User talk:Nicjansma

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Sarna.net Design Refresh

August 8, 2013: The new skin is live for the wiki and news sections. Please continue to let me know if you have any feedback. Nicjansma (talk) 20:22, 10 August 2013 (PDT)

Here's what I've done so far:

• General
  • Changed the global font (from Verdana to Open Sans), including the font size (to be larger than before)
  • Changed the background color
  • Many small visual updates and tweaks
  • Update the Sarna logo
• Top navigation bar:
  • Larger and easier to navigate with
  • Includes Facebook and Twitter icons
  • Responsive on mobile devices
• Wiki:
  • Left navigation links have been cleaned up a bit
  • Several parts of the wiki are more responsive on mobile devices
  • Many misc visual style updates and fixes
  • Faction skins work as before
  • Many pages have been updated to be more responsive / mobile friendly
• Downloads
  • Updated look

To Do:

• Update the Forums

Sarna.net Design Refresh Comments

(Leave your comments here)

• I care for content more than for fancy presentation. The change is a slight improvement in my book, nothing substantial in my eyes but there's certainly nothing wrong with it.
  Given that Sarna is mostly perceived as the BT wiki these days, it's a bit odd that wiki isn't the first item in the navigation bar - and the "Sarna.net >>" link goes straigth to the wiki and not to some top level directory. My suggested order of items would therefore be wiki, news, forum, downloads and it goes without saying that the downloads section needs a massive cleanup. You might want to ask Catalyst if they'd allow you to host certain files that used to be free downloads from previous iterations of the official BT page: the House Books, Lawyers, Guns, & Money, also important fan work such as Objective Raids: 3067, etc.
  Finally, I note that the ad sections are back even for registered user accounts. They are a bit annoying once you get used to working on a screen without ad bars... Frabby (talk) 14:51, 5 August 2013 (PDT)

Thanks for your feedback Frabby. There will be a new landing page for the "Sarna.net >> link". While Sarna is currently known for the wiki, the News section is new and I want to promote it. I will be updating the downloads section a bit after the design refresh. And not to worry, the ads will be hidden when the updated look goes live if you're using the NoAds skin. Nicjansma (talk) 15:05, 5 August 2013 (PDT)

• Having worked with the new design for some time, I'm liking it. I especially like the new logo, it's very good. But one thing is bugging me: When browsing Sarna with my smartphone, the screen structure is a bit weird - I don't get the screen sections side-by-side like on my desktop screen, I get them underneath each other in a rather strange order. In particular, the Search box is in a counter-intuitive location near the bottom where it is difficult to find and impractical to use. Can this somehow be moved to the very top? Frabby (talk) 07:00, 14 August 2013 (PDT)

Thanks, I'm glad you like it. The interface you're seeing on your smartphone is what we're calling responsive design in the web-design world. Basically, instead of creating a completely separate desktop webpage vs. a mobile webpage (where the user interface should change to make browsing easier on a smaller screen), the design adapts as the page is resized. You can see this if you take your desktop and shrink the width -- at a certain point, the interface switches to tablet then to mobile phone mode. I think overall, this will be much easier for folks to browse with than the dedicated mobile site, which sacrifices a lot of the UI. The search box is intentionally moved to the bottom after the main content, but I could consider moving it back up above as well. Nicjansma (talk) 07:41, 19 August 2013 (PDT)

• Addendum, I found that I can only browse the wiki on my smartphone, but not edit - the button row is simply gone! Frabby (talk) 01:49, 15 August 2013 (PDT)

There was previously a little "drop-down" sign in the upper-right corner that you could select to show the list of "page, discussion, edit, history, etc". But apparently I broke that functionality on accident, and it wasn't very discoverable. I've fixed it, and added the current page type (eg, page or discussion) so it's more obvious that you can click on it. Nicjansma (talk) 07:41, 19 August 2013 (PDT)

• I've tired using the new layout here and at work, and it looks a bit odd at times. In some pages it's fine, but when I look at the front page and article pages, about a quarter of the screen on the right is white space. That may be a setting that I've missed somewhere in my preferences.
• When I use the history section of an article to review changes that've been made, I'm getting the same problem, except that the text isn't formatting correctly - it's being truncated on the right hnd side. BrokenMnemonic (talk) 09:08, 6 August 2013 (PDT)

What browser are you using? Any chance you can email me a screen shot? nic at nicj dot net. Nicjansma (talk) 10:11, 6 August 2013 (PDT)

I've sent an email with a couple of screenshots in - I'm using Firefox build 22.0. BrokenMnemonic (talk) 10:48, 6 August 2013 (PDT)

Wonderful, that helped a ton. I believe I've fixed this issue -- let me know if not. Nicjansma (talk) 08:00, 7 August 2013 (PDT)

I've been poking around various areas I don't use much on the wiki to test, and at the moment the new layout seems to be working for me, although I've not yet tried it on my BlackBerry. The font's nicely legible, although I've noticed that the larger font has made some of the table-based articles a little busier. The List of BattleTech products is one such - the font's big enough that some columns where entries fit neatly on one line now end up running to two, which means less information is available per screen. That's not a big issue, but it is a little annoying on that particular screen if I'm scrolling up and down looking for something.

