (talk) 00:44, 26 November 2014 (PST)
- No offense intended, but I do not believe that your personal dislike for three tiny words below the article title, that I suspect most people don't even notice, is not reason enough for this article to exist. The terms Unseen and Reseen are tied together so much, and the definition of Reseen is so subjective in the first place, that the articles should be combined.Cache (talk) 16:55, 1 December 2014 (PST)
- Agree with the redirect to Unseen#Reseen. It is a confusing situation to begin with and I think it is better to keep the Unseen/Reseen articles together. Also, the information on this page is almost entirely incorrect. Negotiations with property owners did not occur and the listed designs did not return as a result. Cache (talk) 21:34, 10 November 2014 (PST)
- The Reseen (Project Phoenix) designs had nothing to do with negotiations with any property owners. They are not returned designs, they are new designs based on their Unseen counterparts. Prior to your addition of new content, this article was entirely incorrect. I will delete the original (incorrect) content. Cache (talk) 08:23, 26 November 2014 (PST)
- The original content said "mechs that were formerly Unseen". That is indeed correct. It sounds like you are confusing the word "mechs" and "designs". The "Mech" part is, for example, Locust. The "design" or "variant" is for example LCT-1E. If a new Locust variant is added, then the Mech (Locust) is indeed Reseen. Thus, the original information is correct. The original Unseen variants are not Reseen, but the mech is. --Trifler (talk) 03:01, 28 November 2014 (PST)
- The original list of Reseen in this article was very incomplete and thus incorrect. Also incorrect was the statement regarding negotiations with property owners. Regarding deletion, this article is now a copy/paste of the Reseen section of the Unseen article, making it redundant. Cache (talk) 16:55, 1 December 2014 (PST)
- Please put back a correct list. I want to delete the section in the Unseen article and have a link to this one. --Trifler (talk) 17:40, 1 December 2014 (PST)
- Since you have not done so, I added one, to the best of my ability, referring to this talk page and the Unseen talk page, as well as the Phoenix Project page. If anything is missing, feel free to add it. --Trifler (talk) 03:18, 27 December 2014 (PST)
- I am happy that you have decided to contribute, however your new list is missing a significant number of units, including the IIC's and VMI designs. Unfortunately I do not have the time available to work on your project. Since all of the Unseen have Reseen artwork, perhaps you would like to simply copy the list of Unseen designs from that page. Cache (talk) 19:41, 27 December 2014 (PST)
Unless it's decided that the Unseen/Reseen label be removed from all lists, per the discussion on the Unseen talk page, I would like to specify exactly which variants are Unseen on the appropriate 'mech pages (Locust, for example). For instance, all of the variants from all of the technical readouts are supposed to be listed (although many are missing), and they're in order based on their original production date (although unfortunately most of them don't list their TR date). So, those from before 3067 would be under an Unseen Variants heading and those after 3067 would be under a Reseen Variants heading. Unfortunately such information is not available here on Sarna, and I don't know where to get it. It seems like I need a copy of all of the technical readouts up to and including Project Phoenix to do this. If so, perhaps I could help organize those of you who have various TRs to help add the production introduction dates that you have for the 'mechs listed here. --Trifler (talk) 03:18, 27 December 2014 (PST)