Thanks for looking for pages that have problems, that does help. I agree, some of the pages have needed small layout changes due to the larger font size. I've been working on them as I see them. For example, we could change the built-in table column widths of 500px,180px and 210px to something a bit larger for the List of BattleTech products. Nicjansma (talk) 07:47, 19 August 2013 (PDT)

One thing I'd prefer to be able to change if possible is the page tab marker in Firefox. I worked out by using one of the accessibility magnifiers that the page tab marker is the Atlas from the main logo over the word SARNA in tiny font - however, most of the time when I'm working at home on a larger screen size it's basically just a black on dark grey splodge to my eyes. The big yellow S was much more recogniseable for me, and made it much easier to find the tab I wanted quickly. I typically have 12-14 tabs open at once (when I'm at home, I'm often editing on two tabs in Sarna at once, plus I'll have 3 tabs open for the Arkham Horror play by forum game I'm running, another for the CGL forum, one for LiveJournal, one for the Arkham Wiki, and so on) and at the moment it's taking me noticeably longer to find the Sarna tabs. BrokenMnemonic (talk) 07:20, 14 August 2013 (PDT)

Thanks for pointing that out, I hadn't realized it looked like that on Firefox. I've updated the logo to remove the SARNA text, so it just shows the Atlas. This should be much more recognizable, do you agree? Nicjansma (talk) 07:47, 19 August 2013 (PDT)

• Personally I don't like the new layout much; plus, in Firefox (which is all that I use) the font is messed up and looks constantly bolded and is much too large. Therefore, if you do change it for everyone, I suggest that you leave an old version for us editors to use if we want. That is my two cents. -BobTheZombie (talk) 10:55, 6 August 2013 (PDT)

Can you say what you don't like about it specifically? What OS / browser are you using? The font looks fine for me on the latest Firefox, IE and Chrome on Windows 7... a screenshot showing the problem would be wonderful! Nicjansma (talk) 16:19, 6 August 2013 (PDT)

The screenshot was very helpful. I believe I've fixed this issue as well, let me know if not. Nicjansma (talk) 08:00, 7 August 2013 (PDT)

Note, for those of you seeing the font all-bold, check out this fix for FireFox, which helped BobTheZombie Nicjansma (talk) 06:39, 11 August 2013 (PDT)

• I tested the new layout and i have no problems what BM talk from, but i don't use it, i use the marik skin with CSS preferences.--Doneve (talk) 12:25, 6 August 2013 (PDT)

The house-skins will change to look like the new layout, but the color overrides will be similar. Nicjansma (talk) 16:19, 6 August 2013 (PDT)

The house skins should be updated with the new look. Nicjansma (talk) 20:22, 10 August 2013 (PDT)

• Hy Nic i appreciate your sarna refresh, but can you change the font size and the font Open Sans to another for the various house skins, it looks not so good for me and i think you become more messages about this, i don't like it, but this is my opinion, you want feedback you become feedback, and i notice some a broken table, please take a look on the Port Arthur page, the table on the left side is not closed and on other tables the same problem.--Doneve (talk) 18:36, 10 August 2013 (PDT)

Hi Doneve. The new font and font sizes were conscious decisions to make the page easier to read for everyone in general. I'm sure everyone has their own preferences for fonts and font sizes, so I can't provide a custom skin for everyone's preference. I'm not currently seeing a problem with the table on the Port Arthur page. I was in the middle of making several changes while you were online, can you reload to see if the problem goes away? If not, please email me a screenshot showing me what you're seeing. Nicjansma (talk) 20:22, 10 August 2013 (PDT)

Thanks for response, the table problem is gone, and i must life with the new layout, no doubt, iam here :).--Doneve (talk) 20:42, 10 August 2013 (PDT)

Good to hear! One option that you could do, if you want to see a smaller font, is to use the Firefox Greasemonkey addon, which lets you insert your own personal CSS in any domain you visit. Thanks for your feedback! Nicjansma (talk) 20:46, 10 August 2013 (PDT)

Thanks Nic for the addon help, it works :), oh and i like the new design more and more.--Doneve (talk) 09:53, 11 August 2013 (PDT)

• So far, am I loving it. :) More to come... ClanWolverine101 (talk) 21:55, 10 August 2013 (PDT)

• Is there way for me to be able to login and have change the skin back to the old one? No offense, but i'm using a older computer and its kinda pain on it. -- Wrangler (talk) 05:29, 11 August 2013 (PDT)

Are there specific things that you don't like about the new look? Can you send me a screenshot, and which OS/browser you're using to show the things that don't work? I'd rather fix the issue for everyone than have to maintain the older skin. Nicjansma (talk) 06:39, 11 August 2013 (PDT)

Its mainly I'm XP user, i'm not planning replace it anytime soon. I've found that this type of interface is rather..challenging memorywise to the older ad-free skin. I'm not against swanky looks, its function for me. Wikipedia next-generation skin is similarly do the same thing to me. -- Wrangler (talk) 08:53, 11 August 2013 (PDT)

• Hi Nic, i noticed something. With way this new adsense type skin works. Any files that i have an option of watching, aren't being being highlighted/shown in bold. -- Wrangler (talk) 05:40, 11 August 2013 (PDT)

I believe I've fixed this. Note, you don't have to use the SarnaAdSense skin, you can use just the plain Sarna skin (which doesn't have ads) or any of the house skins (all of which don't have ads) Nicjansma (talk) 06:39, 11 August 2013 (PDT)

I'll try, try switching to the other Sarna skin. This the original isn't it? -- Wrangler (talk) 08:54, 11 August 2013 (PDT)

I've tried both, I guess its newer interface you switch too. You have to do what you have to do. I'll have try keep going till my browers can't handle it anymore. I've used Chrome too and frankly i don't like it either. I know this is done of Touchscreen interfaces, but it makes it hell on wheels for me. Sorry to trouble you, Nic. -- Wrangler (talk) 08:59, 11 August 2013 (PDT)

• Hello Nic, overall I like the new scheme, it seems cleaner and a bit more professional. The only issue I have noticed so far is that the BattleMech Portal section isn't framed correctly and the page cuts off the sides causing a horizontal slider bar to be generated. Previously I have visited this page and this was not the case under the old look (I am using a widescreen monitor, so width and aspect ratio of my equipment is not to blame here). Otherwise, I like what you have done. -- MadMechanic

Thanks MadMechanic, I've updated the BattleMech Portal a bit to be more responsive with the new design.

• Hi just thought I'd chime in too. Personally, I really like the new look of the wiki. Been using Sarna for little over a year I think. The old one was fine too, but as said before, this one looks more professional. For some reason it reminds me of the NGNG and MechSpecs sites. No idea if that's intended or not. Anyway, my only gripes with the new site are that articles don't fill the page width. This seems to be corrected when you make the window smaller (Nice touch btw, if intentional) My only other dislike is that the global font is quite large. Other than that, really love the new refreshed look. Keep it up! -- Mordynak (talk) 06:11, 13 August 2013 (PDT)

Hi Mordynak, thanks for the input! We're using the same font (Open Sans) that NGNG is, and the overall design is "flatter", which is the direction web design is going lately. The articles should fill the whole width! What browser and OS are you using? Can you send me a screenshot of what you see? Yes, I spent quite a bit of time making smaller-screens work better -- the whole interface should 'collapse' a bit as you shrink the browser width. This is to make it work better on tablets and phones. I put a lot of time into making that work, I hope it's useful for people browsing on phones. Appreciate the feedback! Nicjansma (talk) 06:28, 13 August 2013 (PDT)

Hi again, was literally just taking a screenshot or two for you to see. Using Win7 and Firefox, latest version. http://i.imgur.com/3mZ06eV.jpg?1 and a second image a little wider. http://i.imgur.com/BJLgKA2.png?1 imgur chose the formats btw.... As you can see, the actual content resizes, but the blank space doesn't. This only seems to affect articles and not editing pages such as this one. Hope this helps! -- Mordynak (talk) 07:58, 13 August 2013 (PDT)

Hy Mordynak, have you tested this with the various house skins in your preferences, i have no problems, i use Win8 and Firefox, but i use in my marik house skin CSS prefs.--Doneve (talk) 08:17, 13 August 2013 (PDT)

Ahh I see, cheers Doneve. I wasn't aware there were different skins. That said however, the problem still exists in the default skin. All other skins appear to be unaffected. -- Mordynak (talk) 08:26, 13 August 2013 (PDT)

Thanks Mordynak! Are you using an ad-blocker? That's where ads go with the default 'Sarna' skin :) . You can choose the 'SarnaNoAds' skin to get the same color scheme, without any ads (and the content fits the whole width). The house skins all have no ads either. Nicjansma (talk) 08:50, 13 August 2013 (PDT)

Ahh that'll be it then, I use AdBlock Plus so that'll be why. As before, my only other complaint is the text size, but its no biggie. Again, keep up the great work! -- Mordynak (talk) 11:08, 13 August 2013 (PDT)

Yeah the text is definitely bigger, but I hope that over time folks will get used to it. I personally think it's a lot more legible and readable than the old, smaller font. You can see my tips to Doneve above for how to force a smaller font for just Sarna if you want. Nicjansma (talk) 14:55, 13 August 2013 (PDT)

Year pages

Hy Nic, when i look on the year pages, the Era ex. year box is not in center of the page, the box is floated to the left side, take a look here 3055, can you take a look on this, when its needed i send you a screen shoot.--Doneve (talk) 11:07, 17 August 2013 (PDT)

I'm unsure why it was centered before and now isn't, so I added a div text-align wrapper around the box to ensure it is. Nicjansma (talk) 07:55, 19 August 2013 (PDT)

Thanks for fix this.--Doneve (talk) 07:57, 19 August 2013 (PDT)

searching Sarna.net

I surf with Chrome and I had a rather happy accident the other day. I started typing "sarna.net" into the address bar, got half way, hit TAB and the address bar became a search bar. Cool! Is this something that you guys did or is this something I did on my system?--Grimlock (talk) 07:04, 20 August 2013 (PDT)